Moncrief Value in Picks

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Bandonij
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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby Bandonij » Sun Apr 24, 2016 10:19 am

MrPerfect wrote:
Bandonij wrote:I think Moncrief vs Doctson is a good debate. Both the same age, physically talented and might need a bit more work to become elite, but both are capable. I would prefer the 1.02 to both. I would probably trade the 1.03 for Moncrief if I was sure Zeke or Tread wouldn't be there at that pick.

And what's with the guy who is saying everyone is a lier if they value Moncrief higher than 1.05? What a joke. Look at his rankings and ADP. It lines up with the value of 1.03. ANd most people that own him are probably going to be believers in the guy and value him higher. I might not agree with valuing him crazy high, but I wouldn't call them a lier
What has Moncrief done in the nfl to warrant this discussion.
Im all ears and can be persuaded.
Haha. What have any of the rookies done to warrant this discussion? We're arguing about a bunch of talented unproven players here. No one is saying Moncrief is proven, but you can't use that as reason to knock him and then turn around and promote rookies. I'm not a huge Moncrief lover, but I'll gladly lay out why people are so high on him.

1) Age. He's a third year player who is 23. Same age as doctson, but he has actually proven capable of being an NFL starter and putting up ok numbers (nothing that impressive yet). he also had an elite breakout age in college which is correlated to NFL success. I know Footballoutsiders has evidence to support that.
2) He has an elite physical profile. His Jump numbers and size adjusted 40 yd dash (or speed score) are fantastic. He's a better pure athlete than any 2016 rookie WRs, though I think Tread is a far more polished WR. Which is why I prefer the 1.02 to Moncrief. But Moncrief has a higher ceiling and I'll admit that.
3) He's shown improvement each year in the NFL. This is big since he was considered raw coming out.
4) he's tied to an elite QB in a pass happy offense that just a lost a lot of targets this year when AJ and Fleener left. Dorsett has proven nothing yet, so it looks like Hilton and Moncrief will be the main beneficiaries of this
5) He's much bigger than the other 2 top WRs on his depth chart. I'm very high on Hilton but considering the size difference, you have to assume Moncrief will get more redzone looks and TDs than Hilton or Dorsett.
10 team, 0.5 ppr. Start 1QB 2RBs 2WRs 1TE 2(RB/WR/TE) 1DST.
QB: Wilson, Tannehill
RB: CJ Anderson, Gore, Foster, Ellington, Spiller, K Williams, D Lewis, Alf
WR: OBJ, Evans, Dez, K Allen, K White, John Brown, Gordon, Conley, D Baldwin
TE: Eifert, L. Green, Ebron
2016 picks: 1.07, 3.07
2015 League Runner up.

10 team full ppr. Start 1QB 2RBs 3WRs 1TE 2(RB/WR/TE) 1DST.
QB: Luck , Romo
RB: Forsett, M Gordon, Gurley, Rawls, Zenner
WR: OBJ, TY Hilton, BMarsh, Maclin, Lockett, Marvin, Latimer
TE: Reed
2016 Picks: 1.06, 2.07, 3.10
2015 League Champ. Worst to first!

12 team full ppr, 1.5 for TE. Start 1QB 2RBs 3WRs 1TE 2(RB/WR/TE) 1DST.
QB: ARod
RB: Duke, Dion, Spiller, Bolden, Jennings, Ridley
WR: K Benjamin, Baldwin, Diggs, Agholor, T Benjamin, Conley, Hunter, Stevie, Kearse, TY Montgomery, Torrey
TE: Walford, D Allen, Gilmore, V. Green
2016 Picks: 1.04, 3.11, 3.14
2017 picks 2 1sts, 2 2nds, 2 3rds
2018 picks 2 1sts, 1 2nd, 1 3rd
Just took over as an orphan 04/10/16

yooperbacker
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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby yooperbacker » Sun Apr 24, 2016 10:34 am

