Derek Carr Thread: King of the Underrated QBs

[bjd5211]

I'm not saying he's being screwed by the Raiders, I'm just saying he has zero incentive to agree to a trade.

[Ice]

Not sure what some of you posters are getting at. The Raiders gave Carr the biggest deal in history at the time of his first extension after his rookie deal. One he never lived up to. There wasn't any bad blood at all through the entire time, and the only reason he was sat last year was because they couldn't risk injury, once they decided to move on.

Not sure exactly why people think he was treated poorly, he wasn't. Carr didn't get thrown under the bus, they simply decided to move on after 9 years, and he was granted time away from the team if he desired, after sitting him. If Carr had been hurt, his salary could have become fully guaranteed. There's nothing weird about what they did.

I don't understand the narrative that he's being hard done by, it makes no sense.

Carr didn't play up to his contract and it is obvious a parting of ways will come in February. This is all business from both sides.

Vegas treated Carr like the average QB he has become or always has been depending on perspective. Of course he won't agree to anything with the Raiders other than a massive new deal which isn't happening.

The NFL is full of teams needing a QB so Carr will land on his feet someplace.

This really isn't about a team treating him badly, in fact they agreed to the language in his last contract which now gives Carr more control choices once March rolls around. That language of February Drivers wasn't put in that contract on accident.

[FantasyFreak]

I'm not saying he's being screwed by the Raiders, I'm just saying he has zero incentive to agree to a trade.

100 percent. Your comments weren't the ones I was referring to, to be clear. It was the "thrown under the bus" and "after the way they'd treated him" type stuff. Carr was a good QB for a long time on a bad team. He's bad in the red zone, and I believe that's what keeps him from being a true franchise QB, that could be elite. His accuracy and decision making wane inside the 20, when things get tighter. That's where that off script creativity can really help, and he has little of that.

I've long defended Carr, and he was a great 4th quarter/OT QB for most of his career. He was given a sizeable yearly salary, and a contract that was a "prove the rest of it" type of thing, which he signed, and he really played poorly. He just was off, way too often this year. He got outplayed by Baker, with 2 days in a system, and Pickett, with their season on the line. He was a turnover machine. He just wasn't good.

He was given the professional courtesy to leave the team after his benching, instead of holding a clip board, because both parties knew what the deal was. He wasn't "mistreated", he was benched to ensure his contract wasn't fully guaranteed for the next year, because the Raiders had decided they were going to move on. It was completely professional, these moves.

That's all I was getting at. They probably should have cut the cord last year, when they could have gotten a first plus, rather than nothing, but they had to try it, I don't blame them.

I hope Carr finds success wherever he goes. He's a genuinely good dude, he's a solid QB at this point, but he's kind of peaked. I think if he finds a system he can sit in for years, he'll do well, but they will need a really good D to compete, something the Raiders never afforded him, to be fair.

[Pullo Vision]

Carr's rookie year HC was Dennis Allen, who's now the bc in NO. Would be interesting if that is a draw for Carr.

[FantasyFreak]

Carr's rookie year HC was Dennis Allen, who's now the bc in NO. Would be interesting if that is a draw for Carr.

I'd be fine with that for FF purposes. Dome, and a decent organization with at least 1 good WR. They could do a lot worse, and they have some extra picks to work with over the next few years now, they got back what they gave up for Olave and then some.

[FantasyFreak]

Not sure what some of you posters are getting at. The Raiders gave Carr the biggest deal in history at the time of his first extension after his rookie deal. One he never lived up to. There wasn't any bad blood at all through the entire time, and the only reason he was sat last year was because they couldn't risk injury, once they decided to move on.

Not sure exactly why people think he was treated poorly, he wasn't. Carr didn't get thrown under the bus, they simply decided to move on after 9 years, and he was granted time away from the team if he desired, after sitting him. If Carr had been hurt, his salary could have become fully guaranteed. There's nothing weird about what they did.

I don't understand the narrative that he's being hard done by, it makes no sense.

Carr didn't play up to his contract and it is obvious a parting of ways will come in February. This is all business from both sides.

