Massive Overhaul for 2021

[OhSnapItsAnt]

I’m not sure what you want to hear anymore.. When you first posted this, you made really bad trades IMO. Since then you made some more bad trades IMO but also a few good ones.
I think over this time span you’ve lost a lot of value. If I had a choice, I’d rather have your old team to get all my lost value and start over again hoping to also get the good trades you did.
So basically when I look back, I see a lot of lost value but also some good trades that really helped your team.

[murphysxm]

Maybe if you didn't use players stats that were ruled out of the game this year from your last year's team in your comparison I could provide productive feedback.

[The MAC Machine]

I just don't understand what pieces you added moving Cook and Kyler. There should be glaring upgrades somewhere and I don't see them.

To your original post

Kyler turned into Chubb,
Chubb turned into Jacobs, Collins, Marv. Jones, 2022 2nd and 2022 3rd
Cook turned into Fournette, Landry, and a 2021 2nd

So Kyler and Cook basically turned into Fournette, Jacobs, Landry, Marv. Jones, Mo Alie Cox, Alex Collins, Minshew, 2 x 2021 2nd, 2022 2nd and 2022 3rd

Maybe if you didn't use players stats that were ruled out of the game this year from your last year's team in your comparison I could provide productive feedback.

Again, if you look at my original roster, theres not much else for me to start (Lamar Miller, Breida, Cam Sims, etc) which is why I went in the direction I did to build more depth. Injuries and lack of quality depth options dismantled my team last year, so Im not sure if you're being serious here or just trying to be condescending to cover up your saltiness. Did highlighting Murray and Cook in red hit a nerve? Or maybe it was this

I see no future at all in LF.

I think you should sit this one out until you're open to having a real conversation.

[The MAC Machine]

I’m not sure what you want to hear anymore.. When you first posted this, you made really bad trades IMO. Since then you made some more bad trades IMO but also a few good ones.
I think over this time span you’ve lost a lot of value. If I had a choice, I’d rather have your old team to get all my lost value and start over again hoping to also get the good trades you did.
So basically when I look back, I see a lot of lost value but also some good trades that really helped your team.

The question isnt about my personal validation. What I want to hear is very simple....I am posing the questions
what actually makes a trade "good" or "bad" to someone?
What does "good" or "bad" specifically mean?
How do we decide a trade is "good" or "bad" until we see the results?
And if the results of a trade produce different results than what we expected then does that change the way we evaluate a trade?
Those questions are the heart of the dialogue I am getting at.

For example: Cook for Fournette, Landry and a 2nd may have been an unpopular, risky, sub-optimal trade at the time. But at this point does that actually mean "bad"? On the flipside Pittman, Boyd and Landry for Ridley has been praised as a "good" trade. But at this point it kind of seems like a popular, and safe trade more than a productive trade (in fact it has been killing me this week). Its important to clarify because a trade can be risky, unpopular, or maybe not max value and still be a solid and profitable trade or it can be safe, and popular and be a terrible deal. Again, the goal is to partake in an exercise of clarifying what exactly "good" or "bad" actually means to you. By many different standards it looks like I made more "bad" trades than "good", but somehow my team is performing better across the board. That being said I think its a reasonable question to pose to everyone using my real time example what does all of this feedback actually mean?

[CGW]

Do we need this post weekly with the same comments for the whole season?

[OhSnapItsAnt]

I just don't understand what pieces you added moving Cook and Kyler. There should be glaring upgrades somewhere and I don't see them.

To your original post

Kyler turned into Chubb,
Chubb turned into Jacobs, Collins, Marv. Jones, 2022 2nd and 2022 3rd
Cook turned into Fournette, Landry, and a 2021 2nd

So Kyler and Cook basically turned into Fournette, Jacobs, Landry, Marv. Jones, Mo Alie Cox, Alex Collins, Minshew, 2 x 2021 2nd, 2022 2nd and 2022 3rd

Maybe if you didn't use players stats that were ruled out of the game this year from your last year's team in your comparison I could provide productive feedback.

Again, if you look at my original roster, theres not much else for me to start (Lamar Miller, Breida, Cam Sims, etc) which is why I went in the direction I did to build more depth. Injuries and lack of quality depth options dismantled my team last year, so Im not sure if you're being serious here or just trying to be condescending to cover up your saltiness. Did highlighting Murray and Cook in red hit a nerve? Or maybe it was this

I see no future at all in LF.

I think you should sit this one out until you're open to having a real conversation.

If you have all the right answers… why are you asking for opinions?

So Kyler and Cook basically turned into Fournette, Jacobs, Landry, Marv. Jones, Mo Alie Cox, Alex Collins, Minshew, 2 x 2021 2nd, 2022 2nd and 2022 3rd

I’d try to explain how this wasn’t a good trade but it would be pointless trying to explain it to you. You should also have some respect for peoples opinions, especially when you’re asking for it.

[MyTeam]

Solid Ridley deal. I really like that buy.

Overall I am just confused by the thread? I feel like you lacked depth so you undersold on a bunch of studs. Comparing a 0 from someone hurt this year to an 8 from someone you have now isn't very helpful. I don't think people are saying that you didn't need depth, because you clearly did. I just think that you moved pieces way cheaper than you could have. You might have improved your starting lineup but you definitely lost value in some of those trades.

[The MAC Machine]

I’d try to explain how this wasn’t a good trade but it would be pointless trying to explain it to you. You should also have some respect for peoples opinions, especially when you’re asking for it.

