Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

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Zebrahead07
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Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby Zebrahead07 » Fri Dec 11, 2020 12:54 pm

I’m the commish of a league that uses PP to determine rookie draft order. A few owners are upset that the taxi squad isn’t calculated towards PP therefore not always giving the worst team the 1.01. Last year an owner traded away all his players and basically owned the first round which is fine. He replaced those players with absolute SCRUBS. Starting 4th string WRs and special teams players to lower PP which has also earned him the 1.01. Should taxi squad players be added to PP?

His taxi squad has:

Justin Herbert
D’andre Swift
Tee Higgins
Jerry Jeudy
Denzel Mims
Jalen Reagor
Henry Ruggs
12 Team .5PPR IDP 30 Man Roster 8 Taxi 1QB-2RB-3WR-1TE-1 Flex-1PK-2DL-2LB-2DB-1Flex

QB: K. Murray, M. Stafford, B. Roethlisberger
RB: S. Barkley, A. Kamara, D. Cook, A. Gibson, L. Bell, J. White, T. Coleman, D. Williams
WR: D. Hopkins, D. Adams, OBJ , C. Godwin, D. Johnson, J. Jones, J. Meyers, D. Parker
TE: T. Kelce, D. Waller, G. Everett
PK: Y. Koo
DL: J. Watt, D. Hunter, M. Sweat, B. Graham
LB: J. Smith, T. Adams, A. Singleton, T. Reeder
DB: M. Butler, A. Philips

Taxi:
J. Stidham QB
J. Kelley RB
B. Edwards WR
Q. Cephus WR
J. Sternberger TE
B. Burns DE
D. Taylor LB

SF 12 Team 1PPR 24 Man Roster 4 Taxi 1QB-2RB-3WR-1TE-1SF-2Flex

QB: L. Jackson, J. Burrow, A. Smith, D. Haskins,
RB: M. Sanders, D. Harris, J. White, L. Murray, R. Armstead, D. Williams
WR: D.J. Moore, D. Johnson, J. Landry, J. Meyers, N. Harry, G. Davis, D. Duvernay, M. Boykin, P. Campbell, J. Hurd
TE: Z. Ertz, T. Higbee, G. Everette, K. Rudolph, H. Bryant

Taxi:
T. Tagovailoa QB
M. Pittman WR
L. Shenault WR

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Slackalacker
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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby Slackalacker » Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:02 pm

I couldn’t tell you where I stand on this subject, I could see valid arguments for both sides. I would think that taxi squad players shouldn’t count towards PP but I don’t feel strongly about it.

What I would say is that I don’t believe a rule should be enacted that affects previous results simply because people are upset. If what your owner did was in the scope of the rules at the time then there should be no problems. If the league wants to change (or amend) the rules then those changes should not take place until the offseason.

It is common to get many complaints this time of year when owners feel that unfair rules have caused them a disadvantage. My suggestion to them is to submit a rule change suggestion which we then collect and have a large vote on at the end of each season. Those which pass (7/10 majority) are enacted the following season unless otherwise specified.
TEAM 1 - 10 team SF 1PPR | 2017 & 2019 League Champ
1QB/1SF/2RB/2WR/1TE/2FLEX
QB: Dak - Hurts - Tua - Z Wilson - Wentz - Mills
RB: Barkley - Zeke - Sanders - - Pollard - S Perine - Evans
WR: Hill - JJeff - Godwin - Hollywood - MThom(IR) - Higgins - Waddle - E Moore - Marshall Jr - Calloway - Edwards - D Brown
TE: Hock - Uzomah

hoos89
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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby hoos89 » Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:13 pm

I'm personally a fan of taxi squad being available to be used in that way because it creates an additional dimension for trades and requires a fair bit of planning and patience to really take advantage of. That said...7 is pretty big for a taxi squad. If I were to change anything it would be to reduce the size of the taxi squad.
Team 1: 2012-2016
2013 Champion, 2012 Runner-Up


