Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby mild » Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:07 pm

zeeshan2 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:37 am
NBC Sports' Peter King said the Bills could draft Clemson's Travis Etienne with the 30th pick in the NFL Draft.
King said Etienne would be a "great puzzle piece in an offense that craves speed in the backfield." King argued that Buffalo's offense "in top-off mode," seeking a productive running back to fit the team's wildly productive offense.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2 ... t=Edge1248
From that same Peter King article, and perhaps something to bear in mind for anyone claiming this draft is sure-fire or in any way a "best draft" or "historically deep" one. This draft is a very dangerous flag-plant. (Love you and your work still, Mike)
"Perhaps some realism. In the runup to the draft, the vast majority of top prospects are talked about like they absolutely will make it and solve major holes on every team. Well, it hasn’t worked that way for some time. Like, ever. And with the weirdness of this year (opt-outs, no combine, major medical issues), I expect we’ll look back at the 2021 draft in, say, 2023 and say, “Why didn’t we see all these clunkers coming?"

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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby OhCruelestRanter » Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:32 pm

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I honestly don’t know if sharing this will get me banned. I thought it was an interesting opinion from a respected industry figure that’s addressing a topic that people in this thread have also addressed, so I thought it was worth sharing. Again, I genuinely don’t know if I’m going to be banned for this.
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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby MEuRaH » Mon Apr 26, 2021 6:35 pm

Ice wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 1:37 pm Arguing over a single word or an opinion is pretty sad and not useful. In the future disagreeing and moving on is the better move than attacking one that is doing massive research for the benefit of the community. That may not have been the intent but it reads that way.

I read no place that he demanded we agree with his assessment that this is the best or deepest class.
Good post. Disagree with what I said? Want to write a difference of opinion? Have at it. Most people here disagree that Etienne is the best RB in this class, for example. I'm fine with that, the opinions are fun to read and the back and forth is sometimes enlightening.

Follow me around and re-write my words to make it sound like I said something different, call me out on it and borderline start calling me names? That's trolling, which is illegal.

Speaking of disagreeing with me, I'm SHOCKED that most people disagree that Etienne isn't the best RB in this class. I think Harris has the better floor, but I always aim for the stars with my prospects. If that's the case, Etienne is my sure fire #1 RB in this class, no contest. And the more I look at it, the more places I think he's a good fit. There aren't that many teams who need to spend an early pick on a RB, and nearly all of those teams would put Etienne in a situation to shine immediately.

I have a 1.01 in a league in which the only RB on my roster is Marlon Mack. Etienne will most likely be my pick. We'll see where Chase ends up... but it's super hard to trade for a stud RB these days. Prices are through the roof.
mild wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:07 pm
"Perhaps some realism. In the runup to the draft, the vast majority of top prospects are talked about like they absolutely will make it and solve major holes on every team. Well, it hasn’t worked that way for some time. Like, ever. And with the weirdness of this year (opt-outs, no combine, major medical issues), I expect we’ll look back at the 2021 draft in, say, 2023 and say, “Why didn’t we see all these clunkers coming?"
Yeah and that's fair. It'll be very interesting to see how this all plays out, if injuries will increases or remain the same, and maybe the significance of the combine in general. I think about what you posted from time to time and question the significance of it all. That's probably why I spent so much more time on video this year. I couldn't completely trust all the pro day numbers this time around.

Ehh, we'll see.
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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby Shoreline Steamers » Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:03 pm

OhCruelestRanter wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 1:25 pm Well Mike threatened to ban me over this.
You do tend to bust his balls often. For some reason this feels like a personal vendetta of yours and I don't really get it.

You want to disagree with the guy? Fine. I think you could do so in a more respectful manner. Mike generally responds to you in a pretty level-headed way. Something you seem to be unwilling/unable to do. My 2-cents anyway.
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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby OhCruelestRanter » Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:15 pm

I should be clear- I respond to posts that I think are good or bad or interesting. If anybody else had called this RB group
dlf_mikeh wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 5:18 pmthe best draft class I've ever seen.
they would have received the same response.

The problem is very clearly not what I said but to whom I said it. Respectfully disagree with Mike and it’s trolling, and “borderline name calling” which is a hilarious accusation in and of itself and highlights that there are lines I don’t cross.

This whole thing is tiresome and feels like a low-point. The inability to tolerate criticism to the point that we’re now threatening to ban dissenters is shameful. Whatever.

Seeing as replying to the claim that this is the best draft class Mike has ever seen will apparently get me banned, we should get back to Etienne- I agree he should be the RB1 in this class. Williams is a sub-par athlete who split carries in college, and Harris is... maybe a sub-par athlete? I’m concerned that he didn’t test at all.

