Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby Jigga94 » Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:22 pm

mild wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:13 pm
StripesOfKC wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:34 pm I just don't know how they went from DJ Chark+one of 25/33 to this

Thought there would be more interest
Did you really buy that one, though?

I thought we all agreed that that report was made up by a burner account, or something...

https://twitter.com/ESPNdirocco/status/ ... 8962597890

Lol

It's a deep Tackle class, and he's going to ask for a Tunsil-style max deal next offseason. Even if they tag him a few years, he'll still get his money eventually. The Ravens just needed to take what they could and move on, their leverage in the situation was shot.
Yeah it's not the greatest value for the Ravens, but we weren't going to get much more. I'll take the 1st and trust our brass. Hate to see Zeus Jr go but once he realized he could get paid at LT, it was all downhill

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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby OhCruelestRanter » Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:37 pm

Kmani6 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 1:40 pm OhCruelestRanter is punching the air right now... Chiefs added Thuney AND Brown !? looks like CEH stock is UP!!! :lol:
I got my first share of him recently in a home league. He’s way cheaper now (or at least he was before this signing), and will have a ton of opportunity again in a good offense assuming KC doesn’t draft somebody. I’m not like, rooting against him; I have no emotional investment in CEH, just like I have no emotional investment in a stock that I don’t own.

My CEH opinions are/were that 1. He was a bad pick by the Chiefs. That doesn’t preclude me from acquiring him; I thought Zeke and Barkley and several other RBs that I’ve drafted were all bad picks. I’ll probably feel the same about Etienne and Harris this year; and 2. He was over-valued last offseason when he surged to 1.05 in startup value.

It was weird that you PM’d me to look at this thread:
Kmani6 wrote:Fri Apr 23, 2021 1:41 pm Look at what i said in the Orlando brown thread :lol:
I suppose I could let you know whenever I post something that contradicts your opinion. The problem is that I have no idea what your opinions are and I will never, ever, ever care enough to do so. But feel free to keep memorizing my posts and PMing me to let me know you’re disagreeing with one.
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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby bjd5211 » Fri Apr 23, 2021 4:32 pm

sugbear65 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:57 pm Well they did release Eric Fisher(and RT Schwartz). I get the trade, get a younger version on the upside of his career. It was a good deal. But I think it’s a stretch to view this as some massive upgrade as much as keeping the status quo. They are a SB team, and just like the Bucs it makes sense to try and field a similar team as last year. But I don’t view this as some upgrade to CEH, more like not a reason to ding him.
It IS a massive upgrade over what they had currently on the roster though. The best OT they had on the roster was a 3rd round pick last year who opted out of his rookie year due to COVID, it was a glaring hole and now they have a guy who is at the very least a highly competent starter (which is highly valuable at that position), and potentially a top 10 or so OT in the league.

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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby mild » Fri Apr 23, 2021 4:37 pm

Jigga94 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:22 pm Yeah it's not the greatest value for the Ravens, but we weren't going to get much more. I'll take the 1st and trust our brass. Hate to see Zeus Jr go but once he realized he could get paid at LT, it was all downhill
Yeah brother, you've got it. He had all the leverage, your GM pretty much admitted as such with that "these processes take time" quote last month. I will say though, of all the brass to trust - you're in great hands... the Ravens love the draft...

https://twitter.com/Jason_OTC/status/13 ... 57126?s=20
OhCruelestRanter wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:37 pm My CEH opinions are/were that 1. He was a bad pick by the Chiefs. That doesn’t preclude me from acquiring him; I thought Zeke and Barkley and several other RBs that I’ve drafted were all bad picks...
To bat for OCR (cos who doesn't love doing that!) - I was reminded of a great piece of work by Warren Sharp that ran recently. "Your team is never a first round RB away"... it remains true that drafting an RB in the first round - no matter the talent - remains one of the worst possible ways to spend (blow!) your draft capital as a GM.

https://www.nbcsports.com/edge/article/ ... nd-rb-away

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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby jcc6fd » Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:03 am

If you want to argue Brown over Fisher isn’t a big upgrade to CEH I’d listen. But you have to remember that the Chiefs have also reworked the entire interior of their line, headlined by getting Thuney. They also have Kyle long as a huge upside guy to play right tackle. I wouldn’t rule them out bringing back Schwartz as injury insurance on a one year deal as a swing tackle backup for Long/Brown. This SB weakness is looking like a legitimate strength right now and I expect the run game to benefit. The book on the Chiefs now is force them to run and if they show even moderate effectiveness they’ll be near unstoppable
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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby MEuRaH » Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:16 am

Under-rated move.

