The Deshaun Watson Discussion Thread

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The MAC Machine
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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby The MAC Machine » Sun Jan 31, 2021 5:56 pm

Pullo Vision wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 2:55 pm
Shoreline Steamers wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 2:47 pm There's been some talk of the 49'ers interest in Watson.

Could you imagine if that somehow comes to pass, and you'd have an NFC West with Wilson, Stafford, Watson, and Murray as starting QB's? That would be insanely competitive!
It's an f'n arms race! With Seattle paying heavy for Adams and now LA for Stafford, San Fran needs to ante up. How much should they give? If the price truly is 2 1s, 2 2s and 2 defensive players, is that something they can afford? Seems they've hit on LBs the last few years.

Could we see a 3 way where Jimmy G goes to NE and the pick/player compensation goes to Houston as part of a Watson deal?
I like Matt Ryan or Trubisky for SF but not Watson. I don’t think Watson is within reach for the 9ers
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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby dustyroads » Mon Feb 01, 2021 9:44 am

OhCruelestRanter wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 8:50 am
FiremanEd wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 6:16 am
OhCruelestRanter wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 11:04 pm I’m worried that this Goff trade could be a disaster for the Texans. I don’t think Watson is willing to report/suit up, and I don’t think Houston’s FO can accept an offer that isn’t significantly better than this Stafford one. They might be stuck. Hopefully we get the Miami trade. That would be fun.
I think it will be fairly easy for the return to exceed this for Watson. This looks really nice but:
1. There is no 2021 1st
2. The 2022 pick is assumed to be late.
3. The 2023 pick should be assumed to be on the later side.
4. They had to add to move Goff, making Goff/3rd likely something of a wash (Osweiler cost a 2nd to move).

The packages talked about for Watson include high 2021 1sts and more. This starting point alone already exceeds the above. Just because people view Goff favorably doesn’t mean that’s the reality in the NFL.

If the Texans accepted less than what Detroit got, they were already in trouble. Nothing really changes on that front IMO.
Yeah, I think I agree with you. Obviously Goff’s contract is viewed as a net negative by these teams, although if he continues to look like a Jared Goff-type league average QB away from McVay, I suspect Detroit will be able to flip him.

This is an off-season where the Colts have been rumored to trade for Carson Wentz- would you rather have Wentz or Goff? Goff or Trubisky?

I think the next move for Detroit would be to restructure Goff and pay some of his future guarantees as a signing bonus, eat that money while they’re still bad, and then turn Goff into a more tradeable asset and flip him again.
Doubly agree. It also gives Detroit a bit more flexibility with this draft. If they didn't get a QB in return on the Stafford trade, they would have been pressured into drafting a QB at 7 this year, or having to trade some of the Stafford dividends to move up further and get their guy. And then potentially been pressured to also rush a rookie QB to starting this year. It's not to say they won't take a QB still in this draft, but it at least gives them some options to kick the can down the road and just go BPA on their board this year and retain their draft picks. I honestly thought this was a great trade for everyone involved (less so Goff, but still not bad to get out a situation where they had so little belief in you they were starting John Wolford ahead of you).

I think more cuts/potential trades will come as they move to a large rebuild; but at least now they can still put out a semi-serviceable product for the fans. Best case scenario would be if Goff looks decent and can get shoved off mid season for more draft stock, and gives a viable excuse for finishing the season with an even worse QB and getting a better draft pick for 2022.

From a dynasty aspect, I am concerned for Golladay though (even more than before). It sounds as though he is really open to staying in Detroit even after the Stafford move.

And agree with Ed, when all aspects of this trade are considered with regards to pushing the 1st round picks 1-2 years out and the likelihood of them being late, at least outside the top 15 or so, and having to take on a large contract of QB you don't plan on building around, in a year where there is potential to see a reduced salary cap for the first time in a decade... it won't be hard to to put forth a better trade. Hell, a 2021 1st in the top 5 and a 2022 1st projected to be in the top 15 would already be a much better offer for Watson then LA just paid, all things considered.