Moncrief has shown improvement in hands catching technique as well as refining underneath route technique. Had he shown these things in college, he would have been drafted much higher with his physical profile. Doctson will need to show he can get off press coverage and Coleman will need to learn to run a more complete route tree and both will need a very good situation for me to move them ahead of moncrief. And I'm still waiting to here that prospect at 2.4 who can be the same caliber as moncrief...
16 Team 53 man roster ppr tack heavy idp (1qb, 1-3rbs, 2-5wrs, 1-3te)
Qb:P. Rivers, T. Taylor, C. Daniels
Rb:D. Johnson, G. Bernard, J. Mixon, A. Kamara
Wr:S. Watkins, K. Allen, D. Moncrief, A. Cooper, K. White, Doctson, C. Davis
Te: T. Eifert, Z. Ertz, A. Derby

MrPerfect
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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby MrPerfect » Sun Apr 24, 2016 12:55 pm

Coogan23 wrote:
skip wrote:Coogan's valuation is correct...
If I had a nickel for every time..... 8-)
you would have one nickel?

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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby bigbuck22 » Sun Apr 24, 2016 4:26 pm

Opinions seem to vary quite a bit here...

Let's do this...Rank these guys based on value and we'll all assume Treadwell is worth 1.2. I'll throw a couple others in for reference.

Moncrief, J Matthews, Treadwell, Doctson, Coleman, Shepard, DGB
12 Team PPR/Superflex; Start 1QB, 2RB, 3WR, 1TE, 1Superflex 1K, 1DST
QB: Wilson, Cousins Love
RB: Elliott, JRobinson, Fournette, Ingram, Dobbins
WR: Hopkins, D Adams, Landry, Gallup, Perriman, Cobb, Cole
TE: Hurst, Goedert, Herndon, I Smith

2021 1st

Missile
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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby Missile » Sun Apr 24, 2016 4:37 pm

MrPerfect wrote:
yup you need guys like me if you guys are so sure to believe a wr who aint done squat after a few years is even worth a first.
You might want to ask the powers that be if you can be a part of the mock drafts done on here. Moncrief is currently going between 1.01 and 1.02. They need your help too.

gateway400
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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby gateway400 » Sun Apr 24, 2016 5:53 pm

MrPerfect wrote:
gateway400 wrote:
Coogan23 wrote:You might be able to get him for 1.06+2.06 (most of his owners think he's the next Arob).

I think he's worth about 1.05 by itself.
I have to interject here being a Moncrief owner. Unless it's a top 2 Pick in this year's class I will hold. I would rather roll the dice with an uber athete tied to an elite QB and offense. Im not sure I'd even pull the trigger with the 1.02. I feel the strong need to see what comes to fruition this year. I have a feeling I will not be disappointed with the decision to hold him. Is this hyperbole....maybe....either way I will hold. Just giving you insight to one of his owners thoughts on him.
You wouldnt trade moncrief for 1.2? the disingeuous comments from some trying drive value is what inhibits these conversations because you have to have people like me call out that nonsesne. I thought 1.5 was a bad deal... 1.2? I'm calling you a :liar:
The only disingenuous thing on this thread is your spelling of big words, there I corrected the spelling (in red just to help you out :wall: ) for you but you probably already knew that since you imply that you are a genius. The only two players I would personally take in this draft over Moncrief is Elliott & D. Henry and thats mostly because of my teams needs. I am solid at WR and weak at RB. I personally feel like Elliott is the only "sure thing" in this draft if there is such a thing. Do I believe Treadwell is a sure fire stud, NO. If he or Doctson end up in Buffalo or Cleveland are you still tooting your horn for them? Did you see their combines....neither were out of this world. Moncrief is going into his third year with a arguably one of the top QBs in the NFL. Also, if I were you I would try to refrain from calling anyone a liar that you do not know anything about. As implied in my original post these are my opinions and Im letting you all in on "one of his owners thoughts". :crazy:

