Fournette - what to do with him

[SteelLake]

I cannnot wait until Fournette comes back strong next year. I think its funny how people turn their nose up to a RB who caught 76 passes last year and has shown high scoring potential. Ronald Jones out touched Fournette 220 to 133 and yet the TD split is 8 to 6 AND Fournette has more catches in 1 less game. He is better than Ronald Jones.....period.

Players like Fournette act out when the team sucks. I remember when people downgraded Randy Moss before he went to the Patriots because of his behavioral issues.....I remember buying Randy low that off season....WOOF! Rode that puppy to a championship. I think many of you are in for a rude awakening if Fournette lands in a solid spot.

I would hold him if you have him. And buy him if you can get him for cheap.

I mean... Moss was an all-time great that fell apart. Fournette received an insane amount of touches, why he had FF value, but he was just consistently so freaking inefficient. I don't really see how you can compare the two. I'm probably forgetting something, but I can't think of a player who had so many chances but was so poor at helping his team with those chances. The below article does a good job evaluating his 2019 season:

https://www.si.com/nfl/jaguars/news/wha ... ralization.

Sure, if he gets in that role again, he can definitely succeed in FF again... Judging by NFL's response to him being available, I just don't see that happening.

I think his realistic peak is Blount's 2nd half of his career.. Maybe he becomes a backup and has a good FF year when the starter goes down. Sure, there were some weeks Blount was worth starting, but, that seems pretty easy to find and not worth holding on to forever for.

[Ice]

Thinking at the NFL level you put the work in or you're out. Fournette is a good player. Never really thought he was a great player but many drafted him thinking he was in fantasy and the Jags certainly thought he would be great.

Don't think it is a size issue with him. I do think expectations should be reset to a degree. I own him in a few leagues. He is a a solid volume back and pretty good on 3rd down. He certainly helped Tampa this past week.

Not sure it is a fair comment to think he doesn't put in the work. He is a very different player than Ekeler. Looks like a different body type as well. That said, I suspect not too many have Ekeler's drive from what I have read.

He is definitely carrying a little extra weight and could be leaner. That extra 10 or 15 pounds is giving him less pop and making him slower. For comparison look at the leanness of Chris Carson vs Fournette with similar body types. Carson has much more pop than Fournette though I think Fournette could have as much if he trimmed down a little.

"Specifically, Garofolo uncovered that Fournette has been constantly late to things, puts in sub-par work, and sleeps through meetings. He even found that Fournette sometimes needed to be woken up after falling asleep during team meetings."

"Leonard Fournette didn't work out once during his team's bye week.

Didn't lift a weight. Didn't use resistance bands. Didn't even hit a treadmill. Nothing at all.

"I laid in bed, ate gumbo, [and] went on dates with my daughter and my son and we chilled," he said.

It was a well-deserved break, and pretty much the only one that Fournette has taken since the 2018 season ended. His commitment and work ethic are two of the biggest factors in Fournette's turnaround from a player who many thought was a bust after last season to one with nearly 1,000 yards rushing already this season.

That includes keeping a strict watch on his diet and weight. Fournette gained 17 pounds during the 2018 season, but has pretty much maintained his weight around 223 pounds this season. But, he says, it has not been easy."

We pretty much all know he is under 4 YPC for his career. I see a Eddie Lacy type player. Looks like a one contract player type to me.

He could be all those things but Leonard's don't often change their spots....

[Camperhead]

We pretty much all know he is under 4 YPC for his career. I see a Eddie Lacy type player. Looks like a one contract player type to me.

He could be all those things but Leonard's don't often change their spots....

Precisely the comparison we made when we bit the bullet and took him second overall in the 2017 rookie draft. With his foot/ankle issues, we speculated at the time that he was due for an Eddie Lacy career arc, with a major "sell" window after two years. Didn't expect the descent to begin his rookie year, and by the time Year 3 came around he was already radioactive. We were fortunate to unload him for two 2nds last August, a couple of days before Jacksonville cut him. No great revelation at this point, but he is clearly not the special talent most people thought they were drafting.

[Dynasty DeLorean]

I am wondering if Fournette is too tall to play NFL RB

No, 6ft is a completely reasonable height.

