Is it time to Define or RE-Define the Word "BUST"?

[Yarnith]

Vinny was a journeyman, certainly a bust for me .. The small success he had with the Jets at the end of his career never really moved the needle for me .. you can call me jaded, but we had STEVE YOUNG (Hall of Fame class 2005) and could have drafted CORNELIUS BENNETT (Hall of Fame class 2004).

I'm ok with Dilfer, he had talent, just thought he knew it all in the beginning of his career .. he's even admitted to that.

Kinda my point here. Vinny was objectively BETTER than Dilfer but you are ok with him. Young took 7 years to learn how to "play da foozballs" before that he was AWFUL even in San Fran. Yet you lament his loss as if he didn't spend 2 years in Tampa putting up worse stats than Josh Rosen over his first 2 seasons. I am not sniping you just pointing out it is 100% personal bias here and not just you but really all of us.

[Walter W.]

Tom Brady. The guy lost to Eli. Twice

I know you're joking, but I have always hated the "Eli beat Brady" thing.

Eli played against Brady's defense, Brady played against a much better Giants defense. They never, ever played against each other directly. I know you know that, but I have heard a lot of know-nothings throw that around in a non-joking manner like it means something.

[Dynasty DeLorean]

Tom Brady. The guy lost to Eli. Twice

I know you're joking, but I have always hated the "Eli beat Brady" thing.

Eli played against Brady's defense, Brady played against a much better Giants defense. They never, ever played against each other directly. I know you know that, but I have heard a lot of know-nothings throw that around in a non-joking manner like it means something.

You know the Patriots defense allowed less yards per play than the Giants defense in 2007. Talk about "know-nothings", lmao

[FantasyFreak]

For me bust is a player I personally was high on and totally whiffed on. When it happens to somebody else, it's bad pick I avoided. Speaking in recent years Hakeem Butler screams out to me personally

He was actually a player I was thinking of before I even read ArrylT's list. Absolutely a bust, and saw that he got released again today. Career over.

He was a day 3 pick, though. If you are attributing people's pre-draft perception of him (which was way off) that he was going to be good, and an early pick, then ya. But the fact he was a day 3 pick, for me, it's hard to call anyone on day 3 a bust, because there should be very little expectation that a day 3 pick will ever be relevant.

[ArrylT]

Well while I was hoping more people would respond to the question and answer with the players they thought were 'busts' regardless I appreciate the responses on the thread. I do feel that the responses themselves show exactly what I was thinking and that there is no consensus on what is or is not a bust.

Does this really matter? Perhaps not.

But perhaps.

We all know what someone is referring to when they say 1st round pick, or QB1 or RB2. That context helps you in your league to make trades. IE Player X for a 1st. Or a package of assets to get a QB1. Sure there is always going to be some disagreement on the borders. CMC is a consensus RB1. Not everyone may agree on Joe Mixon or Josh Jacobs, but there is still consensus and understanding around most of these terms But apart from the obvious examples - Trent Richardson, Ja'Marcus Russell, Tony Mandarich - there is no such agreement around the term bust. Much less a consensus on what should determine qualifications.

We do not have an idea of what each owner thinks is a bust. And that is likely useful information to have. Rather it is up to each owner to try and guesstimate what each of their leaguemates consider a bust based off of snippets of conversation and analysis of their transactions.

Apart from that it would help owners when it comes time to drafting or acquiring rookies / players for their squads. A better understanding of what is or is not a bust should lead to better understanding of the "hit rates" when it comes to rookie picks of different rounds and allow for more informed decisions on when one should acquire or sell draft picks. Yes there are plenty of articles and experts who talk about this - but each has their own idea of what is / is not a bust. Different criteria for what qualifies and different methodology for how to determine.

Imagine for a moment you were learning to drive a car and different schools had different ideas on what constituted a red light or how to use your brakes.

I guess when it comes down to it, that aspect of dynasty / fantasy football will likely always remain more subjective / art form. But does it need to be? Maybe eventually we in the community will come to a better idea of what the word means, and that will lead to more understanding of each other. And that is never a bad idea. At the very least we could have sub-definitions like busted for health or off-field concerns.

But until then we can always enjoy the constant debates on why Payer X is a bust but Player Y is not, knowing that both (or neither) are from our own point of view.