It should be noted that this is not the only move made to get that offensive line back in gear. All five starting linemen from last year will be different this year. It was one of the worst in the NFL, which makes what Mahomes and CEH did even that much more impressive.

KC is dangerous yet again.
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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby Bronco Billy » Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:30 am

bjd5211 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 4:32 pm
sugbear65 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:57 pm Well they did release Eric Fisher(and RT Schwartz). I get the trade, get a younger version on the upside of his career. It was a good deal. But I think it’s a stretch to view this as some massive upgrade as much as keeping the status quo. They are a SB team, and just like the Bucs it makes sense to try and field a similar team as last year. But I don’t view this as some upgrade to CEH, more like not a reason to ding him.
It IS a massive upgrade over what they had currently on the roster though. The best OT they had on the roster was a 3rd round pick last year who opted out of his rookie year due to COVID, it was a glaring hole and now they have a guy who is at the very least a highly competent starter (which is highly valuable at that position), and potentially a top 10 or so OT in the league.
True, but that wasn’t what they had at starting OTs during the regular season last year. IMO this is probably pretty close to break even, maybe a slight lean to this year over last year. This shouldn’t move CEH’s stock much if at all.

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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby Bronco Billy » Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:43 am

dlf_mikeh wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:16 am Under-rated move.

It should be noted that this is not the only move made to get that offensive line back in gear. All five starting linemen from last year will be different this year. It was one of the worst in the NFL, which makes what Mahomes and CEH did even that much more impressive.

KC is dangerous yet again.
pff’s rankings aren’t the last word in assessment but they are thorough and pretty knowledgeable to what they are analyzing. They had KC’s O-line as the 11th best last year even with the Schwartz injury. That’s a far cry from being one of the worst units in the league.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2020 ... e-rankings

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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby Ice » Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:51 am

Bronco Billy wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:43 am
dlf_mikeh wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:16 am Under-rated move.

It should be noted that this is not the only move made to get that offensive line back in gear. All five starting linemen from last year will be different this year. It was one of the worst in the NFL, which makes what Mahomes and CEH did even that much more impressive.

KC is dangerous yet again.
pff’s rankings aren’t the last word in assessment but they are thorough and pretty knowledgeable to what they are analyzing. They had KC’s O-line as the 11th best last year even with the Schwartz injury. That’s a far cry from being one of the worst units in the league.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2020 ... e-rankings
They certainly were not good late or in the playoffs. The Bucs exposed them big time and Mahomes was running for his life the entire SB. KC has designs on the Big Game and they are addressing a major weakness standing in their way.

It was obvious KC had no depth in the Line. They are revamping to add starters and depth in case injuries hit again.
Last edited by Ice on Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby OhCruelestRanter » Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:51 am

Bronco Billy wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:43 am
dlf_mikeh wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:16 am Under-rated move.

It should be noted that this is not the only move made to get that offensive line back in gear. All five starting linemen from last year will be different this year. It was one of the worst in the NFL, which makes what Mahomes and CEH did even that much more impressive.

KC is dangerous yet again.
pff’s rankings aren’t the last word in assessment but they are thorough and pretty knowledgeable to what they are analyzing. They had KC’s O-line as the 11th best last year even with the Schwartz injury. That’s a far cry from being one of the worst units in the league.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2020 ... e-rankings
Football outsiders has them 14th in adjusted line yards and 4th in adjusted sack rate. They were absolutely terrible in the Super Bowl with Fisher out, but that performance isn’t reflective of how they played over the course of the year.

