Yeah I was thinking the same thing. A polished RB can step into a new system and perform quicker than any other position in the NFL. CEH is pretty polished, as is Dobbins and Swift. Not worried about any of those 3 guys.Cult of Dionysus wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 4:38 pmWe are talking about running backs, son.OhCruelestRanter wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 3:37 pm I think the premise of taking any RB because they're going to produce early is prohibitively flawed in a COVID off-season with limited workouts and practices. If you like CEH more because you think he's the better player, or you think he'll produce more in KC, great. But if your take is that you want him because he'll produce more in year one, I'd think harder about how much any rookie is going to produce this year.
RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
ULTIMATE RB GURUs
2021 RB Injury Guru: abloom "Akers will suffer an ACL injury in the preseason and does not play during the season."
2021 RB Guru: qazxswedcvfrtgbnhyuj & McCafsteez -- Winners of the Antonio Gibson Wager!
REAL RB GURUs:
CubfanAA - Anteaters - Ice - JJRules - TheNuts - jtk1234 - Bronco Billy - YouMightDieTryin - hockeyBjj - honcho55 - murphysxm - Patsfan86 - jman3134
2021 RB Injury Guru: abloom "Akers will suffer an ACL injury in the preseason and does not play during the season."
2021 RB Guru: qazxswedcvfrtgbnhyuj & McCafsteez -- Winners of the Antonio Gibson Wager!
REAL RB GURUs:
CubfanAA - Anteaters - Ice - JJRules - TheNuts - jtk1234 - Bronco Billy - YouMightDieTryin - hockeyBjj - honcho55 - murphysxm - Patsfan86 - jman3134
Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
Agreed. While I'd prefer my RBs to get an off season tuneup, I'm not as concerned as I am for many other positions. Especially the top handful of RBs.Cult of Dionysus wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 4:38 pmWe are talking about running backs, son.OhCruelestRanter wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 3:37 pm I think the premise of taking any RB because they're going to produce early is prohibitively flawed in a COVID off-season with limited workouts and practices. If you like CEH more because you think he's the better player, or you think he'll produce more in KC, great. But if your take is that you want him because he'll produce more in year one, I'd think harder about how much any rookie is going to produce this year.
12 Team | SF | PPR | 6pt pass TD
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, SF
QB | Burrow
RB |
WR | Puka, Olave, Smith, Flowers, Dotson, Addison
TE | Pitts, Otton, Bellinger, Likely, Okonkwo
2024 | 1.01, 1.02, 4.01, 5.01
2025 | 1stx3, 3rdx3
10 Team | SF | PPR | 2023 Champ
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, SF
QB | Allen, Stroud, Young
RB | K Williams, White, Monty, Herbert, Chandler
WR | Lamb, AJB, Puka, Waddle, Mooney, J. Williams, Watson, Davis
TE | Andrews, Bellinger, Dulcich
2024 | 1.04, 3.10
12 Team | SF | PPR | 1.5TEP | 6pt pass TD
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, FL, SF
QB | Herbert Lance
RB | ETN, Pacheco, K Williams, Singletary, Henry, A Jones, Warren
WR | ARSB, Wilson, Olave, DK, Puka, Flowers, Downs,
TE | Hockenson, Likely, Otton
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, SF
QB | Burrow
RB |
WR | Puka, Olave, Smith, Flowers, Dotson, Addison
TE | Pitts, Otton, Bellinger, Likely, Okonkwo
2024 | 1.01, 1.02, 4.01, 5.01
2025 | 1stx3, 3rdx3
10 Team | SF | PPR | 2023 Champ
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, SF
QB | Allen, Stroud, Young
RB | K Williams, White, Monty, Herbert, Chandler
WR | Lamb, AJB, Puka, Waddle, Mooney, J. Williams, Watson, Davis
TE | Andrews, Bellinger, Dulcich
2024 | 1.04, 3.10
12 Team | SF | PPR | 1.5TEP | 6pt pass TD
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, FL, SF
QB | Herbert Lance
RB | ETN, Pacheco, K Williams, Singletary, Henry, A Jones, Warren
WR | ARSB, Wilson, Olave, DK, Puka, Flowers, Downs,
TE | Hockenson, Likely, Otton
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
So then how much do you guys think Helaire is going to outperform Taylor by as a rookie?
