RBBC in Kansas City

[FantasyDumDum]

You’re editing my own posts on here now.

Actually I have no idea what happened. I thought I hit reply but maybe I hit edit when I tried quoting you. I put your post back the best I could. I'll go back further in my browser history and see if I can find one before I accidentally hit edit.

Look, you lied about his injury history. And you bring up three other AWFUL points against him.

We already talked about this. You consider including his preseason and training camp injuries inaccurate. I don't.

I’m not angry. I’m appalled and frankly disgusted that somebody pulls the wool over others eyes like you do and pretend to be some kind of “guru” yet when you run into someone who actually has knowledge on a player it become COMPLETELY CLEAR you are just posturing and making this stuff up.

k

His training camp and preseason injuries that have never affected his regular season availability? Even if taken into consideration there are PLENTY of other high end RBs that are significantly more “injury prone” than Williams. Hyde, for one, was a mess of injuries his whole time in SF.

Officially:

Damien Williams -
separated shoulder 2017, 5 games

Carlos Hyde -
MCL year 2016, 1 game + off season
Separated shoulder 2016, 2 games
Concussion 2016, preseason
Foot fracture 2015, 9 games
Back sprain 2014, 2 games
Ankle sprain 2014, 2 games
Knee sprain 2012, 2 games

[kmbryant09]

Can we block this DumDum guy? It's not like I disagree with 100% of his arguments (though I disagree with most), but tell him to take that sh!tty attitude somewhere else.

Dude wants absolutely nothing to do with a civil debate about players or fantasy football. Wants to spew his own random opinions, than hope everyone agrees with them. If they don't, he just acts like a kid and resorts to insults and name-calling.

[Valhalla]

...
But go ahead and troll the guy who has been right all along and has given everyone here BY FAR the best and most useful dynasty advice of anyone here this entire off season.

Honestly, who else helped you turn a WW add into 2x1sts value this off season? Or anything even close to that?

Sorry for trolling you. That comment kind of was. Yet...you've called me a troll multiple other times when I was simply offering a perspective. Not everyone who disagrees with you is trolling you.

Also...I don't think there are very many people out there who are trading two firsts for this guy. I know it's not happening anywhere in any of my leagues. He is being moved for about half that.

I own Damien. I don't hate him. I'm not against your view. I have only been trying to convey that it's NOT his past FPPT that makes him valuable...and that it's not accurate to extrapolate FPPT on a very high TD rate and high reception rate. He's not likely to continue either of those rates if featured, so I can't get behind extrapolating his output based on his past FPPT rate.

[bjd5211]

Can we block this DumDum guy? It's not like I disagree with 100% of his arguments (though I disagree with most), but tell him to take that sh!tty attitude somewhere else.

Dude wants absolutely nothing to do with a civil debate about players or fantasy football. Wants to spew his own random opinions, than hope everyone agrees with them. If they don't, he just acts like a kid and resorts to insults and name-calling.

x2

[FantasyDumDum]

...
But go ahead and troll the guy who has been right all along and has given everyone here BY FAR the best and most useful dynasty advice of anyone here this entire off season.

Honestly, who else helped you turn a WW add into 2x1sts value this off season? Or anything even close to that?

Sorry for trolling you. That comment kind of was. Yet...you've called me a troll multiple other times when I was simply offering a perspective. Not everyone who disagrees with you is trolling you.

Also...I don't think there are very many people out there who are trading two firsts for this guy. I know it's not happening anywhere in any of my leagues. He is being moved for about half that.

I own Damien. I don't hate him. I'm not against your view. I have only been trying to convey that it's NOT his past FPPT that makes him valuable...and that it's not accurate to extrapolate FPPT on a very high TD rate and high reception rate. He's not likely to continue either of those rates if featured, so I can't get behind extrapolating his output based on his past FPPT rate.

I consider trolling attempting to drag the thread off topic, posting ad hominems without facts, arguing in bad faith, etc. Disagreement has nothing to do with trolling. Have you not noticed that since I started posting facts illuminating the lies and bad analysis by a mod here, we have had several posters come in here to attack me personally because they cannot with facts because the facts do not fit with their made up feel good narratives? Those are the trolls. The mods encourage them both implicitly by not censoring their attempts to ruin threads here and explicitly because they are “friends” or “have been here a long time.”


Back on topic:

Damien is not likely to keep up his insane rate in KC of 1.35 FPPt. But FPPT is far and away the best fantasy stat for RBs(nothing else even comes close), and it is relatively sticky. Aka you can predict pretty well where certain “types” of RBs will be in the range. Pass catching, TD scoring RBs end up on top of this list. Being in KC offense will also help him stay in that elite range, even if it is well below his past rate. And it isn’t an exact science or claimed to be anyways, but it clearly shows, along with Damien’s opportunity, durability, and talent, that his likely and possible ranges of outcomes are very high. You can get more granular and specific after that, but even that vague analysis and statement is enough to solidify a pretty good idea of his worth.

The fact that he doesn’t have much injury history to speak of, and there seems to only be a push from an undersized, albeit electric, Rookie UDFA for his role in a top 5 offense all time, just further cements his value.


And as to value, we’ve already discussed in the other Damien Williams thread that his value is pretty much 2x1sts already and offers have come in for alllllmost as much as of now, or close enough that I have recommended selling if you get a good deal even close to that. I didn’t sell for Aaron Jones + 2020 2nd because Damien won me a bunch of leagues last year and I want to ride him, no worries. I probably would sell for AJ + 2020 1st though, so you can see where I value him based on me being very likely the most informed and longest owning, most invested Damien Williams owner in all of dynasty football.

[FantasyFreak]

Can we block this DumDum guy? It's not like I disagree with 100% of his arguments (though I disagree with most), but tell him to take that sh!tty attitude somewhere else.

