Postby pntgvn2399 » Thu Feb 03, 2011 2:57 pm
airlex wrote:pntgvn2399 wrote:airlex wrote:I think it's fairly easy to look at a guy like Tebow that had so much success on a college level and as popular as he is, and form a very strong opinion one way or the other. The people I want to hear from are the ones that have changed their minds since he was drafted...there's been quite a few "experts" that have changed their opinion about him as an NFL QB after seeing him on the field.
Here's my take: I voted "good" because I think whatever deficiencies he has with his release, arm, whatever, he makes up for with scrambling ability. From the few games I saw with him as the starter, I saw a ton of potential and the ability to make all the NFL throws. If you look at the game where Lloyd caught the "wobbler" in the end zone, you'd also see the bullet that Lance Ball dropped in the end zone that hit him in the numbers.
I know someone said he was completing "short little passes" and struggled on the long ones, but I would disagree. If you look at his average yds per attempt and average yds per completion they compare favorably with guys like Brees, Schaub, Brady, Manning, etc.
Tebow - Y/A 8.0, Y/C 16.0
Brees - Y/A 7.0, Y/C 10.3
Schaub - Y/A 7.6, Y/C 12.0
Brady - Y/A 7.9, Y/C 12.9
Manning - Y/A 6.9, Y/C 10.4
Even in limited action, those don't look like stats from someone dinking and dunking their way down the field. There's plenty technique-wise to criticize Tebow for, but that wasn't accurate. I think the statement that he doesn't have the ability to complete 60% of his passes is crazy too. I'm not saying he will for sure, but if you compare his college stats of 66% completion percentage to others from the SEC, he compares favorably there too.
Peyton Manning - 62.5
Eli Manning - 60.8
Jay Cutler - 57.2
Matt Stafford - 57.1
Jason Campbell - 64.6
Hmm, interesting huh? If you look at the player individually and not have pre-conceived ideas of him, it helps give a more true picture of reality.
Come on now.. You are comparing a guy that played in 3 games with guys that played the whole season.. Also not to start an argument on this but are you really bringing up college stats in regard to completion percentage?? Just because they have a good average in college DOES NOT mean that will be the case in the NFL at all.. I can make a list of 100's of guys that had great percentages in college that had no success in the NFL.. Lets see what he does the whole year (if he is even the starter!!) then come back and compare.. He may have had a 66% in college however in the NFL (where it matters) he is sitting at 49%..
Ok, so what would you suggest? In your above paragraph, you tell me two conflicting things - first you say not to compare a guy that played 3 games to a guy that played a whole season. Then you tell me not to look at college stats.
So, I'm asking you, what would you like to look at?
If you are going to comment about the 49% and use that as a factor "against" Tebow, then why are you discounting the factors I used "for" Tebow? Didn't they both happen in the 3 games he started? If you go back and read what I wrote, it's clear that I was addressing comments that other posters (yourself included) made that I believed to be incorrect based on what I've seen. You mentioned the "wobbler" to Lloyd, but not the bullet to Ball that he dropped. Someone else made the comment that he COULDN'T be a 60% passer, yet only have 3 games to back that up with. Another person made the comment that he only completed "short little passes" and I was providing information showing that wasn't true. What else would you like?
If you don't like him, then fine. That's totally up to you. I just thought I would try to bring some rational logic to the conversation along with my opinion, instead of just basing it off of opinion alone.
What would I like to look at? Well for making comparisons at least make them relevant and not compare a guy that played 3 games to guys that played a whole season.. Do you feel that is a logical or fair comparision?
In my comment about the 49% completion percentage I didn't go and pull up numbers for Brady ect because that is not a logical comparision.. What you did was totally discredit the 49% completion precentage and went back to his college days which have absolutely nothing to do with the NFL.. From what I remember didn't Jimmy Clausen have a 68 or 70% rate in college his senior year? Again college stats mean nothing now that they are in the NFL.. Also showing a QB's Y/C and Y/A does not mean he did not throw a majority of his passes that were "short".. Here are stats from ESPN in regards to his passes...
Week 15:
Tebow threw a total of 16 passes (8 completed).. Of those 16 passes exactly half (8) were deemed "short"..
Week 16:
Tebow threw a total of 29 passes (16 completed).. Of those 29 passes 21 were deemed "short"..
Week 17:
Tebow threw a total of 36 passes (16 completed).. Of those 36 passes 31 were deemed "short".. Of the 5 non short passes 2 were INT's
So I think you can safely say that most of his completions were in fact "short little passes"..
12 Team PPR IDP
Start 1 QB, 1 RB, 3 WR, 1 TE, 1 Flex 3-4-4 D
QB- P. Manning, Wilson, Carr
RB- McCoy, Foster, Ball, Vereen, Tate, Ivory, C. Michael, L Murray
WR- Megatron, Dez, Watkins, Gordon, Cooks, Quick, Nicks, Bowe, Shorts, M Wilson
TE- Cameron, Donnel, Green
DT- Jernigan
DE- Campbell, Vernon, Nincovich, Casey, Griffen
LB- David, Shazier, Smith, Tulloch, McClain, Riley, Collins, Alonzo (IR)
CB- Cason, Sherman, McCourty
S- Pollard, Landry, Chancellor, Mathieu, McDonald
12 Team PPR IDP
Start 1 QB, 1 RB, 3 WR, 1 TE, 1 Flex 3-4-4 D
QB- Kaepernick, Bortles
RB- Lynch, Bernard Vereen, J. Bell, Ivory, Michael, Robinson, L Murray
WR- Julio, Mi. Floyd, Crabtree, Woods, Lee, Nicks
TE- Graham, Green, Wright
DT- Joseph, Donald
DE- Quinn, C Jones, C Johnson, M Johnson, Clemons, Lawrence
LB-Worrilow, Dansby, Levy, Marshall , McClain, Bartu, Mauga, Alonzo (IR), Johnson (IR)
CB- Jospeh, Verner
S- Bethea, Jones, Blanton