If JT leaves Indy…

[mild]

OK, so IF JT is healthy, even though he's walking around like an 80 year old man, he's going on PUP, and getting paid, despite being healthy. He's essentially committing fraud. So that's OK, but not paying him an extension isn't?

Faking injury and collecting pay isn't holding your ground, it's breech of contract/fraud. I get due to the CBA, hold outs aren't allowed now, and they are forced to fine players for those. Now the Colts can decide whether or not to pursue thing in terms of the fake injury, and they are choosing not to at this point, so it seems.

It's his only option to get paid the kind of long-term contract commiserate to his talent/production thus far. Prior to the last CBA, this would just have been a hold out. Would you have called him a fraudster then?

Don't hate the player. Hate the game.

Last I checked, Jonathan Taylor didn't place himself on the PUP. The Colts did. Think they'd have done that if there was a reasonable legally-arguable path that his injury wasn't football related? NFI vs. PUP is a big deal, and a big difference.

Placing him on the PUP was the Colts prerogative. JT gets the 4 game count towards his accrued season. And on and on we go...

[mild]

OK, but would another ankle surgery make teams less/more prone to give him a big deal next year? Do you really think he'd have surgery he doesn't need to get further PUP time? That seems drastic. I suppose it's possible, but if you think he'd go to that length, it's not hard to see a grievance filed by Irsay for the money he pays JT this season. If what Murph is saying is true, and Irsay is doing things to make a point, you'd have to imagine if JT tries to essentially scam them out of pay checks this year, while accruing a season, this will get a whole lot uglier.

You think teams would be put off by a cleanup ankle surgery that happens in August/September 2023 for a players potential FA period in May/June 2024? Ooooook then.

LeVeon got a great contract after his hold out with the Steelers. The best contract of his whole career, in fact.

Over the last 6 years, JT has had more football touches than Derrick Henry. Him taking a year off in advance of his next potential contract earning window is pretty smart, from a body-management position. It's not like he has anything else to prove, talent-or-production wise.

Cameron - for sure, Colts could just tag him, and drag this whole mess out again in 2024. It would probably follow a similar path, except he wouldn't even report for Training Camp because he wouldn't be under contract. (See: Jacobs)

JT appears done playing for the Colts. Whatever has been said behind closed doors / on busses has clearly soured him on the horseshoe. This tracks with what we know of former players who have played in Indy. As long as he's still wearing a Colts uniform: don't expect much production out of JT imo.

[FantasyFreak]

OK, so IF JT is healthy, even though he's walking around like an 80 year old man, he's going on PUP, and getting paid, despite being healthy. He's essentially committing fraud. So that's OK, but not paying him an extension isn't?

Faking injury and collecting pay isn't holding your ground, it's breech of contract/fraud. I get due to the CBA, hold outs aren't allowed now, and they are forced to fine players for those. Now the Colts can decide whether or not to pursue thing in terms of the fake injury, and they are choosing not to at this point, so it seems.

It's his only option to get paid the kind of long-term contract commiserate to his talent/production thus far. Prior to the last CBA, this would just have been a hold out. Would you have called him a fraudster then?

Don't hate the player. Hate the game.

Last I checked, Jonathan Taylor didn't place himself on the PUP. The Colts did. Think they'd have done that if there was a reasonable legally-arguable path that his injury wasn't football related? NFI vs. PUP is a big deal, and a big difference.

Placing him on the PUP was the Colts prerogative. JT gets the 4 game count towards his accrued season. And on and on we go...

Right, that's my point from before that it's an assumption that he's 100 percent healthy. Regardless of what you are saying, he is in fact, committing breech of contract, by faking injury, IF he is. It's going against what was agreed upon in the CBA. People here are suggesting he's doing it, I just pointing out what it is, if he's doing it. His injury, that is football related, may still be an injury. If he doesn't have an injury, and is deemed healthy by the team doctors, who perform a physical, wouldn't they have an issue?

You could use the same logic you just used. Don't hate the GM/owner, hate the game. They aren't doing anything wrong by not extending a player. All teams have certain plans and ways to build teams, and if not extending a RB after a down year with an injury, they are free to do so, and that doesn't make them bad, in and of itself.