This isnt about respect. Its about posing hard questions about how different people form their opinions. That can be done without putting people down or disrespecting anyone. This could be a great conversation about so many things
-how player values change over time
-what does it mean to "look like a contender"
-different ways to rebuild.
-What makes a good/bad trade
-Comparing and contrasting value vs production and how that impacts some of the questions above.

There are as littany of great potential conversations here and Im completely open to hearing peoples thoughts on all of these things. The conflict is that if you look through the thread not many people have provided anything really productive or substantial in terms of in reasoning. In fact, the general tone has been pretty dismissive of any possibility of their views being flawed - even in spite of real time evidence suggesting it. The thread was never about the trades or my own validation, it has just spiraled into a flexing of egos because many people in this thread are being faced with pressing evidence that MAYBE...just MAYBE their views on a player, how to rebuild, how values change, what a contender looks like, etc...could use more perspective.

I have already admitted to shortcomings. But I feel like the humility is not really going both ways. Instead we are clogging the thread with nonsense and ego when we could be having really good conversations about all of our shortcomings - which is the entire point of all of this.

[SteveMaddensShoes]

I have 2 oranges. You have 1 apple.
I think both my oranges are worth 1 apple. I am willing to give you both my oranges for 1 apple.
You think your apple is equal to or less than 1 orange and that I have over valued the apple. BUT, you also know that I believe your apple is worth 2 oranges.
How do you take advantage of this situation?

This sums up most of the arguments in the thread. It has nothing to do with the true value of the oranges or apples.

[MaddMadden]

Wow this post is still alive!?

[The MAC Machine]

STARTING LINEUPS 2021 WEEK 6 RESULTS COMPARISON
Kyler Murray (30 points) vs Mac Jones (19 points)
Brady (22 points) vs Darnold (16 points)
Cook (21 points) vs Fournette (31 points)
McKissic (19 points) vs Jacobs (15 points)
Godwin (9 points) vs Mike Williams (5 points)
Sutton (23 points) vs Sutton (23 points)
Golladay (OUT) vs Cooper (11 points)
De. Parker (OUT) vs Marvin Jones (23 points)
Coleman (BYE) vs Collins (17 points)
Cobb (0 points) vs Harris (18 points)
Jarwin (8 points) vs Seals-Jones (18 points)
Asiasi (0 points) vs Mo Alie-Cox (10 points)
= 132 points vs 206 points


TOP BENCH OPTIONS
Rodgers (28 points) vs Geno Smith (11 points)
Proche (0 points) vs Jarwin (8 points)
Breida (TBD points) vs DeeJay Dallas (TBD points)

BEST POTENTIAL LINEUP:
138 points vs 206 points

And that doesnt include honorable Mentions from my current team that were on the bench
Tyrod Taylor (IR)
Juju (IR)
Chark (IR)
Ridley (BYE)
CPatterson (BYE)

[The MAC Machine]

STARTING LINEUPS COMPARISON THROUGH 6 WEEKS

Week 1: 162 points vs 175 points
Week 2: 190 points vs 139 points
Week 3: 109 points vs 148 points
Week 4: 170 points vs 187 points
Week 5: 110 points vs 168 points
Week 6: 132 points vs 206 points
Total: 873 points (Previous) vs 1023 points (Current)

BEST POTENTIAL LINEUP:
Week 1: 198 points vs 204 points
Week 2: 213 points vs 205 points
Week 3: 129 points vs 163 points
Week 4: 170 points vs 212 points
Week 5: 120 points vs 195 points
Week 6: 138 points vs 206 points
Total: 969 points (Previous) vs 1185 points (Current)

STARTING LINEUP EFFICIENCY
Week 1: 82% vs 86%
Week 2: 89% vs 68%
Week 3: 84% vs 91%
Week 4: 100% vs 88%
Week 5: 92% vs 86%
Week 6: 96% vs 100%
Total: 90% (Previous) vs 86% (Current)

RECORD IN LEAGUE THROUGH WEEK 6
Previous Team: 0-6
Current Team: 4-2

CURRENT TEAM VS PREVIOUS TEAM
Current team: 5-1

[The MAC Machine]

The reason why Im including BYE week players and players that did not play is to demonstrate how shallow my initial roster actually was.

STARTING LINEUPS 2021 WEEK 7 RESULTS COMPARISON
Kyler Murray (28 points) vs Mac Jones (26 points)
Brady (32 points) vs Darnold (2 points)
Cook (BYE) vs Fournette (17 points)
McKissic (10 points) vs Jacobs (16 points)
Godwin (25 points) vs Ridley (13 points)
Sutton (12 points) vs Sutton (12 points)
Golladay (DNP) vs Patterson (14 points)
De. Parker (DNP) vs Harris (25 points)
Coleman (DNP) vs Collins (5 points)
Cobb (5 points) vs D. Dallas (0 points)
Jarwin (BYE) vs Seals-Jones (14 points)
Asiasi (DNP) vs Mo Alie-Cox (13 points)
= 112 points vs 157 points

TOP BENCH OPTIONS
Rodgers (31 points) vs Geno Smith (15 points)
Jordan Howard (DNP) vs Bart Scott (10 points)
Proche (0 points) vs JJ Taylor (16 points)
Breida (DNP) vs S. Perine (17 points)


BEST POTENTIAL LINEUP:
115 points vs 192 points

And that doesnt include honorable Mentions from my current team that were on the bench
Mike Williams (BYE)
Cooper (BYE)
Marvin Jones (BYE)
Tyrod Taylor (IR)
Juju (IR)
Chark (IR)

[CGW]