Guess it is another reminder that as much as we want to believe in our own skill & talents - it is another reminder that there is just a huge amount of variables we can never control and in the end we should do our best to enjoy this hobby/game.

[ArrylT]

Odd that the pinnacle of personal achievement in an NFL career is to get a bust.

English is an amazing language.

[ArrylT]

RB

Cam Akers
Travis Etienne
Leonard Fournette BUST
Melvin Gordon
Kareem Hunt
Carlos Hyde BUST
Duke Johnson
Eddie Lacy BUST
Phillip Lindsay
Joe Mixon
Trent Richardson BUST
David Wilson BUST


WR

Tyler Boyd
Will Fuller
Dorial Green-Beckham BUST
N'Keal Harry BUST
Alshon Jeffrey BUST
Marvin Jones
Johnny Knox
Tyler Lockett
Devante Parker BUST
Jalen Raegor
Curtis Samuel
James Washington


TE

Trey Burton
Jared Cook
Tyler Eifert
Eric Ebron BUST
Evan Engram BUST
Dallas Goedert
Austin Hooper
Blake Jarwin BUST
Kyle Rudolph BUST
Austin Sefarian-Jenkins
Irv Smith Jr.
Adam Trautman

QB

Daunte Culpepper
Ryan Fitzpatrick
Jared Goff BUST
Robert Griffin III BUST
Jordan Love
Daniel Jones BUST
Josh Rosen BUST
Baker Mayfield
Marcus Mariota BUST
Ryan Tannehill
Mitch Trubisky BUST
Jameis Winston

Thanks for being the only one to answer this portion. Much appreciated. As a reward you can choose one of the following

(a) a $20 donation to the charity of your choice*

(b) a free bestball10 entry in 2022.

Send me a DM at your leisure.

* - within reason - I wont donate to things like Westboro Baptist Church.

[QB Browns]

RB

Cam Akers
Travis Etienne
Leonard Fournette
Melvin Gordon
Kareem Hunt
Carlos Hyde - BUST
Duke Johnson
Eddie Lacy
Phillip Lindsay
Joe Mixon
Trent Richardson - BUST
David Wilson

WR

Tyler Boyd
Will Fuller
Dorial Green-Beckham - BUST
N'Keal Harry - BUST
Alshon Jeffrey
Marvin Jones
Johnny Knox
Tyler Lockett
Devante Parker
Jalen Raegor
Curtis Samuel
James Washington - BUST


TE

Trey Burton
Jared Cook
Tyler Eifert
Eric Ebron - BUST
Evan Engram - BUST
Dallas Goedert
Austin Hooper
Blake Jarwin
Kyle Rudolph
Austin Sefarian-Jenkins - BUST
Irv Smith Jr.
Adam Trautman


QB

Daunte Culpepper
Ryan Fitzpatrick
Jared Goff
Robert Griffin III - BUST
Jordan Love
Daniel Jones - BUST
Josh Rosen - BUST
Baker Mayfield
Marcus Mariota - BUST
Ryan Tannehill
Mitch Trubisky - BUST
Jameis Winston

Interesting exercise. What I'm finding for myself is that I don't view careers ended by injuries as "busts" even if that's effectively what they amount to. (I also haven't been playing dynasty for a crazy long time, so some of the older players on this list I didn't know how to label.) Interesting to see players like Lacy and Fournette categorized as busts by some. I feel like this is because they flamed out in years where expectations were very high for them, but the truth is both put up a couple of very productive fantasy seasons. Tight end is for sure the most difficult for me, as being a good real life tight end doesn't necessarily make you a good fantasy tight end. Many of the TEs on this list had very high NFL draft capital, but I'm also not aware of what their dynasty draft capital was which definitely factors into how strongly I would consider them to be a bust.

[Shoreline Steamers]

I did list the players I thought were busts, just didn't quote the whole list to keep my post more condensed.

Not that I need a prize or anything like that, just clarifying

[ArrylT]

I did list the players I thought were busts, just didn't quote the whole list to keep my post more condensed.

Not that I need a prize or anything like that, just clarifying

Apologies I must have missed that. I'll give you the same option then with the caveat that the donation will be made on TNF Week I, if you choose that option.