Dude wants absolutely nothing to do with a civil debate about players or fantasy football. Wants to spew his own random opinions, than hope everyone agrees with them. If they don't, he just acts like a kid and resorts to insults and name-calling.

x2

X3

[TimeWillTell]

I'm ready for DWill to lose the job ASAP just so we can stop this insanity. And I actually wish I owned him. But this is getting ridiculous.

[SkinZ187]

Can we block this DumDum guy? It's not like I disagree with 100% of his arguments (though I disagree with most), but tell him to take that sh!tty attitude somewhere else.

Dude wants absolutely nothing to do with a civil debate about players or fantasy football. Wants to spew his own random opinions, than hope everyone agrees with them. If they don't, he just acts like a kid and resorts to insults and name-calling.

x2

X3

X4

[Phaded]

X5.

He was literally the reason the other Damien thread was locked, now it is happening again.

I honestly cannot tell if he is trying to be like this or if it is just his natural personality. In the beginning I thought it was an act, now not so convinced.

[ArrylT]

I consider trolling attempting to drag the thread off topic, posting ad hominems without facts, arguing in bad faith, etc. Disagreement has nothing to do with trolling. Have you not noticed that since I started posting facts illuminating the lies and bad analysis by a mod here, we have had several posters come in here to attack me personally because they cannot with facts because the facts do not fit with their made up feel good narratives? Those are the trolls. The mods encourage them both implicitly by not censoring their attempts to ruin threads here and explicitly because they are “friends” or “have been here a long time.”

He has been warned multiple times not to spread this false & baseless accusation. And not warned by a volunteer Moderator like myself, or a DLF Writer, but by the owners of DLF themselves specifically. He seems to have chosen to ignore these warnings & requests from DLF to refrain from antagonistic behaviour and has chosen to continue this tiresome and unwarranted accusation. As such he has now been banned (temporarily).

I will not go into the specifics of the message(s) that were sent to him, other than to mention that all the moderators supported & backed them and it is my honest opinion that all moderartors did their utmost to find a means in which to allow him to remain a useful member of the DLF Forums. While we may not have agreed at times with his opinions, we definitely feel that as many opinions & perspectives are welcome within the DLF Forums, but that his presence was becoming (like others in the past) a major source of discontent within the community.

I will share some of my comments

Honestly I disagree A LOT with what he says - but he has a right to say it. Further the more perspectives we have, the more useful it is because as dynasty owners there are plenty of owners who think the way he does, and having an understanding of different perspectives is valuable not only to us as owners in our leagues, but the dynasty community as a whole.

What he does NOT have a right is to attack others, and that should be made clear. That his perspective is welcome SO LONG AS he focuses on HIS MESSAGE and not calling others trolls/idiots/personal attacks. So it should be made crystal clear that if he gets banned it is not because of his viewpoints, but how he is treating his fellow members.

I have probably overstepped myself today a little, but I felt it important that everyone be aware that (a) this decision was not taken lightly (b) was months in coming and (c) did not want anyone to think that dlf_mikeh - who in fact I felt was one of the most vocal in giving FDD as much of a chance as possible - was behind the ban just because of todays interaction. This will be my one and only comment on this matter.

[Phaded]

*applause*

Maybe the timeout approach that teachers often use on toddlers will benefit the post quality.

I am all for a healthy debate but some people simply cannot healthily disagree and need to insist they are right.

Now, to try and get back on topic..

With Darwin Thompson flashing and him being a scat back in the Tarik Cohen mold, how much does that limit the receiving upside of Williams because let's face it - that is where a bulk of his production comes from?

[bjd5211]

[mild]

I miss Turco being the resident troll.

I have long suspected that F-D-D was his latest account. The timelines fit for when Turco was axed... the thing with Turco was that, when he wanted to, he could engage in a topic, spout some stats, touch on the hot-button questions... but only for as long as it took to get people invested in replying.

Classic troll behaviour. They're evolving... be careful out there everyone.

And again - Thanks Mike for always laying out your thought processes on this stuff. For next time - feel free to not engage verbatim with posts like that that are just going for personal attacks... none of us are here for that, and we've got your back.

[MEuRaH]

With Darwin Thompson flashing and him being a scat back in the Tarik Cohen mold, how much does that limit the receiving upside of Williams because let's face it - that is where a bulk of his production comes from?

This is something I hadn't thought about. Look how potent these offenses are with Cohen, Sproles, Danny Woodhead, etc. I never understood why more teams didn't try to do this.

If Darwin continues his preseason awesomeness, perhaps he'll force the coaches to find a spot for him in such a way.

Thanks Mike for always laying out your thought processes on this stuff. For next time - feel free to not engage verbatim with posts like that that are just going for personal attacks... none of us are here for that, and we've got your back.

Thanks my friend. And I'd do the same for you and anyone else. I didn't take action because I was directly involved, but I assure you we have been watching and talking about this guy for a while. We tried to reason with him and I tried to get him to change his tune in this very thread. No dice, so that's that. It's a shame too because I liked some of what he posted. He had some worthy information to share and I enjoyed reading it.

[Pullo Vision]

I liked some of what he posted. He had some worthy information to share and I enjoyed reading it.

I agree, there were some interesting bits and angles to what he said. The great thing about any stat like FPPT is how testable it is, like College Dominator or BMI. I was really hoping there'd be a post/thread that backed up how strongly he made his claim.

it clearly shows, along with Damien’s opportunity, durability, and talent, that his likely and possible ranges of outcomes are very high. You can get more granular and specific after that, but even that vague analysis and statement is enough to solidify a pretty good idea of his worth.[/FDD]
Something more "granular and specific" would have been great.

Even though I appreciated some of what he said, I absolutely hated how he presented himself.