Team 2: 12 Team PPR - 1 QB, 2 RB, 2 WR, 1 TE, 2 R/W/T, 23 man rosters, est. 2016
2020 Runner-up
Rodgers, Carr, Wentz, M. Jones
Taylor, Chubb, Ekeler, J. Williams, M. Carter, Conner, D. Harris, Gaskin, Michel, McKinnon, Ahmed
Chase, AJB, DJM, Claypool, Aiyuk, Slayton, Agholor, C. johnson
Andrews, Dissly
IR(3): Bowden, MVS
Taxi(4): Tua, G. Davis, A. St. Brown, Palmer
2022 Picks: 1, 2, 2, 4, 5

Team 3: 12 Team PPR, 6 pt Pass TD - 1 QB, 2 RB, 3 WR, 1 TE, 3 R/W/T, 28 man rosters, est. 2019
Tannehill, Z. Wilson, Tua, Bridgewater, Eason
Barkley, CEH, Etienne, White, J. Jackson, Phillips, K. Smith, Barber
J. Jefferson, Metcalf, McLaurin, Evans, Thielen, Cooks, Jeudy, Waddle, R. Moore, Berrios, T. Johnson
Kelce, Dissly, Herndon
2022 Picks: 2, 3

briank
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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby briank » Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:21 pm

IMO, taxi squad players should not count towards potential points because they are not available to start. That's why MFL is set up that way. It's a valid strategy to stash productive players there as long as there are no rules against it.
12 tm tiered PPR Superflex start 9
QB Allen/Wilson/Newton
RB Mixon/Harris/CEH/Davis
WR Allen/DJ Moore/Robinson/TY/Washington
TE Kelce/Ertz/Cook

12 tm tiered PPR Superflex start 10
QB Mahomes/Watson/Roethlisberger/Fitzpatrick
RB CMC/Zeke/Mixon/Dillon/Williams
WR Evans/Godwin/Robinson/Golladay/Thielen/Lockett
TE Kittle/L. Thomas

12 tm tiered PPR Superflex start 10
QB Mahomes/Murray/Burrow
RB Jacobs/Penny/Dillon/Edwards
WR Adams/Hill/Diggs/AJ Brown/Allen/Woods/Boyd
TE Kittle/Henry/Njoku/Irv Smith

12 tm tiered PPR Superflex start 11
QB Jackson/Roethlisberger
RB Chubb/Da. Johnson/Davis
WR Adams/Hopkins/Julio/Thielen/Hilton
TE Kelce/Ertz

12 tm PPR 1.5 for TE Superflex start 2 TE start 12
QB Herbert/Tua/Lawrence/Fields
RB Harris/Etienne
WR Jefferson/Lamb/Sutton/Juedy/DSamuel/DSmith
TE Kittle/Pitts/Fant/Njoku

bjd5211
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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby bjd5211 » Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:22 pm

Nothing to see here, one owner was just smarter than the others who were not in the championship race.

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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby Pac_Eddy » Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:25 pm

I think that yes, taxi squad should be included in potential points.

In your specific case, you shouldn't change the rule or rule precedent though. If you haven't been including taxi squad in the potential points in previous seasons, don't start now just because people are upset.
Not all that counts can be counted. Not all that can be counted counts.

boochluke
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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby boochluke » Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:49 pm

bjd5211 wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:22 pm
Nothing to see here, one owner was just smarter than the others who were not in the championship race.
I agree, owner decided to FULLY commit to a rebuild (not a fool-proof strategy) within the confines of the rules. Nothing unfair about it that I can see. Also, I don't think taxi players should count for PP.

Sriracha
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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby Sriracha » Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:57 pm

He found a loophole in the rules and exploited it. Nothing you can do about it for this season but I would amend the rules in the future to prevent this from happening again.

bjd5211
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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby bjd5211 » Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:05 pm

Sriracha wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:57 pm
He found a loophole in the rules and exploited it. Nothing you can do about it for this season but I would amend the rules in the future to prevent this from happening again.
It's not a loophole or something that needs to be fixed, it's a perfectly valid strategy that is fairly commonly executed by smart owners. The other owners in this league are just envious of where smart play brought this owner.

Sriracha
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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby Sriracha » Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:27 pm

bjd5211 wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:05 pm
Sriracha wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:57 pm
He found a loophole in the rules and exploited it. Nothing you can do about it for this season but I would amend the rules in the future to prevent this from happening again.
It's not a loophole or something that needs to be fixed, it's a perfectly valid strategy that is fairly commonly executed by smart owners. The other owners in this league are just envious of where smart play brought this owner.
No... it's just a slightly more creative way of overtly tanking. Max Potential points is made specifically to award the earliest picks to the worst teams and this directly circumvents it.