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
dlf_mikeh , when will the next report be out?
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
But you are worried about JT going to Indy? Why? You are not at all concerned about CEH's horrible pass pro, and his lack of ability to get reps to improve it for year 1? The Seahawks year 1 tried to get Penny as many reps as possible with that, knowing it was a weakness his rookie year. CEH won't get the same opportunity.dlf_mikeh wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 5:30 pmYeah I was thinking the same thing. A polished RB can step into a new system and perform quicker than any other position in the NFL. CEH is pretty polished, as is Dobbins and Swift. Not worried about any of those 3 guys.Cult of Dionysus wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 4:38 pmWe are talking about running backs, son.OhCruelestRanter wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 3:37 pm I think the premise of taking any RB because they're going to produce early is prohibitively flawed in a COVID off-season with limited workouts and practices. If you like CEH more because you think he's the better player, or you think he'll produce more in KC, great. But if your take is that you want him because he'll produce more in year one, I'd think harder about how much any rookie is going to produce this year.
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
The pass protection was exactly my thought. It's not a long term issue for me, but for a rookie who struggled in pass protection in college, and will then have an abridged off-season program, I think concern about his immediate production is reasonable.FantasyFreak wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 8:32 pmBut you are worried about JT going to Indy? Why? You are not at all concerned about CEH's horrible pass pro, and his lack of ability to get reps to improve it for year 1? The Seahawks year 1 tried to get Penny as many reps as possible with that, knowing it was a weakness his rookie year. CEH won't get the same opportunity.
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
As much as I love CEH and the Chiefs, I would pump the brakes on any high end production right out of the gates. Their offensive scheme is fairly complex and it might take some time for CEH to get up to speed. Williams has been well versed in that system for a couple of years now so I could totally see him starting the year off as the starter with CEH being brought along slowly until he gets a handle on the job. But this is dynasty and I'm in it for the long haul. CEH will be the man before the season is over and I still hope I can land him on a few of my teams.Cult of Dionysus wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 4:38 pmWe are talking about running backs, son.OhCruelestRanter wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 3:37 pm I think the premise of taking any RB because they're going to produce early is prohibitively flawed in a COVID off-season with limited workouts and practices. If you like CEH more because you think he's the better player, or you think he'll produce more in KC, great. But if your take is that you want him because he'll produce more in year one, I'd think harder about how much any rookie is going to produce this year.
Last edited by Hottoddies on Sun Apr 26, 2020 9:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
When you have Sammy, Tyreek, Hardman/Robinson out wide, Kelce from the TE position and a RB running a wheel route, you only need 5 blockers!
CEH wont be asked to block.
CEH wont be asked to block.
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
You need to block. Every RB needs to block from time to time.Cult of Dionysus wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 9:28 pm When you have Sammy, Tyreek, Hardman/Robinson out wide, Kelce from the TE position and a RB running a wheel route, you only need 5 blockers!
CEH wont be asked to block.
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
Blind squirrels find nuts throughout the winter to eat. Just do enough to get by and make big plays so they can't help but keep you on the field.FantasyFreak wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:50 amYou need to block. Every RB needs to block from time to time.Cult of Dionysus wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 9:28 pm When you have Sammy, Tyreek, Hardman/Robinson out wide, Kelce from the TE position and a RB running a wheel route, you only need 5 blockers!
CEH wont be asked to block.