This is a good move, and it’s beefing up their offensive line for sure, I don’t know that they’re going to be meaningfully better than they were before Schwartz went down.
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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby MEuRaH » Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:56 am

Bronco Billy wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:43 ampff’s rankings aren’t the last word in assessment but they are thorough and pretty knowledgeable to what they are analyzing. They had KC’s O-line as the 11th best last year even with the Schwartz injury. That’s a far cry from being one of the worst units in the league.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2020 ... e-rankings
I stopped reading PFF long ago. They also rated Zack Moss as the top RB in last years class. I think they help highlight players who are under the radar, but I do not take their ratings as gospel. They try to use a statistical-based approach, and as a stats guy myself, I'm not buying it.

Mahomes is so good that he can help any bad O-line. I don't know how many times he got hit or how many times he had to scramble vs the 2019 season, but I wouldn't be shocked to see those numbers increase. If that line really was the 11th best, I don't see a reason why the Chiefs brass would feel the need to give it a full overhaul like they did.

But hey, regardless of where our opinions differ, I think we can both agree that the line has improved, yes? If yes, we should see an improvement in offensive performance too.
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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby Bronco Billy » Sat Apr 24, 2021 9:23 am

dlf_mikeh wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:56 am
Bronco Billy wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:43 ampff’s rankings aren’t the last word in assessment but they are thorough and pretty knowledgeable to what they are analyzing. They had KC’s O-line as the 11th best last year even with the Schwartz injury. That’s a far cry from being one of the worst units in the league.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2020 ... e-rankings
I stopped reading PFF long ago. They also rated Zack Moss as the top RB in last years class. I think they help highlight players who are under the radar, but I do not take their ratings as gospel. They try to use a statistical-based approach, and as a stats guy myself, I'm not buying it.
You might want to take care in those kinds of judgments. Glass houses and stones, my friend. No animosity intended.

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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby MEuRaH » Sat Apr 24, 2021 9:41 am

Bronco Billy wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 9:23 amYou might want to take care in those kinds of judgments. Glass houses and stones, my friend. No animosity intended.
I'm just saying they rely on stats too much. I love it for that aspect alone, but the O-line for KC was absolutely helped by the ability of Mahomes to get rid of the football and avoid defenders. So while the statistical ranking of the O-line may be 11th overall, I think there are a host of variables as to why that is the case.

If it really was 11th best, why would the Chiefs go out of their way to replace everyone immediately? It doesn't add up.
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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby Pullo Vision » Sat Apr 24, 2021 12:28 pm

I've been wondering WTH Alejandro Villanueva has gone unsigned by anyone all this time, but the talk of him replacing Brown makes this a great combo of moves for Baltimore.
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Re: Ravens trade Orlando Brown to KC

Postby bjd5211 » Sat Apr 24, 2021 1:10 pm

Bronco Billy wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:30 am
bjd5211 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 4:32 pm
sugbear65 wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:57 pm Well they did release Eric Fisher(and RT Schwartz). I get the trade, get a younger version on the upside of his career. It was a good deal. But I think it’s a stretch to view this as some massive upgrade as much as keeping the status quo. They are a SB team, and just like the Bucs it makes sense to try and field a similar team as last year. But I don’t view this as some upgrade to CEH, more like not a reason to ding him.
It IS a massive upgrade over what they had currently on the roster though. The best OT they had on the roster was a 3rd round pick last year who opted out of his rookie year due to COVID, it was a glaring hole and now they have a guy who is at the very least a highly competent starter (which is highly valuable at that position), and potentially a top 10 or so OT in the league.
True, but that wasn’t what they had at starting OTs during the regular season last year. IMO this is probably pretty close to break even, maybe a slight lean to this year over last year. This shouldn’t move CEH’s stock much if at all.
It's a massive upgrade over what they had going into this season, and the big issue for the KC OL last year before the OT injuries was the interior. They significantly improved their interior but had created huge question marks at OT, which now have been addressed significantly.


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