I'd imagine it's up to the league to decide, but I don't think it's remotely in the grey area. You're not starting your best lineup to advance your position in the draft; ergo tanking

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YouMightDieTryin
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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby YouMightDieTryin » Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:34 pm

So by going by max potential points would a team constructed of:

Dak
CMC
Barkley
Mixon
OBJ
Sutton
MT
Kittle

be the worst team and awarded the 1st overall pick?
10-Team Dynasty League QB/RB/RB/WR/WR/WR/FLEX (23 man rosters + 2 IR + 2 Taxi, non-PPR scoring)
QB: Brady, Herbert
RB: Saquon, Elliott, CEH, K.Hunt, Malcolm Brown, Elijah Mitchell, J Patterson, J McNichols, M Brown
WR: DJ Moore, OBJ, Sutton, B.Cooks, Jeudy, Pittman, Shenault, Callaway, B. Edwards, Peoples-Jones,
TE: H.Henry, Knox, I Smith Jr (IR)
Taxi: T. Lance, Elijah Moore
2022: (3) 1sts, (2)2nd, 3rd, 4th :dance:

Sriracha
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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby Sriracha » Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:36 pm

YouMightDieTryin wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:34 pm
So by going by max potential points would a team constructed of:

Dak
CMC
Barkley
Mixon
OBJ
Sutton
MT
Kittle

be the worst team and awarded the 1st overall pick?
Sure, why not? Player can't control who gets hurt. He's not overtly tanking

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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby sloth8u » Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:37 pm

Not a fan of taxi, and especially when the taxi consists of better players than are being started each week. Just expand rosters and eliminate taxi....problem solved.

What that owner is doing is completely fine under your rules. I don't think they have a bitch outside of Higgins to be honest. Maybe they just aren't use to potential points and taxi in general. Your IDP format makes the league deep. Tell them to chill and take his money if he's doing something to intentionally lose 👍

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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby briank » Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:38 pm

YouMightDieTryin wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:34 pm
So by going by max potential points would a team constructed of:

Dak
CMC
Barkley
Mixon
OBJ
Sutton
MT
Kittle

be the worst team and awarded the 1st overall pick?
If your luck is that bad, you deserve the 1.01.
12 tm tiered PPR Superflex start 9
QB Allen/Wilson/Newton
RB Mixon/Harris/CEH/Davis
WR Allen/DJ Moore/Robinson/TY/Washington
TE Kelce/Ertz/Cook

12 tm tiered PPR Superflex start 10
QB Mahomes/Watson/Roethlisberger/Fitzpatrick
RB CMC/Zeke/Mixon/Dillon/Williams
WR Evans/Godwin/Robinson/Golladay/Thielen/Lockett
TE Kittle/L. Thomas

12 tm tiered PPR Superflex start 10
QB Mahomes/Murray/Burrow
RB Jacobs/Penny/Dillon/Edwards
WR Adams/Hill/Diggs/AJ Brown/Allen/Woods/Boyd
TE Kittle/Henry/Njoku/Irv Smith

12 tm tiered PPR Superflex start 11
QB Jackson/Roethlisberger
RB Chubb/Da. Johnson/Davis
WR Adams/Hopkins/Julio/Thielen/Hilton
TE Kelce/Ertz

12 tm PPR 1.5 for TE Superflex start 2 TE start 12
QB Herbert/Tua/Lawrence/Fields
RB Harris/Etienne
WR Jefferson/Lamb/Sutton/Juedy/DSamuel/DSmith
TE Kittle/Pitts/Fant/Njoku

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Re: Tanking/Rebuilding and Potential Points

Postby Dynasty DeLorean » Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:38 pm

The entire idea behind using potential points is to reward teams based on roster strength. It would be completely nonsensical if taxi squad points were not counted. I had a league that got rid of our taxi squad because it was too much of a grey area about people not calling up producing players etc. as sloth said, we just eliminated the taxi squad and expanded the roster size.


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