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https://forum.dynastyleaguefootball.com/viewtopic.php?t=171303
Can't agree with you on Goff not threading any needles. This is one of the best passes I've seen this season: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Efo4chvinuEericanadian wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:25 pm I'm still not sold on Goff. He's good at identifying the open receiver, but he's not threading any needles. He has a ton of time back there, a solid run game to create effective play action and his WRs are getting schemed open. He reminds me a lot of Carr in how he's being perceived right now and Carr put up a lot of great stats right up until they fired the offensive coordinator.
Yeah, I won't argue it. Easily the two best offensive corps in the leageu.
But did it go through a needle?ImaRounder wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 10:38 pm Every td was hitting his receiver in stride where only his guy can catch the ball.
While I would not call that threading a needle, (usually a throw through traffic and into tight coverage while he went over the defenders), that's really not the focus of my point. It's a very nice pass. Carr made nice passes, too. The vast majority of Goff's completions are to wide open receivers with almost no pressure. I want to see him hold up when a defense has shut down the run game or at least getting some consistent pressure on him before including him in top five discussion.Blueboy wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 9:47 pmCan't agree with you on Goff not threading any needles. This is one of the best passes I've seen this season: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Efo4chvinuEericanadian wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:25 pm I'm still not sold on Goff. He's good at identifying the open receiver, but he's not threading any needles. He has a ton of time back there, a solid run game to create effective play action and his WRs are getting schemed open. He reminds me a lot of Carr in how he's being perceived right now and Carr put up a lot of great stats right up until they fired the offensive coordinator.
Yeah, I won't argue it. Easily the two best offensive corps in the leageu.
I just hope that, when this happens (poor stats with the run game shut down and poor protection), that people don’t come flocking saying “told you so! He isn’t great every week so he can’t be called elite!”ericanadian wrote: ↑Sat Sep 29, 2018 8:38 amWhile I would not call that threading a needle, (usually a throw through traffic and into tight coverage while he went over the defenders), that's really not the focus of my point. It's a very nice pass. Carr made nice passes, too. The vast majority of Goff's completions are to wide open receivers with almost no pressure. I want to see him hold up when a defense has shut down the run game or at least getting some consistent pressure on him before including him in top five discussion.Blueboy wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 9:47 pmCan't agree with you on Goff not threading any needles. This is one of the best passes I've seen this season: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Efo4chvinuEericanadian wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:25 pm I'm still not sold on Goff. He's good at identifying the open receiver, but he's not threading any needles. He has a ton of time back there, a solid run game to create effective play action and his WRs are getting schemed open. He reminds me a lot of Carr in how he's being perceived right now and Carr put up a lot of great stats right up until they fired the offensive coordinator.
Yeah, I won't argue it. Easily the two best offensive corps in the leageu.
That's fair, but he looked mediocre to me most of last year, so to me, the opposite is happening here. I also thought Carr was going to be bad right from the beginning, but I don't take joy from that, especially as a Raider fan. Guys with nine inch hands and/or a lot of offensive scheme changes early in their career tend to perform poorly over the long term. I've seen some indications that teams have found ways to scheme around small hands and I'm hopeful that they're successful, because Goff is a good decision maker and fits this offense well. Carr was also solid with Musgrave calling the plays and they're both fun to watch when things are moving well. That said, I'm not paying top five QB prices to make that bet at this point.Valhalla wrote: ↑Sat Sep 29, 2018 8:43 amI just hope that, when this happens (poor stats with the run game shut down and poor protection), that people don’t come flocking saying “told you so! He isn’t great every week so he can’t be called elite!”ericanadian wrote: ↑Sat Sep 29, 2018 8:38 amWhile I would not call that threading a needle, (usually a throw through traffic and into tight coverage while he went over the defenders), that's really not the focus of my point. It's a very nice pass. Carr made nice passes, too. The vast majority of Goff's completions are to wide open receivers with almost no pressure. I want to see him hold up when a defense has shut down the run game or at least getting some consistent pressure on him before including him in top five discussion.Blueboy wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 9:47 pm
Can't agree with you on Goff not threading any needles. This is one of the best passes I've seen this season: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Efo4chvinuE
Yeah, I won't argue it. Easily the two best offensive corps in the leageu.
Just realize that even the GOAT Brady looks pretty miserable at times, especially when he’s not getting his overall very good career protections. It’s about trends and how you stack up to your peers. Right now, he’s stacking up pretty well. A bad game next week won’t change that. He’ll still be stacking up quite well.