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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby killer_of_giants » Mon Feb 01, 2021 10:17 am

The Godwin Complex wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 5:56 pm
Pullo Vision wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 2:55 pm
Shoreline Steamers wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 2:47 pm There's been some talk of the 49'ers interest in Watson.

Could you imagine if that somehow comes to pass, and you'd have an NFC West with Wilson, Stafford, Watson, and Murray as starting QB's? That would be insanely competitive!
It's an f'n arms race! With Seattle paying heavy for Adams and now LA for Stafford, San Fran needs to ante up. How much should they give? If the price truly is 2 1s, 2 2s and 2 defensive players, is that something they can afford? Seems they've hit on LBs the last few years.

Could we see a 3 way where Jimmy G goes to NE and the pick/player compensation goes to Houston as part of a Watson deal?
I like Matt Ryan or Trubisky for SF but not Watson. I don’t think Watson is within reach for the 9ers
might as well start beathard...

this year's 1st and 2nd, next year's 2nd, '23 1st, plus something. could be feasible, and it's definitely worthy imo: you don't go very far with garoppolo or someone of that caliber unless everything else works perfectly, and with the division getting so competitive, they need to add something, or accept they won't win much in the next couple of years and build steadily.

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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby Blueboy » Mon Feb 01, 2021 10:20 am

I've really come around to the DET side of this deal. Goff obviously isn't the future there, barring some sort of situation-transcending performance, but having him in house a) allows them to pass on QB this year if the value isn't there, and b) evaluate some of the talent on offense without just straight up wasting a year. Hock and Swift shouldn't be totally tanked by awful QB play, and they should even be able to evaluate the development of guys like Cephus.

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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby krtbuckeye » Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:38 am

Sorry if I missed this while skimming through, but with Houston's revealed asking price (2 1sts, 2 2nds, and 2 young defensive starters) do we know if there is even a team in a spot to make this type of offer?
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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby mgscott » Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:51 am

krtbuckeye wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:38 am Sorry if I missed this while skimming through, but with Houston's revealed asking price (2 1sts, 2 2nds, and 2 young defensive starters) do we know if there is even a team in a spot to make this type of offer?
I wonder how long they will be able to hold to this stance. If he really wants out, they can't just completely hold firm and not trade him at all. That would be a locker room disaster, I would think.

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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby nathanq42 » Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:55 am

I mean... have fun paying Watson to sit... he seems to truly dislike the team. I never took Watson as the type of guy to sit out a season, but he seems livid
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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby burntfire » Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:13 pm

krtbuckeye wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:38 am Sorry if I missed this while skimming through, but with Houston's revealed asking price (2 1sts, 2 2nds, and 2 young defensive starters) do we know if there is even a team in a spot to make this type of offer?
I'm from Houston and a Texans fan (for now, looking at you Cal) but it's my understanding from local reporting that they would actually want (3) 1st round picks, (2) 2nds, and (2) starters, not necessarily defense and they would have to be good ones at that not just some scrubs.

I'm not sure there's any team in the league that could truly afford that. The only team I see being a fit is the Jags and that'll NEVER happen.
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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby Pac_Eddy » Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:15 pm

burntfire wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:13 pm
krtbuckeye wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:38 am Sorry if I missed this while skimming through, but with Houston's revealed asking price (2 1sts, 2 2nds, and 2 young defensive starters) do we know if there is even a team in a spot to make this type of offer?
I'm from Houston and a Texans fan (for now, looking at you Cal) but it's my understanding from local reporting that they would actually want (3) 1st round picks, (2) 2nds, and (2) starters, not necessarily defense and they would have to be good ones at that not just some scrubs.

I'm not sure there's any team in the league that could truly afford that. The only team I see being a fit is the Jags and that'll NEVER happen.
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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby CGW » Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:45 pm

nathanq42 wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:55 am I mean... have fun paying Watson to sit... he seems to truly dislike the team. I never took Watson as the type of guy to sit out a season, but he seems livid
It probably doesn't matter much, but they wouldn't be paying him much to sit. He would be force to pay back the $10.54mil salary for 2021 on a per game basis, as well as $50k per training camp day he sits. In addition, I've read the Texans could force him to pay back the $5.4m per year bonus, although I doubt it gets to that point.