Over 6ft
Derrick Henry
Joe Mixon
Todd Gurley
Melvin Gordon
David Johnson
LeVeon Bell
DeMarco Murray
Arian Foster
Matt Forte
Adrian Peterson
Steven Jackson

6ft
Antonio Gibson
Saquon Barkley
Leonard Fournette
Ezekiel Elliot
Carlos Hyde
Ryan Matthews


As per the topic, Idk what happened to him but he is not the same player he was in college. I'm guessing some combination of injuries and work ethic. Watching him his last year in Jax, his vision was terrible as well. He just lowers his head and just runs into piles. I bailed where I could this past year.

You removed all context and misquoted me as if I didn't immediately in the same sentence say that wasn't the issue.

I also clarified what I was saying prior to you posting this list.

I am wondering if Fournette is too tall to play NFL RB, but Latavius Murray is like 3 inches taller than him. Murray is leaner and tries less to bang, though he takes on contact. Did Fournette think he was going to bully the NFL bc that hasn't happened. Low man wins in football and though the sweet spot for RBs seems to be like 5'10 or 5'11 Fournette always seems slow and too high to play as strong as he wants to.

I think you misunderstand what I was saying, that's why I mentioned Murray. Murray and Henry are both much leaner than him regardless of the amount of weight they are carrying. I am saying bullying people at the NFL at his size isn't working and would work better at 5'10. I think if he lost a solid 10-15 pounds focusing on all speed, agility, and cardio he would be a significantly better back and would still be solid at 6 ft 210/215. He has more talent than he has shown.

As to the desire part, that's why I mentioned him still thinking he was the back he was drafted to be as opposed to guys who fight for their spot. I don't think he thinks he needs to make any drastic changes to his game, physique, or speed/quickness. Speed and lateral quickness can be improved by anyone at any level as long as they are young enough but he doesn't think he needs to do that. Look up how much of a gym rat Austin Ekeler is, anyone think Fournette puts work like that in?

Relax boss, you said "I am wondering". Not "I wondered". If you didn't like my response, next time say what you mean then. "I wondered if height was an issue, but after _____ and _____ I'm thinking it isn't". Sure, you said other things after that but none of it negated "I am wondering" as you went on to still harp on his height by saying a better height might be 5'10 or 5'11. Bringing up Latavius Murray as a success story for 6ft rb's is just baffling. This whole convo is idiotic, next time just say what you mean in the first place, and if you goof by writing a meandering mess then don't blame others for your mistake.

[The MAC Machine]

I mean... Moss was an all-time great that fell apart. Fournette received an insane amount of touches, why he had FF value, but he was just consistently so freaking inefficient.

Insane amount of touches? He has had the same amount of touches in his career as Dalvin Cook. How’s that an ”insane” amount? I think you are confusing Fournette with King Henry. Who has touched the ball around 400 times each of the past 2 years including playoffs....

For comparison in 4 seasons, not including playoffs

Fournette 763 carries - 3000 yards - 23 TDs, 170/221 receptions - 1242 yards - 2 TDs
Cook 769 carries - 3661 yards - 33 TDs, 148/182 receptions - 1275 yards - 3 TDs

The difference is 3 of Fournettes seasons were on a terrible Jaguars team and his trajectory is not a perfect bell curve. But even in a career year from Dalvin Cook there has still been very little separation production wise over 4 years. I just think he is going to bounce back next year, especially if he helps the Bucs win a Super Bowl and then stays.

[CGW]

I mean... Moss was an all-time great that fell apart. Fournette received an insane amount of touches, why he had FF value, but he was just consistently so freaking inefficient.

Insane amount of touches? He has had the same amount of touches in his career as Dalvin Cook. How’s that an ”insane” amount? I think you are confusing Fournette with King Henry. Who has touched the ball around 400 times each of the past 2 years including playoffs....