JT is free to do what he wants to try and ensure his future earnings, my only point is, it is fraud, IF, he's faking injury and getting paid, and the team may have recourse to challenge him on it, and may, if the owner is as vindictive as some say. If the team knows he's healthy and decide to place him on PUP and pay him when they don't have to, that seems mighty nice of them, for a team with vindication in mind on this player. Something doesn't add up.

How can people be so sure JT is 100 percent? Don't team doctors have to evaluate players injuries etc? Surely MRI's would be involved etc. to determine things, if there were some conflict on whether he's really hurt or not. OR, perhaps the team is simply giving him the benefit of the doubt? That would seem strange. Doesn't make sense to me that it's just a player's word on the fact they are hurt or not, surely there is some higher standard than that?

[Tvols]

A year off with less wear and tear still has an effect. He is a year older and this is just lost production he will never get back regardless of what happens. Time stops for no one or the pup. Hopefully something fruitful happens and ends this stupid mess for both sides.

[mild]

A year off with less wear and tear still has an effect. He is a year older and this is just lost production he will never get back regardless of what happens. Time stops for no one or the pup. Hopefully something fruitful happens and ends this stupid mess for both sides.

Lost production!?

This dude has put up 4600 scrimmage yards in 3 years of NFL play.

And they still won't pay him a long term deal.

If nobody cares about league-leading production as it pertains to getting long-term job security, then why should JT?

[mild]

You could use the same logic you just used. Don't hate the GM/owner, hate the game. They aren't doing anything wrong by not extending a player. All teams have certain plans and ways to build teams, and if not extending a RB after a down year with an injury, they are free to do so, and that doesn't make them bad, in and of itself.

...

How can people be so sure JT is 100 percent? Don't team doctors have to evaluate players injuries etc? Surely MRI's would be involved etc. to determine things, if there were some conflict on whether he's really hurt or not. OR, perhaps the team is simply giving him the benefit of the doubt? That would seem strange. Doesn't make sense to me that it's just a player's word on the fact they are hurt or not, surely there is some higher standard than that?

I don't hate the GM/owner. I think he's a moron, but there's no hate here. I understand that they don't want to pay their star RB. I understand that he wants a long term deal commiserate with his talent/production, and will use every avenue that he has to get it.

We don't hate the players. We hate the game.

The team placed him on PUP. So, they evaluated him medically, and decided the PUP was the best course of action. JT didn't put himself there.

Now: was this done by the team to take the heat off of the constant training camp report-hoopla going on here, and give them a reason to not have him standing on the sideline in plain clothes every day, not taking snaps? That's my guess. Hilarious, if so: because this was the best leverage JT could gain as a player still under contract.

Because it's either that - or he really does have an injury that medically qualifies him for the PUP. Most medical experts are aligned: if it's still the ankle, then it should be healed by now.

Who knows what's really going on medically - but Schefter/Rapoport are all in alignment: JT is done playing for the Colts, and the relationship is beyond repair. That's all I need to know, at this point.

[Kurt G.O.A.T.]

The colts made some kicker the highest paid kicker in the league. Yet wouldn't pay their best player because of some league trend. Now their rookie franchise qb has doo doo next to him at rb and has to carry the load himself, which he is incapable is doing right now.

Great team building colts.

[Ice]

OK, but would another ankle surgery make teams less/more prone to give him a big deal next year? Do you really think he'd have surgery he doesn't need to get further PUP time? That seems drastic. I suppose it's possible, but if you think he'd go to that length, it's not hard to see a grievance filed by Irsay for the money he pays JT this season. If what Murph is saying is true, and Irsay is doing things to make a point, you'd have to imagine if JT tries to essentially scam them out of pay checks this year, while accruing a season, this will get a whole lot uglier.

LeVeon got a great contract after his hold out with the Steelers. The best contract of his whole career, in fact.

That is so not the real story.

Pretty sure he turned down a $70 million dollar contract and lost around 14,500,00.00 by sitting out a season.

He did get $8,000,000 signing bonus with Jets but no way around the fact he gave up Millions.

Bell didn't help the RB market at all and a case could be made he had a hand in hurting the RB market overall. He only played one full season with Jets then 2 teams in 2020 and 2 teams in 2021.

He was a complete Bust once he left the Steelers. (That year off sure didn't help Bell's production) 789 rushing yards in 2019, 656 rushing yards in 2020, and 202 rushing yards in 2021.

