Let’s settle it: CEH or JT

[PR0v3]

No, we know KC ranked CEH over him, and Indy was taking JT over Swift if they had taken a RB at 34.

But Indy didn't take him at 34 because they figured didn't have to, since, you know, they realized other teams valued other RBs more.

No, because other teams valued other POSITIONS more than RB.

Well they were wrong about that, since Detroit took an RB. Lucky for them that their miscalculation didn't result in them losing their guy. If other team's valued JT similarly, it may have.

[Sriracha]

I think it is. Two teams passing on JT for two different RBs indicates to me that JT is not viewed as a clearly superior talent by the NFL. If you choose believe they are the only two teams that had RBs over JT though, you do you.

This is a giant leap of logic.

Really? Even if only 5 teams did not have him as the #1 ranked RB (2 are confirmed), that would mean at least 15% of the league did not value him as the top RB. Did 15% of fantasy owners not value him as the top RB pre-draft? Didn't seem like it to me.

There were 2 modern values working against JT for him this year.

1) The general devaluation of the RB position in today's NFL
2) An increase in priorities towards receiving ability.

It's not a mistake that the 2 RB's chosen before him were both seen as exceptional receiving backs.

The top 5 RB's are all very strong prospects (Akers has more bust potential but I still would've taken him ahead of both Jacobs and Sanders last year).

In my honest opinion, JT is the best rushing RBwe've seen in a long time (Nick Chubb was pretty close, but I really think JT is better). That's where a lot of RBs bust in the NFL, not being able to actually rush the football so JT is one of the safest RB prospects I've seen in a while (contrary to DLF_mikeh's viewpoint).

As far as ceiling goes, I'd put Swift as the only RB that can compete with JT from an all-round skillset. Many people tried to use the MJD comp with CEH.. but I did not see the power or break away speed that made MJD so special-- I saw something that resembles that in Swift.

Dobbins ceiling is crazy high as well, but he needs to learn how to run -- The amount of times I've seen him lose speed after breaking free from the defense was insane--I really think he'd benefit from some track and field coaching.

Now that we have Dobbins/CEH landing in flush spots I actually agree that JT is a bit overrated; and I'd add that Swift/Akers are being undervalued. The more you dive into these RB's the more you realize that all 5 of those guys could be high end RB1s sooner rather than later.

[bjd5211]

That's calculated risk you have to take in drafts sometimes. Pittman plays a position that is both more valuable and was a bigger need, taking the chance on missing out on Taylor was the right call.

[CGW]

Good time to rekindle this one. SF PPR 12tm startup, CEH went 11th and Taylor 13th.

lol WHAT?

Can I get a link to that?

Not smart enough to figure out how to link the draft. There's a thread in the team advice section with the first 2 rounds completed. Rb went early and often.

[Ice]

Sure wish people would Understand the CEH and MJD comparisons are precisely because CEH can not only gain yards after contact but he can also make defenders miss. Additionally he is an elite pass catcher.

I have quoted a few stats before but go look up his yards after contact over 700 I think and led the SEC in missed tackles against him.

He went top of his class because he is a complete RB.

Speed isn’t the top marker for a RB. He is plenty quick and excels between the tackles.

Pass on him at your peril.

[Sriracha]

Sure wish people would Understand the CEH and MJD comparisons are precisely because CEH can not only gain yards after contact but he can also make defenders miss. Additionally he is an elite pass catcher.

I have quoted a few stats before but go look up his yards after contact over 700 I think and led the SEC in missed tackles against him.

He went top of his class because he is a complete RB.

Speed isn’t the top marker for a RB. He is plenty quick and excels between the tackles.

Pass on him at your peril.

So it's a 10,000 foot view comparison rather than a stylistic one? MJD was special because he did all of those things while also having break away speed and power.

It's just interesting because there's a guy in this class that actually does remind me a lot of MJD: but it's Swfit, not CEH

[Ice]

Sure wish people would Understand the CEH and MJD comparisons are precisely because CEH can not only gain yards after contact but he can also make defenders miss. Additionally he is an elite pass catcher.

I have quoted a few stats before but go look up his yards after contact over 700 I think and led the SEC in missed tackles against him.

He went top of his class because he is a complete RB.

Speed isn’t the top marker for a RB. He is plenty quick and excels between the tackles.

Pass on him at your peril.

So it's a 10,000 foot view comparison rather than a stylistic one? MJD was special because he did all of those things while also having break away speed and power.

It's just interesting because there's a guy in this class that actually does remind me a lot of MJD: but it's Swfit, not CEH

Might help if I explain;

First SNAP your fingers; took about 7/100 of a second. That’s the difference in MJD and CEH 10 yard split in the 40.

They are built almost identical. I actually like CEH’s vision a bit better even though he doesn’t possess the long speed of MJD.

CEH is in a vastly better situation than MJD ever thought about being in.

BTW Swift was my top Back evaluation but moved him down to 2 due to Reid picking CEH

Like both a ton

Had them prior to draft
Swift Dobbins CEH Taylor but actually like all 4.


Bottomline I trust and respect Reid and he has way more info than me do it was easy moving CEH to top spot.

When he says better than Westbrook I believe him and recent history with Hunt leading the league as a rookie and I have zero issues moving him to top spot.

Not that proud!

[Sriracha]

Might help if I explain;

First SNAP your fingers; took about 7/100 of a second. That’s the difference in MJD and CEH 10 yard split in the 40.