For comparison in 4 seasons, not including playoffs

Fournette 763 carries - 3000 yards - 23 TDs, 170/221 receptions - 1242 yards - 2 TDs
Cook 769 carries - 3661 yards - 33 TDs, 148/182 receptions - 1275 yards - 3 TDs

The difference is 3 of Fournettes seasons were on a terrible Jaguars team and his trajectory is not a perfect bell curve. But even in a career year from Dalvin Cook there has still been very little separation production wise over 4 years. I just think he is going to bounce back next year, especially if he helps the Bucs win a Super Bowl and then stays.

LFs stint as a Bucc has significantly reduced his career workload. You are bending the stats a little by using "career" stats rather than looking at context of the games played. LF has played 13 games and gotten 10.2 touches per game this year. That obviously skews career data.

With the Jags he was getting 25.9 touches per game, which to the previous posters point is why he held the fantasy value he did. He's never been a super efficient runner, averaging below 4.0 ypc.

LF is an above average receiver out of the backfield though, which is one of the few reasons hes gotten much work this season. Rojo is a far superior rusher at this point in the respective careers, so when RoJo has been healthy hes been the preferred runner.

Cook, on the other hand, has averaged 21 touches per game (still a healthy amount) at a MUCH more efficient 4.8 ypc average. Cook is used a lot, but LF's 26 touches per game during his Jags run is definitely bordering on "insane usage."

[The MAC Machine]

LF has played 13 games and gotten 10.2 touches per game this year. That obviously skews career data.

Because touches per game is not important in assessing someone’s talent. If anything that’s only important in assessing someone’s situation. Kamara averages 16-17 touches per game, but his situation enables him to be an elite RB despite being used 15-20% less than someone like Cook. Fournette being used MORE and averaging less doesn’t tell me Fournette is bad, it tells me the Jaguars are bad....and to defend that or ignore that is disingenuous. That’s like knocking Mixon but then ignoring he is on the Bengals....

[Ice]

LF has played 13 games and gotten 10.2 touches per game this year. That obviously skews career data.

Because touches per game is not important in assessing someone’s talent. If anything that’s only important in assessing someone’s situation. Kamara averages 16-17 touches per game, but his situation enables him to be an elite RB despite being used 15-20% less than someone like Cook. Fournette being used MORE and averaging less doesn’t tell me Fournette is bad, it tells me the Jaguars are bad....and to defend that or ignore that is disingenuous. That’s like knocking Mixon but then ignoring he is on the Bengals....

Yes the Jags were bad....Yes Robinson averaged over 20 touches per game he played.

Fournette is good enough to have found a home in Tampa. Brady seems to trust him on 3rd down. He doesn't get the touches these days because he isn't the best runner in Tampa.

Fournette is a chess piece in a game plan but he isn't the key piece any longer.

[CGW]

LF has played 13 games and gotten 10.2 touches per game this year. That obviously skews career data.

Because touches per game is not important in assessing someone’s talent. If anything that’s only important in assessing someone’s situation. Kamara averages 16-17 touches per game, but his situation enables him to be an elite RB despite being used 15-20% less than someone like Cook. Fournette being used MORE and averaging less doesn’t tell me Fournette is bad, it tells me the Jaguars are bad....and to defend that or ignore that is disingenuous. That’s like knocking Mixon but then ignoring he is on the Bengals....

Sure, Jax was bad (although they won the division in 2017.) I get it. But plenty of RB can have reasonably efficient seasons with bad teams. The point was, you were comparing his usage so Dalvin Cook to say he didnt really get insane workload, when in reality he was getting 25% more workload.

LF is averaging sub 4.0 with Tampa as well, so is Tampa also bad? As I said, hes largely been relegated to passing work when RoJo is healthy. It doesn't mean he cant be useful in the NFL or in fantasy, because he is still a big part of the passing game. He's just not a great pure runner.

[killer_of_giants]

Fournette being used MORE and averaging less doesn’t tell me Fournette is bad, it tells me the Jaguars are bad...

the jaguars were WORSE last season...

[The MAC Machine]

LF has played 13 games and gotten 10.2 touches per game this year. That obviously skews career data.

Because touches per game is not important in assessing someone’s talent. If anything that’s only important in assessing someone’s situation. Kamara averages 16-17 touches per game, but his situation enables him to be an elite RB despite being used 15-20% less than someone like Cook. Fournette being used MORE and averaging less doesn’t tell me Fournette is bad, it tells me the Jaguars are bad....and to defend that or ignore that is disingenuous. That’s like knocking Mixon but then ignoring he is on the Bengals....