And I'm not afraid to change my opinion or admit I was wrong. However, I still do not think he is "special". But the problem with a word like that is that "special" might mean something different to you than it does to me. I am much more critical of players than I probably would be, but generally speaking - I believe there is a lack of special quarterbacks right now overall. So while it may seem like a huge knock on Goff, it is not necessarily such. Plenty of quarterbacks who are not special can perform given the right coaching, system and year. When I said this, it was last year - and to be honest, he didn't look that good last year. He looks better this year - but I still do not think he is an elite quarterback.dm1129 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 5:41 pmYou have made multiple statements in these forums about how Goff is nothing special, etc......not exactly a ringing endorsement. There was actually a lot in this game that Goff did that very few can do. When I stated Goff could be top 5 this season, it was not in any way based on one game. Goff has been playing at an extremely high level for nearly a full season of games and is still improving. His receiving corps is young and under contract. He has a young elite RB to keep opposing defenses honest who is also under contract for 6 years. Most importantly, he has a head coach who may be the best offensive mind in the game.Phaded wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 4:52 pm People are acting like I said Goff is bad. I never said any such thing. He looked great, but with that much time in the pocket lets not act like he is only one of a few who can do this. People are now throwing the top 5 suggestion out there and it has even been suggested he could end up the QB1. He very well COULD but he very well could not. Goff played a great game, but the Vikings played atrocious D. They were severely outcoached and out gameplanned. Goff took full advantage of that absolutely and played a great game but the "new QB1", "new RB1" or "new WR1" stuff is getting old. It sounds like every week someone has a hot performance. By the end of the year there will 25 top 10 guys at each position at this rate.
Cousins looked just as good - if not better, but had pressure in his face most of the night.
On another note..
It also might be time to think the Vikings are still hungover from their miracle victory. They have not won since week 1 and are likely going to lose next week too. This is not the same team - for whatever reason.
lolnathanq42 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 10:41 pmBut did it go through a needle?ImaRounder wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 10:38 pm Every td was hitting his receiver in stride where only his guy can catch the ball.
The notion that many QBs could do what Goff did on Thursday is really incorrect. To say he had only one impressive throw in the game reveals more about you than Goff. Before the game you said the Vikings had shut down the Rams last year and the offense is virtually the same so there was no reason they could not do it again. This tells me you have a cursory knowledge of the Rams offense and of Goff at best. McVay's offense is very complex. At the beginning of last season, he was only using a very limited portion of it allowing his players to adapt. Each week more of McVay's offense was implemeted and Goff was progressing both as a player as well as in his knowledge of the offense. The common belief held by many that he was mediocre last year is simply dead wrong. During the second half of the season, he was playing at a very high level, there is no way to refute this. He routinely throws into tight windows and his accuracy is excellent.Phaded wrote: ↑Sat Sep 29, 2018 10:30 amAnd I'm not afraid to change my opinion or admit I was wrong. However, I still do not think he is "special". But the problem with a word like that is that "special" might mean something different to you than it does to me. I am much more critical of players than I probably would be, but generally speaking - I believe there is a lack of special quarterbacks right now overall. So while it may seem like a huge knock on Goff, it is not necessarily such. Plenty of quarterbacks who are not special can perform given the right coaching, system and year. When I said this, it was last year - and to be honest, he didn't look that good last year. He looks better this year - but I still do not think he is an elite quarterback.dm1129 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 5:41 pmYou have made multiple statements in these forums about how Goff is nothing special, etc......not exactly a ringing endorsement. There was actually a lot in this game that Goff did that very few can do. When I stated Goff could be top 5 this season, it was not in any way based on one game. Goff has been playing at an extremely high level for nearly a full season of games and is still improving. His receiving corps is young and under contract. He has a young elite RB to keep opposing defenses honest who is also under contract for 6 years. Most importantly, he has a head coach who may be the best offensive mind in the game.Phaded wrote: ↑Fri Sep 28, 2018 4:52 pm People are acting like I said Goff is bad. I never said any such thing. He looked great, but with that much time in the pocket lets not act like he is only one of a few who can do this. People are now throwing the top 5 suggestion out there and it has even been suggested he could end up the QB1. He very well COULD but he very well could not. Goff played a great game, but the Vikings played atrocious D. They were severely outcoached and out gameplanned. Goff took full advantage of that absolutely and played a great game but the "new QB1", "new RB1" or "new WR1" stuff is getting old. It sounds like every week someone has a hot performance. By the end of the year there will 25 top 10 guys at each position at this rate.
Cousins looked just as good - if not better, but had pressure in his face most of the night.
On another note..
It also might be time to think the Vikings are still hungover from their miracle victory. They have not won since week 1 and are likely going to lose next week too. This is not the same team - for whatever reason.
Quarterback consistency is oddly enough - extremely frustrating and maddening to find (especially for these young guys), which is why I'm not ready to crown the guy yet based on his statistics. His throw in the corner of the end zone to Kupp was very impressive; but the rest of the night - nothing made me say "wow".