P.S. If you need any help on spelling let me know I can help you out. Also, if you need to know what P.S. stands for just let me know I will help you out Mr. Genius. How about you do a little of this: :shh:
Last edited by gateway400 on Mon Apr 25, 2016 3:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
1/2 ppr, 1ppr for TE, $200 Salary Cap, 10 teams, Start 1 QB, 1-3 RB, 2-6 WR, 1-3 TE, 1 K, 1 Def

QB: B. Mayfield($4-15), J. Garoppollo($1-9)(Andy Dalton$21-5)
RB: T. Gurley ($10-5), D. Johnson($1-2), L. Bell ($30-1), M. Brown($2-2), C. Edmonds($2-5)
WR: Mi. Thomas($3-4), M. Evans($8-5), JuJu Smith-Schuster($4-5), T. Boyd($1-6), M. Williams($9-9), D. Pettis($2-9), M. Goodwin($1-3), B. Perriman($2-2)
TE: E. Engram ($4-7), O.J. Howard ($7-7), E. Ebron ($3-3), V. McDonald($1-1), T. Eifert($5-2)
K: G. Zuerlein ($1-3)
Def: Rams D($2-5)

Taxi Squad: D. Jones($2), D. Slayton($2), D. Henderson($4)

Draft Picks:

Trophy Room:
2018: 1st Place! CHAMPIONSHIP!!! 3peat! :dance:
2017: 1st Place! Championship!!
2016: 1st Place! Championship!
2015: 3rd Place
2014: 4th Place
2013: 8th Place

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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby gateway400 » Sun Apr 24, 2016 6:08 pm

Bandonij wrote:
MrPerfect wrote:
Bandonij wrote:I think Moncrief vs Doctson is a good debate. Both the same age, physically talented and might need a bit more work to become elite, but both are capable. I would prefer the 1.02 to both. I would probably trade the 1.03 for Moncrief if I was sure Zeke or Tread wouldn't be there at that pick.

And what's with the guy who is saying everyone is a lier if they value Moncrief higher than 1.05? What a joke. Look at his rankings and ADP. It lines up with the value of 1.03. ANd most people that own him are probably going to be believers in the guy and value him higher. I might not agree with valuing him crazy high, but I wouldn't call them a lier
What has Moncrief done in the nfl to warrant this discussion.
Im all ears and can be persuaded.
Haha. What have any of the rookies done to warrant this discussion? We're arguing about a bunch of talented unproven players here. No one is saying Moncrief is proven, but you can't use that as reason to knock him and then turn around and promote rookies. I'm not a huge Moncrief lover, but I'll gladly lay out why people are so high on him.

1) Age. He's a third year player who is 23. Same age as doctson, but he has actually proven capable of being an NFL starter and putting up ok numbers (nothing that impressive yet). he also had an elite breakout age in college which is correlated to NFL success. I know Footballoutsiders has evidence to support that.
2) He has an elite physical profile. His Jump numbers and size adjusted 40 yd dash (or speed score) are fantastic. He's a better pure athlete than any 2016 rookie WRs, though I think Tread is a far more polished WR. Which is why I prefer the 1.02 to Moncrief. But Moncrief has a higher ceiling and I'll admit that.
3) He's shown improvement each year in the NFL. This is big since he was considered raw coming out.
4) he's tied to an elite QB in a pass happy offense that just a lost a lot of targets this year when AJ and Fleener left. Dorsett has proven nothing yet, so it looks like Hilton and Moncrief will be the main beneficiaries of this
5) He's much bigger than the other 2 top WRs on his depth chart. I'm very high on Hilton but considering the size difference, you have to assume Moncrief will get more redzone looks and TDs than Hilton or Dorsett.
I couldn't have said it any better than this. If you need any help understanding any of this Mr. Perfection just let me know and I can help you try to understand it. There are some big words in this improvement, breakout, redzone.....you just let me know if you need any help deciphering what they mean....oh crap there I go with a big word deciphering....deciphering means: Discovering the meaning of. Crap...another big word......Discovering means: finding (something or someone) unexpectedly or in the course of a search. Crap another big word unexpectedly....I've got to stop there this could never end.
1/2 ppr, 1ppr for TE, $200 Salary Cap, 10 teams, Start 1 QB, 1-3 RB, 2-6 WR, 1-3 TE, 1 K, 1 Def