Sure, Jax was bad (although they won the division in 2017.) I get it. But plenty of RB can have reasonably efficient seasons with bad teams. The point was, you were comparing his usage so Dalvin Cook to say he didnt really get insane workload, when in reality he was getting 25% more workload.

LF is averaging sub 4.0 with Tampa as well, so is Tampa also bad? As I said, hes largely been relegated to passing work when RoJo is healthy. It doesn't mean he cant be useful in the NFL or in fantasy, because he is still a big part of the passing game. He's just not a great pure runner.

Well, that not so great pure runner just hopped over one defender, beat a 2nd defender to the outside, spun away from a 3rd, and then bulldozed through a 4th into the end zone. I’m not saying this guy is going to be the 2nd coming of Ladanian Tomlinson, but to deny his abilities is like covering your eyes and saying that you dont see anything. Fournette could be a very good RB2 next year for cheap and the window to buy may have already passed with the way he has been playing.

[Prison_Mike]

I want to buy Fournette based on:
A) I think he's looked good in the playoffs and could bounce back
and
B) hope for a good landing spot

But I have absolutely no idea what to send for him. It feels like what would be a snap accept to some owners would be an insult to others. Has anyone seen deals for LF recently? (like since the playoffs started)

[Dynasty DeLorean]

Because touches per game is not important in assessing someone’s talent. If anything that’s only important in assessing someone’s situation. Kamara averages 16-17 touches per game, but his situation enables him to be an elite RB despite being used 15-20% less than someone like Cook. Fournette being used MORE and averaging less doesn’t tell me Fournette is bad, it tells me the Jaguars are bad....and to defend that or ignore that is disingenuous. That’s like knocking Mixon but then ignoring he is on the Bengals....

Sure, Jax was bad (although they won the division in 2017.) I get it. But plenty of RB can have reasonably efficient seasons with bad teams. The point was, you were comparing his usage so Dalvin Cook to say he didnt really get insane workload, when in reality he was getting 25% more workload.

LF is averaging sub 4.0 with Tampa as well, so is Tampa also bad? As I said, hes largely been relegated to passing work when RoJo is healthy. It doesn't mean he cant be useful in the NFL or in fantasy, because he is still a big part of the passing game. He's just not a great pure runner.

Well, that not so great pure runner just hopped over one defender, beat a 2nd defender to the outside, spun away from a 3rd, and then bulldozed through a 4th into the end zone.

He also did that after running blindly into a pile of bodies for no reason. Don’t get me wrong, I think fournette is the 2nd most talented rb I’ve ever scouted the last 5 years (only behind Saquon). Unfortunately I think he’s a little off between the ears and his injuries and/or overweightness have robbed him of his home run speed.

[The MAC Machine]

Sure, Jax was bad (although they won the division in 2017.) I get it. But plenty of RB can have reasonably efficient seasons with bad teams. The point was, you were comparing his usage so Dalvin Cook to say he didnt really get insane workload, when in reality he was getting 25% more workload.

LF is averaging sub 4.0 with Tampa as well, so is Tampa also bad? As I said, hes largely been relegated to passing work when RoJo is healthy. It doesn't mean he cant be useful in the NFL or in fantasy, because he is still a big part of the passing game. He's just not a great pure runner.

Well, that not so great pure runner just hopped over one defender, beat a 2nd defender to the outside, spun away from a 3rd, and then bulldozed through a 4th into the end zone.

He also did that after running blindly into a pile of bodies for no reason. Don’t get me wrong, I think fournette is the 2nd most talented rb I’ve ever scouted the last 5 years (only behind Saquon). Unfortunately I think he’s a little off between the ears and his injuries and/or overweightness have robbed him of his home run speed.

Word on the street is that talent wins out in dynasty. At least that’s what they say..... I’m actually a larger believer in situation. But what you’re saying is the reason I think he is a great buy low. Like....Marshawn Lynch before he went to the Seahawks low...

[Jrblaha]

He looked great today in the superbowl