Jameson Williams Thread

[FantasyFreak]

I guess you could look at this as a negative. Maybe they wish he was further ahead. Either way, it sounds like he's going to eventually get a chance to sink or swim.

There doesn't seen to be any fight in Williams. He's just going through the motions now and collecting his checks. I wish there was more dog in him that wants to be better and show out. Just doesn't match the talent at all.

This is just a fascinating take from someone who I assume isn't at the facility daily...

You can say his hands stink, and that the gambling thing was dumb, and that WRs who ultimately succeed almost always have put up big stats by this point in their careers (even though his is a unique case), but guys that "don't have any fight in them" don't block like that or play the exact the role that the coaching staff asked for in their first game action after not being allowed any team contact for a month.

In my opinion, if you can read that Campbell quote in a negative context, then you already had your mind made up...

How many leagues do you have him in? I moved off him, too much smoke for me, since the draft. I think if you can't take an overall look at everything that's happened since the draft and not have concern about maturity, attitude and commitment/effort, you're putting blinders on.

[YouMightDieTryin]

There doesn't seen to be any fight in Williams. He's just going through the motions now and collecting his checks. I wish there was more dog in him that wants to be better and show out. Just doesn't match the talent at all.

This is just a fascinating take from someone who I assume isn't at the facility daily...

You can say his hands stink, and that the gambling thing was dumb, and that WRs who ultimately succeed almost always have put up big stats by this point in their careers (even though his is a unique case), but guys that "don't have any fight in them" don't block like that or play the exact the role that the coaching staff asked for in their first game action after not being allowed any team contact for a month.

In my opinion, if you can read that Campbell quote in a negative context, then you already had your mind made up...

How many leagues do you have him in? I moved off him, too much smoke for me, since the draft. I think if you can't take an overall look at everything that's happened since the draft and not have concern about maturity, attitude and commitment/effort, you're putting blinders on.

I still roster* him and I have those exact concerns. Difference is I'm not willing to admit defeat for a 3rd or random 2nd. The talent is too good to trade, but he's setting his feet deep in concrete in DET it seems.

[FantasyFreak]

This is just a fascinating take from someone who I assume isn't at the facility daily...

You can say his hands stink, and that the gambling thing was dumb, and that WRs who ultimately succeed almost always have put up big stats by this point in their careers (even though his is a unique case), but guys that "don't have any fight in them" don't block like that or play the exact the role that the coaching staff asked for in their first game action after not being allowed any team contact for a month.

In my opinion, if you can read that Campbell quote in a negative context, then you already had your mind made up...

How many leagues do you have him in? I moved off him, too much smoke for me, since the draft. I think if you can't take an overall look at everything that's happened since the draft and not have concern about maturity, attitude and commitment/effort, you're putting blinders on.

I still roster* him and I have those exact concerns. Difference is I'm not willing to admit defeat for a 3rd or random 2nd. The talent is too good to trade, but he's setting his feet deep in concrete in DET it seems.

Agreed. I moved off him in a package to get Chase. I think it might be worth trying to package him, to upgrade, rather than a 1 for 1, for a non premium pick. I'd hold over a 2nd in a 1 QB league. Hope he makes a few big plays, and explore trades at that point, perhaps.

[BigJoeWall72]

There doesn't seen to be any fight in Williams. He's just going through the motions now and collecting his checks. I wish there was more dog in him that wants to be better and show out. Just doesn't match the talent at all.

This is just a fascinating take from someone who I assume isn't at the facility daily...

You can say his hands stink, and that the gambling thing was dumb, and that WRs who ultimately succeed almost always have put up big stats by this point in their careers (even though his is a unique case), but guys that "don't have any fight in them" don't block like that or play the exact the role that the coaching staff asked for in their first game action after not being allowed any team contact for a month.

In my opinion, if you can read that Campbell quote in a negative context, then you already had your mind made up...

How many leagues do you have him in? I moved off him, too much smoke for me, since the draft. I think if you can't take an overall look at everything that's happened since the draft and not have concern about maturity, attitude and commitment/effort, you're putting blinders on.

I've got him in 1-of-6, but that's not really relevant. I stated the reasons that I could totally understand wanting to trade away Jamo in my post. I just don't think that him "not having any fight in him" is a reasonable thing to be concerned about.

I have a general question for you, or anyone else, though: what is "the smoke since the draft"?
He came back on schedule from the ACL injury to play a limited snap count in six games, had/has some drop problems, got suspended for the gambling (which it sounds like the NFL or Lions didn't do a great job of explaining this since the rules have already been changed), then had the injury in camp. Not exactly a great timeline, but all very straightforward things. And things I could understand making you uneasy and wanting to make a trade. But I'm genuinely curious what the mysterious things are - maybe I'm missing something?

[Dynasty DeLorean]

This is just a fascinating take from someone who I assume isn't at the facility daily...

You can say his hands stink, and that the gambling thing was dumb, and that WRs who ultimately succeed almost always have put up big stats by this point in their careers (even though his is a unique case), but guys that "don't have any fight in them" don't block like that or play the exact the role that the coaching staff asked for in their first game action after not being allowed any team contact for a month.

In my opinion, if you can read that Campbell quote in a negative context, then you already had your mind made up...

How many leagues do you have him in? I moved off him, too much smoke for me, since the draft. I think if you can't take an overall look at everything that's happened since the draft and not have concern about maturity, attitude and commitment/effort, you're putting blinders on.

I've got him in 1-of-6, but that's not really relevant. I stated the reasons that I could totally understand wanting to trade away Jamo in my post. I just don't think that him "not having any fight in him" is a reasonable thing to be concerned about.