QB: B. Mayfield($4-15), J. Garoppollo($1-9)(Andy Dalton$21-5)
RB: T. Gurley ($10-5), D. Johnson($1-2), L. Bell ($30-1), M. Brown($2-2), C. Edmonds($2-5)
WR: Mi. Thomas($3-4), M. Evans($8-5), JuJu Smith-Schuster($4-5), T. Boyd($1-6), M. Williams($9-9), D. Pettis($2-9), M. Goodwin($1-3), B. Perriman($2-2)
TE: E. Engram ($4-7), O.J. Howard ($7-7), E. Ebron ($3-3), V. McDonald($1-1), T. Eifert($5-2)
K: G. Zuerlein ($1-3)
Def: Rams D($2-5)

Taxi Squad: D. Jones($2), D. Slayton($2), D. Henderson($4)

Draft Picks:

Trophy Room:
2018: 1st Place! CHAMPIONSHIP!!! 3peat! :dance:
2017: 1st Place! Championship!!
2016: 1st Place! Championship!
2015: 3rd Place
2014: 4th Place
2013: 8th Place

Nuk
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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby Nuk » Sun Apr 24, 2016 6:09 pm

The most polarizing player in dynasty... As long as he continues improving his route running and luck is the QB for the full season, Moncrief will easily be a WR2 in fantasy.

gateway400
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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby gateway400 » Sun Apr 24, 2016 6:25 pm

theone wrote:I would put Moncrief's value in the mid first range this year. He had yardage totals of 46,122,32,69,34,18,30 in the games with Luck last season averaging a ridiculously low 6.5 yards/target which was among the worst in the league. To put this in context, this was less than Heath Miller, Jason Witten, Danny Woodhead, and Theo Riddick among most others. He will likely lose targets to Allen and Dorsett in the future. Moncrief's play does not match his combine, one of the reasons he was drafted in the 3rd round of the NFL draft. He is not a redzone threat like Dez or Gronk who you can line up one on one on the outside and expect to win a large amount of the time. Moncrief may be the most overrated prospect in the league with this bizarre notion that he will overtake Hilton as the WR1 in IND. He is being price as one of the elite prospects in dynasty, but in reality, you are hoping he becomes Allen Hurns.
Mr. Perfect....if you want to learn to argue a point to where people will listen and take note then you need to read this deep and detailed argument against Moncrief. This is the type of writing that will keep his value at bay and make everyone realize he, just like the rookies, is not a sure thing. If you keep staying "aggressive", sorry for the big word, you will continually be attacked. Of course, I am sure that is exactly your goal in these forums. You want to be the aggressor and try to get under peoples skin so you can have a good laugh. I've seen a few other posts where you have been very aggressive and argumentative. Psychology 101, and TV :biggrin: , taught me that something is going on at home, the wife or girlfriend beats you up or something like that, so to vent that anger you take your aggression out in other venues of your life. Holy Crap....I've been watching too much Criminal Minds...lol
1/2 ppr, 1ppr for TE, $200 Salary Cap, 10 teams, Start 1 QB, 1-3 RB, 2-6 WR, 1-3 TE, 1 K, 1 Def

QB: B. Mayfield($4-15), J. Garoppollo($1-9)(Andy Dalton$21-5)
RB: T. Gurley ($10-5), D. Johnson($1-2), L. Bell ($30-1), M. Brown($2-2), C. Edmonds($2-5)
WR: Mi. Thomas($3-4), M. Evans($8-5), JuJu Smith-Schuster($4-5), T. Boyd($1-6), M. Williams($9-9), D. Pettis($2-9), M. Goodwin($1-3), B. Perriman($2-2)
TE: E. Engram ($4-7), O.J. Howard ($7-7), E. Ebron ($3-3), V. McDonald($1-1), T. Eifert($5-2)
K: G. Zuerlein ($1-3)
Def: Rams D($2-5)