There’s been some Etienne to Buffalo smoke recently- I think Buffalo is a much, much better landing spot than Pittsburgh with their busted offensive line and inability to move on from Roethlisberger. It’s not perfect- Moss and Singletary represent better competition than Snell and McFarland, and I do worry that Allen is more likely to extend plays than check down, limiting the PPR upside. Still, I like the fit with that offense and could see Aaron Jones type production from Etienne in Buffalo.
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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby ArrylT » Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:51 pm

mild wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:07 pm
zeeshan2 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:37 am
NBC Sports' Peter King said the Bills could draft Clemson's Travis Etienne with the 30th pick in the NFL Draft.
King said Etienne would be a "great puzzle piece in an offense that craves speed in the backfield." King argued that Buffalo's offense "in top-off mode," seeking a productive running back to fit the team's wildly productive offense.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2 ... t=Edge1248
From that same Peter King article, and perhaps something to bear in mind for anyone claiming this draft is sure-fire or in any way a "best draft" or "historically deep" one. This draft is a very dangerous flag-plant. (Love you and your work still, Mike)
"Perhaps some realism. In the runup to the draft, the vast majority of top prospects are talked about like they absolutely will make it and solve major holes on every team. Well, it hasn’t worked that way for some time. Like, ever. And with the weirdness of this year (opt-outs, no combine, major medical issues), I expect we’ll look back at the 2021 draft in, say, 2023 and say, “Why didn’t we see all these clunkers coming?"
I certainly cannot disagree with that either. Personally, just because I remain pretty positive about, not just the RBs but the 2021 class as a whole, does not preclude me from being aware of the possibility that more players will be disappointments than I would like. We can only go by the information we've looked at, and make the decisions based off of that.

To me it is not an either / or proposition right now as there are too many moving parts. But I do feel that there are enough talented individuals that it will be hard, for me at least, to look back on the 2021 class as being a class of disappointment.

Anyways I am glad that we're almost there. In either 3 or 4 days we'll have more information to help us figure out if we feel Etienne (or any RB) is right for our team(s). I'm pretty confident that he'll land in a situation that is beneficial to him - but I cannot speak confidently yet to opportunity. For example Buffalo vs. Pittsburgh. Maybe Buffalo gets an edge in situation, but Pittsburgh gets an edge in opportunity. I've heard that there are teams where he is #1 on the teams board, and others where he is #3. I do not even know if he will go Day I but I'd be quite surprised if he did not go Rd 2.

I also think a persons expectation of Etienne will be key also. For example I think a lot of people think Fournette is a bust - whereas to me he has been a success. If Etienne has say 2 RB2 seasons and 1 RB1 season, that would be a success to me, but it might not be for someone else.

Finally I hope that if you are not sold on Etienne, this thread, along with the DLF draft guide, has been helpful in giving you enough information to make a decision, and if you are gung ho about Etienne, that you remain open to the possibility that not all goes according to expectation.
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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby esloan35 » Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:27 pm

dlf_mikeh wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 6:35 pm
Ice wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 1:37 pm Arguing over a single word or an opinion is pretty sad and not useful. In the future disagreeing and moving on is the better move than attacking one that is doing massive research for the benefit of the community. That may not have been the intent but it reads that way.

I read no place that he demanded we agree with his assessment that this is the best or deepest class.
Good post. Disagree with what I said? Want to write a difference of opinion? Have at it. Most people here disagree that Etienne is the best RB in this class, for example. I'm fine with that, the opinions are fun to read and the back and forth is sometimes enlightening.

Follow me around and re-write my words to make it sound like I said something different, call me out on it and borderline start calling me names? That's trolling, which is illegal.

Speaking of disagreeing with me, I'm SHOCKED that most people disagree that Etienne isn't the best RB in this class. I think Harris has the better floor, but I always aim for the stars with my prospects. If that's the case, Etienne is my sure fire #1 RB in this class, no contest. And the more I look at it, the more places I think he's a good fit. There aren't that many teams who need to spend an early pick on a RB, and nearly all of those teams would put Etienne in a situation to shine immediately.

I have a 1.01 in a league in which the only RB on my roster is Marlon Mack. Etienne will most likely be my pick. We'll see where Chase ends up... but it's super hard to trade for a stud RB these days. Prices are through the roof.
mild wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:07 pm
"Perhaps some realism. In the runup to the draft, the vast majority of top prospects are talked about like they absolutely will make it and solve major holes on every team. Well, it hasn’t worked that way for some time. Like, ever. And with the weirdness of this year (opt-outs, no combine, major medical issues), I expect we’ll look back at the 2021 draft in, say, 2023 and say, “Why didn’t we see all these clunkers coming?"
Yeah and that's fair. It'll be very interesting to see how this all plays out, if injuries will increases or remain the same, and maybe the significance of the combine in general. I think about what you posted from time to time and question the significance of it all. That's probably why I spent so much more time on video this year. I couldn't completely trust all the pro day numbers this time around.