People can hate the Colts owner all they want which is just fine as fans but I am quite sure the GM wants no part in giving a disgruntled player who wasn't great last year and is still injured this year a new deal when he is under contract. He isn't entitled to just get a deal because he doesn't like the contract he signed. It would be good for him but he is injured. Saying he is not injured without any evidence falls under the category of a mad fan screaming into the abyss.

BTW if he really is healthy as some believe we can add massive loser to the list of JT's accomplishments and NFL teams won't be lining up to pay for a massive character flaw.

Still remember when people were going crazy around here when someone traded him for Pollard and 1st I think as compensation? Thought that was a decent trade then and it proved to be a great trade so far.

[mild]

OK, but would another ankle surgery make teams less/more prone to give him a big deal next year? Do you really think he'd have surgery he doesn't need to get further PUP time? That seems drastic. I suppose it's possible, but if you think he'd go to that length, it's not hard to see a grievance filed by Irsay for the money he pays JT this season. If what Murph is saying is true, and Irsay is doing things to make a point, you'd have to imagine if JT tries to essentially scam them out of pay checks this year, while accruing a season, this will get a whole lot uglier.

LeVeon got a great contract after his hold out with the Steelers. The best contract of his whole career, in fact.

That is so not the real story.

Pretty sure he turned down a $70 million dollar contract and lost around 14,500,00.00 by sitting out a season.

He did get $8,000,000 signing bonus but no way around the fact he gave up Millions.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/tampa-bay-b ... ell-12329/

Sure looks like the real story to me pal.

Sorry to call BS on your 70 million figure too, but hey, gotta call a spade a spade:

Pittsburgh’s final offer, Bell says, fell short: five years, $70 million—$14 million per, with the only fully guaranteed money being a $10 million signing bonus. (The Steelers have a policy of not offering future guarantees in veteran deals.)

Jets gave him $27 mil. fully garunteed the very next offseason after his hold out.

So - not only did he get an actual tangible contract from the Jets, with actual garunteed money in it long term...

He also *actually* got paid that contract. Rather than your pie in the sky one that he turned down (for a reason).

Ergo:

The Jets gave Leveon Bell the best contract of his career after he withheld his services to the Steelers over a contract dispute.

It really can't be more irrefutably cut-and-dry than that, Ice from Texas.

[Ice]

LeVeon got a great contract after his hold out with the Steelers. The best contract of his whole career, in fact.

That is so not the real story.

Pretty sure he turned down a $70 million dollar contract and lost around 14,500,00.00 by sitting out a season.

He did get $8,000,000 signing bonus but no way around the fact he gave up Millions.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/tampa-bay-b ... ell-12329/

Sure looks like the real story to me pal.

Sorry to call BS on your 70 million figure too, but hey, gotta call a spade a spade:

Pittsburgh’s final offer, Bell says, fell short: five years, $70 million—$14 million per, with the only fully guaranteed money being a $10 million signing bonus. (The Steelers have a policy of not offering future guarantees in veteran deals.)

Jets gave him $27 mil. fully garunteed the very next offseason after his hold out.

So - not only did he get an actual tangible contract from the Jets, with actual garunteed money in it long term...

He also *actually* got paid that contract. Rather than your pie in the sky one that he turned down (for a reason).

Ergo:

The Jets gave Leveon Bell the best contract of his career after he withheld his services to the Steelers over a contract dispute.

It really can't be more irrefutably cut-and-dry than that, Ice from Texas.

Never said it wasn't the best contract he signed.

I did say it wasn't the real story. I almost feel sorry for you and your complete lack of context. Stop playing checkers in a chess world for once.

And for the record, I am not your pal and Texas is great state.

[mild]

Never said it wasn't the best contract he signed.

I did say it wasn't the real story. I almost feel sorry for you and your complete lack of context. Stop playing checkers in a chess world for once.

And for the record, I am not your pal and Texas is great state.

Looooool.

Look, my fine friend Ice from the great state of Texas. Here's the thing: play it out. Play out what literally happened in his career.

He was toast when he put a Jets uniform on. (Is there any chance you think he knew this was his only chance to lock in garunteed money? Food for thought my friend...)

For the pleasure? He still collected that 8 million signing bonus + 27 million garunteed.