Taxi Squad: D. Jones($2), D. Slayton($2), D. Henderson($4)

Draft Picks:

Trophy Room:
2018: 1st Place! CHAMPIONSHIP!!! 3peat! :dance:
2017: 1st Place! Championship!!
2016: 1st Place! Championship!
2015: 3rd Place
2014: 4th Place
2013: 8th Place

AlcoholEnthusiast
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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby AlcoholEnthusiast » Sun Apr 24, 2016 9:23 pm

bigbuck22 wrote:Opinions seem to vary quite a bit here...

Let's do this...Rank these guys based on value and we'll all assume Treadwell is worth 1.2. I'll throw a couple others in for reference.

Moncrief, J Matthews, Treadwell, Doctson, Coleman, Shepard, DGB
Treadwell
DGB
Coleman
J Matt
Doctson
Shepard
Moncrief
12 Team 1QB 2RB 3WE 1TE 2Flex

QB: Mariota, Siemian, Fitzpatrick
RB: Zeke, Freeman, CJA, Morris, Ty, Jamaal Williams
WR: Arob, Diggs, Parker, Hurns, Tate, Stills, Conley, Enunwa,
TE: Ertz, Gates, Kroft, Paul


12 Team Superflex

QB: Mariota, Winston, Dak, Jimmy G
RB: Mixon, CMC, Gio, Ty, Jamaal Williams, Zenner
WR: Coleman, M Williams, Landry, Lockett, Zay, Shepard, JuJu, Woods, Mitchell, Lee, Taywan Taylor
TE: Njoku, Hooper, Higbee

FFFAN
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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby FFFAN » Sun Apr 24, 2016 9:54 pm

theone wrote:I would put Moncrief's value in the mid first range this year. He had yardage totals of 46,122,32,69,34,18,30 in the games with Luck last season averaging a ridiculously low 6.5 yards/target which was among the worst in the league. To put this in context, this was less than Heath Miller, Jason Witten, Danny Woodhead, and Theo Riddick among most others. He will likely lose targets to Allen and Dorsett in the future. Moncrief's play does not match his combine, one of the reasons he was drafted in the 3rd round of the NFL draft. He is not a redzone threat like Dez or Gronk who you can line up one on one on the outside and expect to win a large amount of the time. Moncrief may be the most overrated prospect in the league with this bizarre notion that he will overtake Hilton as the WR1 in IND. He is being price as one of the elite prospects in dynasty, but in reality, you are hoping he becomes Allen Hurns.
Luck hurt his shoulder week 3 vs the Titans. Moncrief was his most effective target in those first 3 games. I know its only a 3 game sample size but I think a healthy Luck and chuds offense will line up moncrief for a top 15 season. I own Moncrief in one league and I would only deal him for 1.1.

Factory of Sadness
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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby Factory of Sadness » Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:05 am

Treadwell
Moncrief
DGB
J Matt
Coleman
Doctson
Shepard

Funny how we have different opinions no?

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Re: Moncrief Value in Picks

Postby jarridgil » Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:40 am

Treadwell
DGB
Coleman
J Matt
Doctson
Moncrief
Shepard
12 team league. 2 new owners created an expansion league. 1qb 2rb 2wr 1te 1flx
Qb. Tyrod.
Rb. T coleman. J Howard. T Hightower. R MAthews. J Richard.K Marshall. D Williams
Wr. A Jeffery. Treadwell. Corey coleman. D Parker. P Dorsett. M Lee. P Richardson. J Gordon. D smith
Te. Gronk. Ebron.
Picks. 2017 1.3 and 1 late first. 2 3rds 2 4ths. 2018 1 1st 2 2nds 3 3rds 4th and 5th & 19 all picks + 1 1st

Picks 1.1 and 1.2 are locked to the expansion teams until 2020


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