10-Team Dynasty League QB/RB/RB/WR/WR/WR/FLEX (23 man rosters + 2 IR + 2 Taxi, non-PPR scoring)
QB: Herbert, Goff
RB: Bijan, JT, Saquon, J.Cook, K.Hunt, Foreman, Z.White, McKinnon, S.Tucker
WR: G.Wilson, Olave, Jeudy, Pittman, J.Williams, OBJ, N. Brown, JuJu,
TE: Chig, Conklin, L. Thomas
Taxi: M.Mims, Ro. Johnson
'24: (4) 1sts, 2nd, (2) 3rds, 4th
'25: (2) 1sts, 2nd, 3rd, 4th
QB: Herbert, Goff
RB: Bijan, JT, Saquon, J.Cook, K.Hunt, Foreman, Z.White, McKinnon, S.Tucker
WR: G.Wilson, Olave, Jeudy, Pittman, J.Williams, OBJ, N. Brown, JuJu,
TE: Chig, Conklin, L. Thomas
Taxi: M.Mims, Ro. Johnson
'24: (4) 1sts, 2nd, (2) 3rds, 4th
'25: (2) 1sts, 2nd, 3rd, 4th
Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
I believe Kareem Hunt was third on the depth chart behind Spencer Ware and _____________ and didn't work with the 1s up until he played the Patriots week 1 in 2017, where he erupted with a huge game. Not saying it'll happen with CEH, just that it's happened before.Hottoddies wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 9:28 pmAs much as I love CEH and the Chiefs, I would pump the brakes on any high end production right out of the gates. Their offensive scheme is fairly complex and it might take some time for CEH to get up to speed.
And I'm not terribly worried about pass protection since he's so dangerous out of the backfield as a pass catcher. If he wasn't such a threat through the air then I'd be more negative towards CEH.
JT needs to work on so much more than CEH until he's ready. I've explained it all before, just check my JT thread. Indy is a great spot for him.
ULTIMATE RB GURUs
2021 RB Injury Guru: abloom "Akers will suffer an ACL injury in the preseason and does not play during the season."
2021 RB Guru: qazxswedcvfrtgbnhyuj & McCafsteez -- Winners of the Antonio Gibson Wager!
REAL RB GURUs:
CubfanAA - Anteaters - Ice - JJRules - TheNuts - jtk1234 - Bronco Billy - YouMightDieTryin - hockeyBjj - honcho55 - murphysxm - Patsfan86 - jman3134
2021 RB Injury Guru: abloom "Akers will suffer an ACL injury in the preseason and does not play during the season."
2021 RB Guru: qazxswedcvfrtgbnhyuj & McCafsteez -- Winners of the Antonio Gibson Wager!
REAL RB GURUs:
CubfanAA - Anteaters - Ice - JJRules - TheNuts - jtk1234 - Bronco Billy - YouMightDieTryin - hockeyBjj - honcho55 - murphysxm - Patsfan86 - jman3134
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
You'll have to forgive us if we're confused; it would appear your thoughts on JT were a bit scattered. Here's what you said about him before the draft:
And here's what you said after the NFL Draft:
dlf_mikeh wrote: ↑Sat Apr 25, 2020 9:51 am CEH landed amazingly well. Dobbins landed well, JT in a good spot, Swift not so much.
All 4 guys deserve consideration at 1.01 tbh. CEH/Dobbins are my top guys. JT/Swift are just a tad behind them.
I'd still draft Swift over JT simply because I don't want to take the gamble on JT. He has more to learn than anyone else and I'd rather have something closer to a finished product like Swift. However, I love JTs coaching staff... that's a huge plus.
CEH
Dobbins
Swift
JT
I guess that's my ranks, but that's just based on immediate production.
So pre-draft you ranked him as 1.01, RB4, and outside your top 6 rookies, and then post draft you've had him 1.04, 1.03, and 1.01.
I'm not sure who this is supposed to be useful for, but again, thank you for doing it.
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
Don't care what anyone says about his pass pro, dude was drafted to run routes and be explosive. I'd be surprised if there was a RB in this class that runs more routes or averaged more yards per route run than CEH next year. I would be surprised if he doesn't get at least 50-60 percent of the backfield touches next year. I'd be surprised if that doesn't translate to considerable fantasy success.