Vegas treated Carr like the average QB he has become or always has been depending on perspective. Of course he won't agree to anything with the Raiders other than a massive new deal which isn't happening.

The NFL is full of teams needing a QB so Carr will land on his feet someplace.

This really isn't about a team treating him badly, in fact they agreed to the language in his last contract which now gives Carr more control choices once March rolls around. That language of February Drivers wasn't put in that contract on accident.

Yep, Maxx talking about it, it's business. He tells it like it is. He sees both sides of it, and doesn't say anything nasty went down. I mean he's even talking about loving to have Brady. It's not the bid deal the media makes it, he even mentions how most of the noise about it was from outside the building.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYZHcLJ6T0E

[Anteaters]

It was the "thrown under the bus" and "after the way they'd treated him" type stuff. Carr was a good QB for a long time on a bad team. He's bad in the red zone, and I believe that's what keeps him from being a true franchise QB, that could be elite. His accuracy and decision making wane inside the 20, when things get tighter. That's where that off script creativity can really help, and he has little of that.

I've long defended Carr, and he was a great 4th quarter/OT QB for most of his career. He was given a sizeable yearly salary, and a contract that was a "prove the rest of it" type of thing, which he signed, and he really played poorly. He just was off, way too often this year. He got outplayed by Baker, with 2 days in a system, and Pickett, with their season on the line. He was a turnover machine. He just wasn't good.

He was given the professional courtesy to leave the team after his benching, instead of holding a clip board, because both parties knew what the deal was. He wasn't "mistreated", he was benched to ensure his contract wasn't fully guaranteed for the next year, because the Raiders had decided they were going to move on. It was completely professional, these moves.

That's all I was getting at. They probably should have cut the cord last year, when they could have gotten a first plus, rather than nothing, but they had to try it, I don't blame them.

I hope Carr finds success wherever he goes. He's a genuinely good dude, he's a solid QB at this point, but he's kind of peaked. I think if he finds a system he can sit in for years, he'll do well, but they will need a really good D to compete, something the Raiders never afforded him, to be fair.

I think I was the "after the way they treated him" guy. I should clarify. I didn't mean that the Raiders treated him horribly. I meant that it was fairly obvious McDaniels never thought Carr was his guy. And once Carr didn't deliver a great season, McDaniels wasted no time in making it publicly known he had no plans to keep Carr in town. That's a fair, not horrible way to treat a player. However, it's also sort of disrespectful to bench your long time starting QB and tell him to stay away from the facilities. No matter how nicely McDaniels say that to Carr, no matter how calmly McDaniels says "it makes good business sense", that's a big difference from embracing a QB and saying YOU'RE MY GUY.

There's also a way to be fired. Admittedly, Carr did not have a very good season. However, I've seen employees be let go and everyone hugs and shakes hands and talks about the good ol' days. There have also been cases when someone was fired and security immediately walked them out of the building with a box of their belongings. In this situation, it seemed like the Raiders had security walk Carr out of the building. Maybe Carr himself suggested not wanting to stick around. I don't know. It just all felt ... not like I would have done it, or wanted it done.

That's what I meant by "how they treated him." Once a player is shown the door in that manner, the player has no incentive to help the team in any way whatsoever.

[ericanadian]

Everything sounds to me like Carr was given the option to hang around and chose to leave so as to not create a distraction. That could be lies, but I haven’t heard Carr, his agent or anyone refute it at this point.

[murphysxm]

I am on the side of Carr has the right to feel slighted. He has been one of the best, I will say conservatively 25, professional QB’s out there for a long time. His team has made it apparent they would like to upgrade for a long time. He is not elite, he is not a difference maker, but he is never been the problem. Don’t blame the team for deciding to move on, but he gets to do him with zero repercussions in my mind.

[FantasyFreak]

Everything sounds to me like Carr was given the option to hang around and chose to leave so as to not create a distraction. That could be lies, but I haven’t heard Carr, his agent or anyone refute it at this point.

