Lamar Jackson is the best QB in the NFL & Fantasy

[Ice]

There is something for everyone

The reality is Hurts has 110 Million guaranteed today with more on the way and he just received over 23 million in a signing bonus. His average salary in now 51 million making him the highest paid QB in history.

Lamar will get 32 million this season and his average over the last two years will be around 27.5 Million if he doesn't sign a new deal.

We can talk lost money or lost PV of money but one thing, Hurts is a 1.5 years younger or 2 seasons younger and will probably have a better chance downstream for a another bite of the apple.

Lamar could have been ahead of him in that race for the next contract but he isn't.

Maybe some team pays him more but today Lamar looks like he is trending down and may end up closer to D. Jones money which averages around 37.5 million over the contract.

Hard to say but he really needs an agent IMO or he will continue to get passed by the next wave of studs up for extensions.

Lamar seems to be taking a Risk Averse mindset to an entirely new level.

[ericanadian]

Hurts and Murray both got signing bonuses, as would every qb that signs a big contract. Cap numbers and actual money paid are two separate entities.

Well no sh-t Sherlock!

Explain to me how Lamar has lost money on a signing bonus when he's yet to sign?

I would argue that at worst it's "still pending" and more likely it will exceed any signing bonus he would have gotten prior, because QB contracts continue to move upwards with each contract signed. We currently live in the post-Hurts contract reality, and we move ever closer to the post-Burrow and post-Herbert realities.

Perhaps we will even get to the "Lamar Jackson on a long-term contract with a SIGNING BONUS" reality.

Your premise was that he had lost money by playing on the 5th year. He hasn't. Those years are incorporated into any extension anyway, he was always going to play on it one way or another. Now you've half-heartedly moved the goalposts to signing bonuses. He's yet to sign. We all know this. Well observed.

Your premise is demonstrably false. ONE MORE TIME for the people up the back:

As ever, dunking on Lamar whilst the negotiations are still ongoing will be a fruitless endeavour. Likewise for anyone saying he made the correct decision. We just don't know yet.

Actually, the guys that signed after year three never had their fifth year options exercised. They played four years and then the extension kicked in.

[ericanadian]

All the numbers are from last year.

https://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/platf ... anteed-mon

Was always under the impression he had turned down this offer in the spring, but you’re right that they are claiming it was offered in September. Would’ve been a fair deal to me last year, when he still had the fifth year option to play out. I wonder what the actual numbers being exchanged are at by this point.

Eric, the drum of Lamar turned down a fair offer is just know resonating? We have the same "real" numbers for each offer.

It makes a difference when it was offered as the baseline for the contracts goes up every year. $175M offered last year is fair. Offered this year it is below market. It’s the same reason Hurts got $179M in guarantees a year after Kyler got $161M in guarantees and two years after Josh Allen got around $150M in guarantees. Those numbers have nothing to do with which of the three is the best player and everything to do with when the players were signed. The cap goes up every year (is up by nearly 13% this year and more than that last year) the guys at the bottom don’t make much more (min salary goes up $45K each year, which was just over 6% last year) which leaves more for the guys at the top.

[mild]

You're the one that said Hurts and Murray are still playing on their rookie contracts. Did their signing bonuses skip your mind?

Seems like you're actually being serious about this. Explain to me how Lamar Jackson has cost himself money on his forthcoming signing bonus? It sounds like you know what the figure is going to be. We're all ears.

Apparently I need to highlight the word extension in the phrase "contract extension" for you.

Actually, the guys that signed after year three never had their fifth year options exercised. They played four years and then the extension kicked in.

Jalen Hurts just signed a 5 year contract that has him under team control for 6 seasons, team control until 2029. This year - 2023 - was set to be the final year of his rookie deal. So the rookie contract was extended. Yes?

Kyler Murray, drafted in 2019, signed a 5 year contract last year (in 2022, so after his third season, for those keeping track) that has him under team control until 2029. Once again, that's a 5 year contract extension somehow adding 7 years of team control. Interesting, isn't it?

We can accept as fact that Lamar was never going to be extended after his 3rd season, given that he is still seeking his extension in what will soon be his 6th season. The idea that he has cost himself money because of a failure to do this can therefore be left at the door, as it was never a realistic option between the two parties.

If anything, we can rightly say that if Lamar -had- signed after his 3rd season (so prior to the 2021 season) that he would have been locked in to an extension at a far lower average-per-year salary than what is now on the table thanks to the Hurts / Rodgers / Watson contracts.

[Kurt G.O.A.T.]

You're the one that said Hurts and Murray are still playing on their rookie contracts. Did their signing bonuses skip your mind?

Seems like you're actually being serious about this. Explain to me how Lamar Jackson has cost himself money on his forthcoming signing bonus? It sounds like you know what the figure is going to be. We're all ears.

Apparently I need to highlight the word extension in the phrase "contract extension" for you.

i know exactly how it works. you were the one trying to say hurts and murray aren't receiving any extra money straight up.

Jalen Hurts is about to play on the 4th (and final) year of his Rookie contract too. The Eagles will pay him just over 4 million dollars for his play in 2023. The contract extension only kicks in next year, in 2024.

Likewise, Kyler Murray only incurred a 12 million dollar cap hit in 2022 - his 5 year deal doesn't even begin this year, and technically he is playing (or rather, resting) in 2023 on his 5th year option money - a cap hit to the Cardinals of 16 million. It balloons to 51 million in 2024.

maybe i need to explain to you how a signing bonus works.