Ehh, we'll see.
I’m with you all day on Etienne, killed me last year when he didn’t come out. Hoping for a great landing spot!

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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby Pullo Vision » Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:56 pm

dlf_mikeh wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 6:35 pmI'm SHOCKED that most people disagree that Etienne isn't the best RB in this class. I think Harris has the better floor, but I always aim for the stars with my prospects. If that's the case, Etienne is my sure fire #1 RB in this class, no contest. And the more I look at it, the more places I think he's a good fit. There aren't that many teams who need to spend an early pick on a RB, and nearly all of those teams would put Etienne in a situation to shine immediately.

I have a 1.01 in a league in which the only RB on my roster is Marlon Mack. Etienne will most likely be my pick. We'll see where Chase ends up... but it's super hard to trade for a stud RB these days. Prices are through the roof.
Thank you for the context. In leagues with deep lineups/rosters, I'm more focused on a solid floor. Leagues with only 12 teams and/or shorter rosters/lineups, I'm shooting for that upside.
OhCruelestRanter wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:15 pmThis whole thing is tiresome
Yes it is. And since, from over here, it looks like you've instigated this and keep this apparent personal vendetta going across multiple threads, you're in the best position to change or even stop it. Do something about it, like, I don't know, offer constructive criticism. Harping on what best vs deepest means has little value, and only if you're looking for a gotcha moment in the future.

I find it interesting that you dismissed someone for pointing out your previous comments about CEH and yet your willing to chase down another member and nitpick their words.
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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby MEuRaH » Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:01 am

Pullo Vision wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:56 pmIn leagues with deep lineups/rosters, I'm more focused on a solid floor. Leagues with only 12 teams and/or shorter rosters/lineups, I'm shooting for that upside.
This is interesting, because I actually do the exact opposite. With fewer people starting I've always reached for upside, since just one or two guys in seven could carry the rest of the team. That's how my mind works, anyway.

But even if Etienne is my guy, Harris isn't that far behind tbh. Someone else brought it up in another thread, discussing about a comparison of Harris vs RBs of the previous few drafts, and I had to admit that I'd rather have Harris than anyone else as well -- assuming pre-draft rankings only, so not taking into account current landing spots.

If Harris is a guy who will get 10-14 points every game, and Etienne is a guy who will get 6-20, which is more valuable? I can see the merit in both, and it's that viewpoint that differs that makes their choice for them when it comes to RB1. I always operate on the assumption that everyone wants upside. I gotta come back down to Earth sometimes when I read the bolded part above. If the solid high floor is what's desired, Harris is the clear cut #1.
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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby CGW » Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:47 am

dlf_mikeh wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:01 am
Pullo Vision wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:56 pmIn leagues with deep lineups/rosters, I'm more focused on a solid floor. Leagues with only 12 teams and/or shorter rosters/lineups, I'm shooting for that upside.
This is interesting, because I actually do the exact opposite. With fewer people starting I've always reached for upside, since just one or two guys in seven could carry the rest of the team. That's how my mind works, anyway.

But even if Etienne is my guy, Harris isn't that far behind tbh. Someone else brought it up in another thread, discussing about a comparison of Harris vs RBs of the previous few drafts, and I had to admit that I'd rather have Harris than anyone else as well -- assuming pre-draft rankings only, so not taking into account current landing spots.

If Harris is a guy who will get 10-14 points every game, and Etienne is a guy who will get 6-20, which is more valuable? I can see the merit in both, and it's that viewpoint that differs that makes their choice for them when it comes to RB1. I always operate on the assumption that everyone wants upside. I gotta come back down to Earth sometimes when I read the bolded part above. If the solid high floor is what's desired, Harris is the clear cut #1.
Actually I think that's exactly what Pullo Vision was implying. Deeper rosters/starting req = depth and floor. Shallow rosters/starting req = aim for upside.

I'm not sure all that many in here disagree with you on ETN being the top back in the class. I think more disagreement is coming from your superlatives of "best class ever" or "best prospect since Barkley." Those are incredibly subjective statements, and generally you won't find a concensus opinion when making those types of statements.

In the end I think Harris is a safer pick, but I'm not sure one could go wrong with either Harris or ETN.

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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby YouMightDieTryin » Tue Apr 27, 2021 1:55 pm

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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby DJB » Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:15 am

Not a clear path for the "best RB since Barkley" in Jax.
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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby YouMightDieTryin » Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:04 am

Urban Meyer offense? Could certainly surprise if they can make it work.
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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby tresskid84 » Fri Apr 30, 2021 10:50 am

Definitely going to be hard for the first round rb to get opportunity.
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Re: Opinion: Travis Etienne is the best RB prospect since Barkley

Postby Ice » Fri Apr 30, 2021 11:32 am

tresskid84 wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 10:50 am Definitely going to be hard for the first round rb to get opportunity.
In a Kamara kind of way. 8-)
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