That 7/100th's of a second is the difference between splitting the safeties down the middle for a long TD vs a 12 yard gain. Or beating the linebacker to the sideline on an outside run. It's not a trivial time frame; and the difference here is exasperated by the difference in their long speeds-- a 30 yard run vs a 60 yard TD.

They are built almost identical. I actually like CEH’s vision a bit better even though he doesn’t possess the long speed of MJD.

CEH is in a vastly better situation than MJD ever thought about being in.

CEH is definitely the 1.02 at worst given his landing spot, but I was arguing about their individual talent evaluations.

BTW Swift was my top Back evaluation but moved him down to 2 due to Reid picking CEH

Like both a ton

Had them prior to draft
Swift Dobbins CEH Taylor but actually like all 4.


Bottomline I trust and respect Reid and he has way more info than me do it was easy moving CEH to top spot.

When he says better than Westbrook I believe him and recent history with Hunt leading the league as a rookie and I have zero issues moving him to top spot.

Not that proud!

Westbrook is a much more apt comparison in my mind. At the end of the day all we care about are fantasy points, but I believe it's important to realize that CEH's skillset does not translate as well to fantasy points across various situations. Like you mentioned earlier, MJD was a stud despite being in a bad situation; this is because he was an extremely talented RB with the ability to generate splash plays and cash them for long TDs -- something that just isn't in CEH's bag of tricks.

[AussieMate]

I've come fully around on CEH and I would 100% take him 1.01 now, to put it in perspective it's the same reason I've started moving Ruggs up my ranks a touch. Regardless of what I think of these 2 players they were both taken high at their positions and I think it's a statement that these teams won't let fail. I'm of the belief that the Raiders are going to do everything in the power to prove they made the right choice with Ruggs and basically it'll come down to Ruggs whether he can do something with it, I feel the same about CEH. He's already in a great offence with great talent all around him but to add to that I feel like Reid using such a high pick on an RB for the first time that CEH will get every possible chance showcase his skill.
There are so many players that I believe have a heap of talent but just don't get the chance to shine, both Ruggs and CEH will not have this problem, they will get the chance.
The rest is up to them.

[FantasyFreak]

Both are good players in the right situations for their talents. Take who you want, and wait until some football happens.

[dynastyninja]

Both are good players in the right situations for their talents. Take who you want, and wait until some football happens.

Yep, probably won't be able to really settle this discussion for at least 2-3 years.

[Jigga94]

Sure wish people would Understand the CEH and MJD comparisons are precisely because CEH can not only gain yards after contact but he can also make defenders miss. Additionally he is an elite pass catcher.

I have quoted a few stats before but go look up his yards after contact over 700 I think and led the SEC in missed tackles against him.

He went top of his class because he is a complete RB.

Speed isn’t the top marker for a RB. He is plenty quick and excels between the tackles.

Pass on him at your peril.

So it's a 10,000 foot view comparison rather than a stylistic one? MJD was special because he did all of those things while also having break away speed and power.

It's just interesting because there's a guy in this class that actually does remind me a lot of MJD: but it's Swfit, not CEH

Might help if I explain;

First SNAP your fingers;

Do ya step

[Ice]

Westbrook is a much more apt comparison in my mind. At the end of the day all we care about are fantasy points, but I believe it's important to realize that CEH's skillset does not translate as well to fantasy points across various situations. Like you mentioned earlier, MJD was a stud despite being in a bad situation; this is because he was an extremely talented RB with the ability to generate splash plays and cash them for long TDs -- something that just isn't in CEH's bag of tricks.

What is interesting is MJD was compared to Westbrook when he came out.

CEH doesn't make Splash Plays?

Not sure what you are calling splash plays but he made tons of eye popping plays at LSU. His career long was an 89 yard TD run. Doubt even the great MJD ever did that in Jacksonville.

Time will tell.

[OhCruelestRanter]

Comparing a RB with great size-adjusted speed to a 4.6 guy misses the point of why we do RB comparisons. It’s not useful for anything other than making yourself feel good about CEH.

Devonta Freeman (5’8, 206, 4.58) is a much better comparison, doesn’t completely break the size adjusted athleticism mold, and still illustrates the upside (he had multiple RB1 seasons including one as THE RB1).

Nobody would object to taking “Devonta Freeman, but with Pat Mahomes and Andy Reid” first overall in a rookie draft. There’s no need to draw a bad comparison to a better athlete to make ourselves feel better.

[Ice]

The point of comparing 40 times as the end all be all measure for a RB is what is silly.

While straight line speed matters to a degree it certainly isn't the main critical factor for a RB. The all team leading rusher in the history of the game ran a 4.7.

Being fast is just one component of being an athlete. It certainly isn't the only measure of being the better athlete.

What makes CEH special is balance, foot quickness, vision, YAC yards, receiving, desire, and ball security to name some.

The entire world knows he is not a track star but his 10 yard split is extremely good and his foot quickness burst through the hole is obvious to anyone who watches his play.

No telling if he will have the career of a Westbrook or MJD but his skill set is obvious and the Chief's certainly think he has the potential to be an outstanding football player. CEH skill translates very well to Fantasy Football which is why he is or will be a consensus a top 3 pick in fantasy drafts and will most likely the 1.1 in the majority of dynasty rookie drafts this year.