[ericanadian]

You're the one that said Hurts and Murray are still playing on their rookie contracts. Did their signing bonuses skip your mind?

Seems like you're actually being serious about this. Explain to me how Lamar Jackson has cost himself money on his forthcoming signing bonus? It sounds like you know what the figure is going to be. We're all ears.

Apparently I need to highlight the word extension in the phrase "contract extension" for you.

Actually, the guys that signed after year three never had their fifth year options exercised. They played four years and then the extension kicked in.

Jalen Hurts just signed a 5 year contract that has him under team control for 6 seasons, team control until 2029. This year - 2023 - was set to be the final year of his rookie deal. So the rookie contract was extended. Yes?

Kyler Murray, drafted in 2019, signed a 5 year contract last year (in 2022, so after his third season, for those keeping track) that has him under team control until 2029. Once again, that's a 5 year contract extension somehow adding 7 years of team control. Interesting, isn't it?

We can accept as fact that Lamar was never going to be extended after his 3rd season, given that he is still seeking his extension in what will soon be his 6th season. The idea that he has cost himself money because of a failure to do this can therefore be left at the door, as it was never a realistic option between the two parties.

If anything, we can rightly say that if Lamar -had- signed after his 3rd season (so prior to the 2021 season) that he would have been locked in to an extension at a far lower average-per-year salary than what is now on the table thanks to the Hurts / Rodgers / Watson contracts.

Hurts was a second round pick, so there was no fifth year option available. He signed after year three, so yes, the five year deal leaves Philly with him for six years. And you’re correct on the 5th year options. It appears as though overthecap still lists the rookie deal as four years even after the option is picked up.

[FantasyFreak]

Side not, but man that Kyler deal is looking bad. The GM extended the coach they are paying for a bunch of years to not coach them, gave Kyler that monster deal, and then "resigns". What a mess Keim left. Kyler will somehow have to learn a new system in between rehab and COD, with a rookie HC (who's a defensive coach).

[thebeast]

You're the one that said Hurts and Murray are still playing on their rookie contracts. Did their signing bonuses skip your mind?

Seems like you're actually being serious about this. Explain to me how Lamar Jackson has cost himself money on his forthcoming signing bonus? It sounds like you know what the figure is going to be. We're all ears.

Apparently I need to highlight the word extension in the phrase "contract extension" for you.

i know exactly how it works. you were the one trying to say hurts and murray aren't receiving any extra money straight up.

Jalen Hurts is about to play on the 4th (and final) year of his Rookie contract too. The Eagles will pay him just over 4 million dollars for his play in 2023. The contract extension only kicks in next year, in 2024.

Likewise, Kyler Murray only incurred a 12 million dollar cap hit in 2022 - his 5 year deal doesn't even begin this year, and technically he is playing (or rather, resting) in 2023 on his 5th year option money - a cap hit to the Cardinals of 16 million. It balloons to 51 million in 2024.

maybe i need to explain to you how a signing bonus works.

Signing bonus isn’t extra money. It’s part of the contract, it’s just delivered at signing. Lamar didn’t lose this type of bonus, he will get it when he signs a long term deal. He has lost no money.

[Valhalla]

He has potentially lost some guaranteed money. Waiting more years to sign potentially means signing less total contracts in your career, or signing the next one just past your prime, and therefore potentially signing less guaranteed money your way in total (as the signing bonuses are guaranteed).

[Jigga94]

If he plays on the tag this year, he's lost money

[thebeast]

Maybe, all depends on the contract he eventually signs.

[Valhalla]

Maybe he injures himself Billy Chapel style and that guaranteed money evaporates

[Valhalla]

Or Plaxico Burress style if you prefer to stick to the NFL and real life...

[mild]

Side not, but man that Kyler deal is looking bad. The GM extended the coach they are paying for a bunch of years to not coach them, gave Kyler that monster deal, and then "resigns". What a mess Keim left. Kyler will somehow have to learn a new system in between rehab and COD, with a rookie HC (who's a defensive coach).

It's really bad eh. I was stunned looking at it. There is not a lot of cap relief in there for if they want to get out of it next year.

Which is very bad if you subscribe to the theory that Kyler has possibly already played his last snaps as a Cardinal.

[Anteaters]

Side not, but man that Kyler deal is looking bad. The GM extended the coach they are paying for a bunch of years to not coach them, gave Kyler that monster deal, and then "resigns". What a mess Keim left. Kyler will somehow have to learn a new system in between rehab and COD, with a rookie HC (who's a defensive coach).

It's really bad eh. I was stunned looking at it. There is not a lot of cap relief in there for if they want to get out of it next year.

Which is very bad if you subscribe to the theory that Kyler has possibly already played his last snaps as a Cardinal.

Actually, it's not too bad a situation, looked at big picture style. If AZ was to get rid of Murray, the assumption would be they be a losing team for a year or two. It won't be easy for AZ to convince a good veteran QB to go to a team that can't ever get right, so their path would have to be draft a rookie and go through a couple of seasons of growth.

if that's the case, taking a huge cap hit during that rebuild/growth period won't hurt the team much because they shouldn't look to sign big$ free agents until they're ready to win again.

Usually when a team replaces their GM+HC, there's going to be a period of reshuffling the roster.

Then again, I'm one of the few, the proud, who think Murray isn't a terrible QB. It might just be possible the new regime decides to keep him around. Maybe.