If he'd signed the Pittsburgh deal, and plays like that? They they probably do the exact same thing we saw happen to Zeke this year. And then he collects 10 million guaranteed + whatever the Year 1 salary was (allegedly somewhere between 10 and 15 mil).

"You know... now that I think about it... mild has a good point here."

Thanks Ice. You're welcome my friend.

It's always about the guaranteed money my pal. There is a reason he turned Pittsburgh down. Think it through. Have a cigarette. Relax a little. Take a break from the keyboard. Stop to smell the roses.

We wish JT and his registered medical professionals all of the luck in the world in the PUP clearance battles to come.

[Tvols]

A year off with less wear and tear still has an effect. He is a year older and this is just lost production he will never get back regardless of what happens. Time stops for no one or the pup. Hopefully something fruitful happens and ends this stupid mess for both sides.

Lost production!?

This dude has put up 4600 scrimmage yards in 3 years of NFL play.

And they still won't pay him a long term deal.

If nobody cares about league-leading production as it pertains to getting long-term job security, then why should JT?

My point being is this helps no one and certainly not JT . He could of what we know or he has done be the next bell if there is any truth to the ankle still being an issue the guy does have miles on him and wasting a year doesn’t aid that regardless and for the record I don’t think he is as washed up as bell but who really knows for now

[FantasyFreak]

A year off with less wear and tear still has an effect. He is a year older and this is just lost production he will never get back regardless of what happens. Time stops for no one or the pup. Hopefully something fruitful happens and ends this stupid mess for both sides.

Lost production!?

This dude has put up 4600 scrimmage yards in 3 years of NFL play.

And they still won't pay him a long term deal.

If nobody cares about league-leading production as it pertains to getting long-term job security, then why should JT?

My point being is this helps no one and certainly not JT . He could of what we know or he has done be the next bell if there is any truth to the ankle still being an issue the guy does have miles on him and wasting a year doesn’t aid that regardless and for the record I don’t think he is as washed up as bell but who really knows for now

I think JT gets more money next year than he would this year, but if he doesn't play a down this year, I doubt he gets the deal he's looking for next year. Maybe a deal with 2 years of guarantees, maybe 1. Sanders got 13 million in guarantees after nearly 1300 rushing yards and 11 TD's on the ground. I don't see a whole lot more than that, though that's still better than 4 million that he makes this year. Jacobs, Barkley, and a few others good/decent backs potentially FA's next year too.

Had JT had his big year last year, and been healthy, I think he gets paid. His timing was bad. Going into FA with a year missed, following a down year with an injury, will limit how much teams are willing to pay him, but he'll likely still get more money than he's making this year, and he obviously doesn't want to risk another injury that would jeopardize that. If he doesn't play this year, he's likely throwing away any shot at a big time deal, but he's also minimizing his risk, and will still pocket a decent sum in FA, just not that top tier money.

[Ice]

Never said it wasn't the best contract he signed.

I did say it wasn't the real story. I almost feel sorry for you and your complete lack of context. Stop playing checkers in a chess world for once.

And for the record, I am not your pal and Texas is great state.

Looooool.

Look, my fine friend Ice from the great state of Texas. Here's the thing: play it out. Play out what literally happened in his career.

He was toast when he put a Jets uniform on. (Is there any chance you think he knew this was his only chance to lock in garunteed money? Food for thought my friend...)

For the pleasure? He still collected that 8 million signing bonus + 27 million garunteed.

If he'd signed the Pittsburgh deal, and plays like that? They they probably do the exact same thing we saw happen to Zeke this year. And then he collects 10 million guaranteed + whatever the Year 1 salary was (allegedly somewhere between 10 and 15 mil).

"You know... now that I think about it... mild has a good point here."

Thanks Ice. You're welcome my friend.

It's always about the guaranteed money my pal. There is a reason he turned Pittsburgh down. Think it through. Have a cigarette. Relax a little. Take a break from the keyboard. Stop to smell the roses.

We wish JT and his registered medical professionals all of the luck in the world in the PUP clearance battles to come.

Your logic is so amazingly flawed you remind me of VIKI the robot. I am sure you don’t get it but obviously you must assume the Colts are brilliant and can see around corners like you for not extending a washed player.

Mild, you certainly are a legend in your own mind

.

[Lumps]

Apparently, the Packers tried to trade for JT. What a messy relationship of management with Rodgers. They want to give Love ALL the weapons, but not the HOF QB.