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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby nathanq42 » Mon Feb 01, 2021 2:34 pm

CGW wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:45 pm
nathanq42 wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:55 am I mean... have fun paying Watson to sit... he seems to truly dislike the team. I never took Watson as the type of guy to sit out a season, but he seems livid
It probably doesn't matter much, but they wouldn't be paying him much to sit. He would be force to pay back the $10.54mil salary for 2021 on a per game basis, as well as $50k per training camp day he sits. In addition, I've read the Texans could force him to pay back the $5.4m per year bonus, although I doubt it gets to that point.
huh... I guess they can pay him to take a knee every play he touches the ball then? Sounds a lot more effective financially that sitting the season out. Maybe he can "tweak his hammy" each warm-up. Collect game cheques without playing and risking injury or actively working against his team on the field.
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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby CGW » Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:56 pm

nathanq42 wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 2:34 pm
CGW wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:45 pm
nathanq42 wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:55 am I mean... have fun paying Watson to sit... he seems to truly dislike the team. I never took Watson as the type of guy to sit out a season, but he seems livid
It probably doesn't matter much, but they wouldn't be paying him much to sit. He would be force to pay back the $10.54mil salary for 2021 on a per game basis, as well as $50k per training camp day he sits. In addition, I've read the Texans could force him to pay back the $5.4m per year bonus, although I doubt it gets to that point.
huh... I guess they can pay him to take a knee every play he touches the ball then? Sounds a lot more effective financially that sitting the season out. Maybe he can "tweak his hammy" each warm-up. Collect game cheques without playing and risking injury or actively working against his team on the field.
Yes he could do that. Get "hurt" each game. Bell also could have done this as well, but I think theres an optics thing for players. This is a weird year and a weird situation though, so who knows what itll come to.

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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby OhCruelestRanter » Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:09 pm

CGW wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:56 pm
nathanq42 wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 2:34 pm
CGW wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:45 pm

It probably doesn't matter much, but they wouldn't be paying him much to sit. He would be force to pay back the $10.54mil salary for 2021 on a per game basis, as well as $50k per training camp day he sits. In addition, I've read the Texans could force him to pay back the $5.4m per year bonus, although I doubt it gets to that point.
huh... I guess they can pay him to take a knee every play he touches the ball then? Sounds a lot more effective financially that sitting the season out. Maybe he can "tweak his hammy" each warm-up. Collect game cheques without playing and risking injury or actively working against his team on the field.
Yes he could do that. Get "hurt" each game. Bell also could have done this as well, but I think theres an optics thing for players. This is a weird year and a weird situation though, so who knows what itll come to.
There’s also an optics/agent relationship issue for the team. I have extraordinary doubts that Watson would do something like deliberately take a knee, and if he did I wouldn’t be surprised if the owners colluded against him for doing something like that. (bleep, they colluded against a player for kneeling before the game started.) But I think reporting to camp and claiming that he’s “hurt” and can’t play is in the cards in the Texans refuse to trade him.
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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby Ice » Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:18 pm

Watson seems like a high Character guy.

He may hold out but highly doubt he would put his reputation on the line.

Ultimately many will turn against Watson if he doesn’t at least meet with the new GM and Coach.

He may not like the owner but that owner did pay him a truckload of money to play football.
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Re: Deshaun Watson's new deal

Postby FiremanEd » Mon Feb 01, 2021 5:12 pm

Ice wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:18 pm Ultimately many will turn against Watson if he doesn’t at least meet with the new GM and Coach.

He may not like the owner but that owner did pay him a truckload of money to play football.
Who will turn against him? Players? Coaches? Who cares. He’s already made his desires clear.

If that owner wasn’t paying him, someone else would/will. Acting like he owes the owner anything is silly.


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