According to PFF, Kareem Hunt was the second worst pass blocker among all RBs in his rookie year (just behind Christian McCaffrey, who had the single worst pass blocking efficiency rating among all rookies in the decade leading up to his rookie season, interestingly enough). Didn't prevent either of them from scoring very respectable amounts of fantasy points, I'd be surprised if it prevents CEH.
According to PFF, Kareem Hunt was the second worst pass blocker among all RBs in his rookie year (just behind Christian McCaffrey, who had the single worst pass blocking efficiency rating among all rookies in the decade leading up to his rookie season, interestingly enough). Didn't prevent either of them from scoring very respectable amounts of fantasy points, I'd be surprised if it prevents CEH.
12 Team SF IDP
QB - Mahomes, Lawrence, Mac
RB - Etienne, Walker, Rhamondre, Javonte, Akers, CEH
WR - AJB, Waddle, Higgins, Gabe, Toney
TE - Andrews, ISJ
DL - Quinnen, Highsmith, Josh Allen
LB - Lloyd, JOK, Gay, Bush
DB - Winfield, Love, Delpit
14 Team 1QB IDP
QB - Fields, Jimmy G
RB - Henry, Kamara, Swift, Herbert
WR - Adams, Juju, Jakobi, Theilen
TE - Hock, Everett
DL - Garrett, Buckner, Sweat
LB - White, David, Okereke, Jack
DB - Budda, CJGJ, Dugger, Byard
QB - Mahomes, Lawrence, Mac
RB - Etienne, Walker, Rhamondre, Javonte, Akers, CEH
WR - AJB, Waddle, Higgins, Gabe, Toney
TE - Andrews, ISJ
DL - Quinnen, Highsmith, Josh Allen
LB - Lloyd, JOK, Gay, Bush
DB - Winfield, Love, Delpit
14 Team 1QB IDP
QB - Fields, Jimmy G
RB - Henry, Kamara, Swift, Herbert
WR - Adams, Juju, Jakobi, Theilen
TE - Hock, Everett
DL - Garrett, Buckner, Sweat
LB - White, David, Okereke, Jack
DB - Budda, CJGJ, Dugger, Byard
Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
Mikeh are you still high on Dillon? I know he wont amass to much this yeah but do you think he is being groomed to take over next year?
12 Team PPR| 1QB, 2RB, 3 WR, 1 TE, 1 Super Flex, 2 WRT | 25 Roster | 4 Taxi
QB: Stroud, Murray, Jimmy G
RB: Walker, Bijan Robinson, Pacheco, Charbonnet, Spiller, Abanikanda, Hull
WR: Dell, M. Brown, Smith-Njigba, Downs, Ross, C. Jones, Austin, Palmer
TE: Laporta, McBride, Woods, Turner, Parham
PS:
IR:
'24 Picks: 1.02, 2.12, 3.02, 5.06
'25 Picks: 2nd, (2) 3rds, (2) 4th, 5th
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Re: RB Analysis Part Two (RB5-RB8) Plus Top 8 Rank So Far
Spencer Ware tore his ACL in a mid/late August preseason game when Hunt was a rookie. Charcandrick West was the other vet on the roster competing with Hunt. Hunt was steadily gaining ground on Ware before the injury though, IIRC. Hunt had made a couple of eye-popping PP blocks in PS games prior to that also.dlf_mikeh wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:09 amI believe Kareem Hunt was third on the depth chart behind Spencer Ware and _____________ and didn't work with the 1s up until he played the Patriots week 1 in 2017, where he erupted with a huge game. Not saying it'll happen with CEH, just that it's happened before.Hottoddies wrote: ↑Sun Apr 26, 2020 9:28 pmAs much as I love CEH and the Chiefs, I would pump the brakes on any high end production right out of the gates. Their offensive scheme is fairly complex and it might take some time for CEH to get up to speed.
And I'm not terribly worried about pass protection since he's so dangerous out of the backfield as a pass catcher. If he wasn't such a threat through the air then I'd be more negative towards CEH.
JT needs to work on so much more than CEH until he's ready. I've explained it all before, just check my JT thread. Indy is a great spot for him.
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