Maxx said the same thing in the interview I posted. I think Davis might have made the decision, in part, because his money was the one at risk.

[FantasyFreak]

I am on the side of Carr has the right to feel slighted. He has been one of the best, I will say conservatively 25, professional QB’s out there for a long time. His team has made it apparent they would like to upgrade for a long time. He is not elite, he is not a difference maker, but he is never been the problem. Don’t blame the team for deciding to move on, but he gets to do him with zero repercussions in my mind.

The media certainly did with Gruden. Gruden never made it clear he was looking to upgrade. There was always media contrived stuff about it, but the team never said or did anything to warrant that accusation. I honestly got sick of all the stuff on the talk shows, because they just made everything up about what they thought Gruden wanted. There wasn't an ounce of proof or credibility to any of it. Gruden was very complimentary of Carr, in actual fact.

The McDaniels era, with Ziegler, it was clear they were giving Carr a 1 year trial, with the contract they gave him. So the possibility of an upgrade was certainly there since they stepped in, no doubt.

[dondickenson]

To me Derek Carr is synonymous with Kirk Cousins, right down to the skiddishness in the pocket, fear of contact, elite weapon(s) given to him, and complete lack of playoff success/ability. Honestly maybe Kirk Cousins lite.

Last 8 seasons:

Kirk Cousins averaged 4250y, 29 TD, 11 INT, 99 passer rtg.

Derek Carr averaged 4000y, 24 TD, 11 INT, 94 passer rtg.


Not excited about Carr as anything more than bye week filler in fantasy, no matter where he lands. And let’s ask ourselves if Vikings decided to move on from Kirk Cousins this off season would anyone make even a tiny stink? Nope. And Cousins vastly outperformed Carr this season both on an individual and team level.

[dondickenson]

To add to the above, the more I look at it, the less impressive Carr has been. He was third in MVP voting in 2016 with the following stats:

3937y, 63.8% cmp, 28 TD, 6 INT, 96.7 rtg

Cousins has had numerous seasons at or better than Carr’s 2016 best. Shoot Cousins put up a three year stretch from 2019-2021 where he averaged:

4030y, 68% cmp, 31 TD, 8 INT, 106 rtg


Carr has taken the Raiders to the playoffs two times, one time getting injured and seeing them one and done, and the other playing abysmally losing with a 53% cmp, 1 TD, 1 INT, and 69.2 rating. He was personally the reason Raiders lost that game.

Cousins has taken his team to the playoffs 4 times, twice with Was and twice with Minny. To the NFC championship in 2019. He has 66% cmp, 5 TD, 1 INT, and 93.7 rtg over those games. Not spectacular, not enough to make deep playoff runs, but definitely not dragging the team down like Carr did.

Yet Cousins has never received a single MVP vote like Carr did. The more I look the worse Carr looks(and the better Cousins does). I think really Carr should feel lucky that the narrative for his career has been so positive towards him. And that the Raiders and Raiders fans have been so good to him.

After just this basic research I am allll the way out.

[murphysxm]

I think the Cousins comparison is spot on. He no longer plays in Washington, who needs a QB and Cousins is the same guy and would be a massive upgrade for that team. Sometimes having a competent QB is undervalued and not appreciated as much as it could be.

[Anteaters]

I think the Cousins comparison is spot on. He no longer plays in Washington, who needs a QB and Cousins is the same guy and would be a massive upgrade for that team. Sometimes having a competent QB is undervalued and not appreciated as much as it could be.

Definitely.

As a Dolphins fan, I can't tell you how many of the past 20 years I simply wanted a guy who could be a competent QB. Forget getting a superstar. I just wanted a guy who could direct a couple of 70-yard TD drives a game. A guy who wasn't a total hack. Kind of like what Washington has suffered through since they let go of Cousins.

It's great to have a QB who can win games all by himself. I just wanted one who wasn't the reason we were losing. It's great to have a QB who can consistently throw receivers open. I just wanted a QB who could consistently hit an open receiver on a 7-yard play. I've seen QB h*ll before. It doesn't have Carr in it.