Reggie Bush

[Dynasty DeLorean]

Hill's YPC: 5.0

Hyde's YPC: 4.0

Bush's YPC: 3.9

[DLFiend]

Injured.

[Dynasty DeLorean]

Reggie Bush's rookie year YPC: 3.6
Carlos Hyde's rookie year YPC: 4.0

[DLFiend]

I'm not comparing their values, their styles, or their rookie year.

I said that Bush's arrival caps Hyde's and that Hyde isn't very good in the first place. Nothing you've said really refutes that.

Oh, and if you include what Bush did in the playoffs, he had the same YPC as Hyde. On a bum ankle.

So there's that.

[mullmania]

This doesn't mean anything but it probably makes more sense to compare Hyde to Gore last year.

Gore 4.3, 10.1

Hyde 4.0, 5.7

[Dynasty DeLorean]

I said that Bush's arrival caps Hyde's and that Hyde isn't very good in the first place. Nothing you've said really refutes that.

How am I supposed to refute a made-up scenario by you that hasn't even happened yet. Maybe Bush gets a lot of work, maybe he doesn't. You think Hyde sucks, wonderful. We all understood that pages ago. But you don't stop there, you just can't help yourself from spewing a bunch of nonsense about how he is a plodder (he has the same speed as Hill and Lacy), he can't catch (no evidence to support that, he catches 75% of his targets), among your gushings about how Bush is more talented than Hyde which is pointless as even you seem to agree he's not lead back material. 15+ touches and goalline work for Hyde is a more than reasonable scenario for him in my opinion even with Bush there, so I really don't see the big deal of Bush's signing. You think differently and that's your right, but where you lose everyone is when you start making stuff up to justify your opinion.

[DLFiend]

15 touches don't = RB1 status. Like I said, Bush caps his ceiling.

[Cammiecoke]

Hill's YPC: 5.0

Hyde's YPC: 4.0


Hill also has the higher draft pedigree and superior vision.

He was drafted 2 spots ahead of him so I don't understand how that is a big knock on Hyde. While your superior vision is completely subjective. Also 4ypc isn't terrible and it was a very limited sample size and he was brought in on short yardage situations.

I like Hill and I'm not arguing against Hill. I disagreeing that they aren't comparable and you haven't addressed anything I have brought up. I'm not buying Bush as a productive RB2 fill in. I would rather spend a 2nd on rookie RB. Hyde could be the next Monte Ball and I still wouldn't be buying Bush in the 49ers offense. I also don't believe I could get a 2nd for Bush in any of my dynasties pre-draft. Maybe in week 10 in Bush is a RB2 and a contender has hole at RB possibly but then they know what they are trading for.



The game flow will not drastically change the Niners into the Detroit type offense that Bush flourished in that led or was near the top in Pass Attempts NFL. The are a run heavy team that has even talked about using more of the zone read concepts (a style that Hyde has flourished in). The 49ers don't pass to RBs and we have no clue how the actually plan to use Bush. They were behind last year in a majority of games and it didn't translate into the type of offense that your are arbitrarily attributing to them next season. They play in the NFC West and it is a smash-mouth division. I give you they have had a terrible off season but its not over they still have the draft and the rest of free agency.

Edit
Also you cap of 15 touches has no basis in reality. Several back in timeshares get more than that. If Hyde is successful he will certainly have more than a 15 touch cap.

How are we suppose to refute your opinion? That is your purgative on Hyde. I'm refuting that Hyde and Hill aren't "comparable" and that Bush will be a RB2, worth a rookie 2nd rounder, and a cap to Hyde's value.

[Swampdonkey17]

Im blown away that a reggie bush thread this stage in his career is 67 posts long...

[Cammiecoke]

He is the Kim Kardashian of RBs. Alot of fuss about nothing.

To be fair its morphed into a debate of his affect on Hyde.

[DJB]

Hill's YPC: 5.0

Hyde's YPC: 4.0


Hill also has the higher draft pedigree and superior vision.

So you use Hyde's YPC as a determining factor here? Come one. Hyde was used in a ton of short yardage goal line situations which would limit his YPC where as Hill was used to carry the load.

Hyde was ranked 8th for all RB's in yards after contact per attempt. I can't find Hills at the moment but it is still notable.

[iCantStop]

It's BS to say his YPC "should be higher" because he had a lot of short yardage or goal line work. Many -not all- RBs get used around the goal line and in short yardage (Which, I'd you're in the middle of the field on 2nd-and-2, doesn't mean anything. You can gain more than 4 yards.), and we don't claim that their YPC is poor because of that.

I'm not knocking Hyde, I think he's talented, but Bush will limit him from being a workhorse. I just think it's silly to give excuses for his YPC, which isn't even that poor.

[DJB]

So then why do you think it's an excuse? It's not! Hyde had a solid YPC, but anyone who watches the Niners this year knows that Hyde was put in many obvious running situations and short yardage situations which would limit his YPC.

[iCantStop]

So then why do you think it's an excuse? It's not! Hyde had a solid YPC, but anyone who watches the Niners this year knows that Hyde was put in many obvious running situations and short yardage situations which would limit his YPC.

Please forgive me for comparing Hyde with AP, but:

AP was in rushing 'situations' every time he was on the field! Haha. He played against stacked boxes on every rush, and he's averaged from 4.5-6 YPC over his career.

Here's another way to look at it: Let's assume Hyde remains the Thunder back, his YPC should stay the same, because he's being used in short-yardage situations, thus limiting his YPC. Let's also assume Hyde gets 15 carries a game. You're looking at 60 yards a game and hoping for a TD. That's not my cup of tea.

[Dynasty DeLorean]

I almost fell out of my chair when you started comparing him to AP.

Anyway some interesting stats.

23% of Carlos Hydes carries were in the redzone where he averaged 3.2 YPC, the rest he averaged 4.3 YPC.

11% of Frank Gores carries were in the redzone, where he averaged 2.3 YPC, the rest he averaged 4.6 YPC.

Given that Carlos Hyde was continually put in obvious run and short yardage situations outside of the redzone as well, you could make the argument (but probably not prove) that he played just as well as Frank Gore last season. I don't know what a good redzone YPC is but i'm willing to bet that is a good one. Some other examples I looked up are Eddie Lacy (2.2 YPC), DeMarco Murray (2.6 YPC), Le'Veon Bell (3.2 YPC), Jamaal Charles (3.8 YPC)