I have a general question for you, or anyone else, though: what is "the smoke since the draft"?
He came back on schedule from the ACL injury to play a limited snap count in six games, had/has some drop problems, got suspended for the gambling (which it sounds like the NFL or Lions didn't do a great job of explaining this since the rules have already been changed), then had the injury in camp. Not exactly a great timeline, but all very straightforward things. And things I could understand making you uneasy and wanting to make a trade. But I'm genuinely curious what the mysterious things are - maybe I'm missing something?

I don’t remember the exact quote but his coach essentially called him a bum this offseason.

[wickerkat1212]

What's tricky is that if you DID draft him you probably paid a first. So, at this point, are you going to get that? No way in hell. And yet, IDK if I'd take a second. I'm holding and praying. Too many unknowns here and we've seen guys struggle and then land somewhere else and do well. I'm holding for now unless I can trade him for something better. I was trying to move him + 2nd for LaPorta but that didn't work LOL. You never know how people see him. It's like Pitts. I was a believer, but then the right trades came along and I moved him.

[fleaflickerchamp]

He also really has an uphill battle carving his place in this lineup. ARSB and Laporta are established, Monty and Gibbs are going to keep getting carries, and even Reynolds has had a very productive year. Goff is a good QB but not going to be able to feed 5 mouths and JW is the odd man out.

[Cameron Giles]

He also really has an uphill battle carving his place in this lineup. ARSB and Laporta are established, Monty and Gibbs are going to keep getting carries, and even Reynolds has had a very productive year. Goff is a good QB but not going to be able to feed 5 mouths and JW is the odd man out.

Josh Reynolds this season is averaging 18.2 Y/R and has four games of 60 yards/receiving or more. Reynolds is effectively what Williams' role in this offense would be. The opportunity and role is there, but Williams has just not proven to be reliable for whatever reason and keeps having setback after setback.

I actually wonder if Detroit will look at adding a WR at the trade deadline if they're not seeing the signs they want to out of Williams. Like could you imagine this offense with say, a Marquise Brown for example.

Either way, Williams needs to show some urgency here. Detroit I think should really look at maximizing this window. They have a very good team.

[Jigga94]

He also really has an uphill battle carving his place in this lineup. ARSB and Laporta are established, Monty and Gibbs are going to keep getting carries, and even Reynolds has had a very productive year. Goff is a good QB but not going to be able to feed 5 mouths and JW is the odd man out.

Yup. The argument last year was that ARSB and Jamo could coexist. They had a strong running game already. But add in Laporta and now Reynolds is playing at a high level and I don't see enough to go around.

If Jamo had Reynolds numbers, he'd be a top 15 dynasty WR

4/80
5/66/2
3/69
4/76/1

I suppose the hope is Jamo moves into the Reynolds role and they let him hit FA next year, but that still leaves the run game, ARSB and Laporta ahead of him

[oneson9192]

Can someone who watched the game comment on how Jameson Williams looked?

The stat line is absolutely brutal of course (0 catches on 6 targets). On the bright side, those 6 targets were 2nd most among Lions' WRs and as many as all non-ARSB WRs got combined. He played only 33/75 snaps, meaning he still has never played >50% snaps in an NFL game.

If Jameson Williams can't contribute in a game where they trail by multiple scores from the jump and Goff throws 53 passes, will he ever? I'd love to put on rose-colored glasses (see sig) and say "Goff is to blame, snap counts will rise, production is coming". But that feels disingenuous at this point.

[killer_of_giants]

If Jameson Williams can't contribute in a game where they trail by multiple scores from the jump and Goff throws 53 passes, will he ever? I'd love to put on rose-colored glasses (see sig) and say "Goff is to blame, snap counts will rise, production is coming". But that feels disingenuous at this point.

i'm not a big believer, and i haven't watched much of the game yesterday, but the whole offense wasn't ticking and goff was under heavy pressure for what i've seen. this isn't the game that worries me about williams.

[Anteaters]

I watched most of the first half the game (our local station switched games after halftime) and honestly don't remember anything about Jameson. My attention wasn't solely on the game, but from my vantage it was as if he didn't play.

It's true Goff was under incredible pressure the entire first half. That's what stood out most to me about the game, even above how good Baltimore's offense looked. Goff played as well as could be expected under that non-stop pressure, but he didn't stand a chance at leading the Lions to a win.

[Cameron Giles]

If you own him, this is already what you should've accepted will happen. It's going to be a lot of extreme ups and downs.

That said, I agree that a game like this doesn't really say a ton about him. The Lions just looked clueless overall. A game like this isn't a great script for a player like Williams, who's still finding his footing.

[wickerkat1212]

If you own him, this is already what you should've accepted will happen. It's going to be a lot of extreme ups and downs.

That said, I agree that a game like this doesn't really say a ton about him. The Lions just looked clueless overall. A game like this isn't a great script for a player like Williams, who's still finding his footing.

Yep, that's about where I stand.

[FantasyFreak]

What's tricky is that if you DID draft him you probably paid a first. So, at this point, are you going to get that? No way in hell. And yet, IDK if I'd take a second. I'm holding and praying. Too many unknowns here and we've seen guys struggle and then land somewhere else and do well. I'm holding for now unless I can trade him for something better. I was trying to move him + 2nd for LaPorta but that didn't work LOL. You never know how people see him. It's like Pitts. I was a believer, but then the right trades came along and I moved him.

Seems like this could be sunken cost fallacy. Your best bet is likely packaging, I like that strategy, I'd keep trying to package him up. His career arc isn't looking good, he has all the makings of a bust.