Is Vaughn a drop?

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TheNuts
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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby TheNuts » Fri Sep 04, 2020 4:36 am

grandmabetty wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:45 pm
Nothing has changed. This guy was a late 2nd rd pick in rookie drafts and would probably still be in that range today. I think some of you are forgetting a few things.

1. Fournette is not very good at football
2. Tom Brady is the QB. All tom cares about is if he trusts you or not. He could care less of your draft pedigree or natural talent. If you cant be where you're supposed to be when you're supposed to be youre not going to be very involved in his offense. Fournette hasn't shown hes willing to put in the effort to live up to toms standards, at least he didn't in Jacksonville. Not to mention Fournette has all of what 1 week to learn the system?

This is a committe backfield. If this kid vaughn can throw a block, learn the playbook and earn toms trust he'll see playing time. If Arians is smart anyway and listens to his 6 time super bowl winning QB
Tom Coughlins standards? Where every player with talent wanted nothing to do with the team?
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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby dlf_mikeh » Fri Sep 04, 2020 6:49 am

grandmabetty wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:45 pm
1. Fournette is not very good at football
Hmmm.... made me look into it.

He came out of college having both power and elusiveness. He started his career taking on defenders, but has since transitioned to more of an elusive back to stay healthy and prolong his career. His YPC was increasing, and he had 76 receptions last year. He now finds himself on a team with a QB who loves to dump off to his RBs. He's also entering his prime RB age of 25, and he'll be fighting for his first ever huge contract after the season is over.

I love Fournette this year. I am buying him now and selling him later. Maybe he's not a good back, but the situation is so delicious that I can't pass it up.
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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby Bronco Billy » Fri Sep 04, 2020 7:59 am

Well, Ogunbowale and Calais were just cut, so that ought to give Vaughn owners a little bit of relief.

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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby ericanadian » Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:22 am

Bronco Billy wrote:
Fri Sep 04, 2020 7:59 am
Well, Ogunbowale and Calais were just cut, so that ought to give Vaughn owners a little bit of relief.
I guess. The beneficiary seems to be McCoy, which is kinda who I expected to be cut.
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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby Cameron Giles » Fri Sep 04, 2020 9:52 am

We know a lot can happen in dynasty, especially this year where injuries and COVID could make things more random than usual.

Jones hasn't proven to be any good to this point and Fournette is on a one year deal. Vaughn isn't a stud prospect, but he should still be rostered in every standard-sized league.

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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby millworkguy » Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:06 pm

Brady likes vets, guys who know where to block, and team players who aren't looking to hit a home run on every play. The job is keeping him up to make the pass, and typically rookies dont do that. I picked Vaughn at #14, in a league that hoards rb's. I also got Gibson at pick #24. Even if I'm 50% in happy at this stage of the draft. I'm holding, and buying if your selling at a mid late 3rd. The guys ahead of him have a year, fournette on a 1 yr deal, Rojo really hasn't done much in 2 seasons (he is barely over 1100 total yards in 2 seasons) neither screams long term answer to me. I'll take the bet and let it play out for 18 months
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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby Sfoster2625 » Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:01 am

Luckily I didn’t invest a first round pick. Trade Akers and Joshua kelley for Vaughn and a first a few months ago. Ended up getting Akers back though
Qb: Mahomes, Daniel Jones
Rb: mixon, Ceh, Damien williams, Vaughn, rojo, Singletary, akers, snell
Wr: devante Adams, godwin, juju, mclaurin, diontae johnson, mims, Aiyuk, Anthony miller, trequan smith
Te: engram, hurst, Fant
Cb: Kyle fuller, Carlton Davis
S: Jamal Adams, Jordan whitehead
Edr: nick bosa, Joey bosa, Josh Allen, Jpp
IL: Chris Jones, Jonathan Allen
Lb: Darius Leonard, Roquan Smith


1QB
10 team league
32 man roster
0.5 point ppr
6 point pass td

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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby FantasyFreak » Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:25 am

Seems like that 3rd round draft capital is really risky for a RB, in terms of a first round rookie pick. DJ was a hit, but over the past few drafts Royce Freeman, Henderson, and now a 23 year old Vaughan seem like bad investments. I won't include Antonio Gibson in the conversation, because we're talking about running backs....... :whistle: :whistle: :whistle: (Just "taking the piss", as the British would say)

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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby jenkins.math » Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:01 am

FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:25 am
Seems like that 3rd round draft capital is really risky for a RB, in terms of a first round rookie pick. DJ was a hit, but over the past few drafts Royce Freeman, Henderson, and now a 23 year old Vaughan seem like bad investments. I won't include Antonio Gibson in the conversation, because we're talking about running backs....... :whistle: :whistle: :whistle: (Just "taking the piss", as the British would say)
That seems a bit like a hot take to call a 3rd round rookie a bad investment before he has ever set foot in an NFL game. If you invested in him for production this year that does seem like a bad investment. But why don't we let him actually play a game in the NFL before we bury him.

Obviously it depends on where you take a rookie in general, but I see 7 of the 12 guys on this list being worth (or have been) a first round pick that were 3rd round RBs. Of the 5 guys that aren't, Harris has a chance this year to show his worth, and Foreman tore his achilles before he ever really got started. Not sure they are than more risky than 2nd round RBs.

2019 3rd round RBs: Henderson, Montgomery, Singletary, Damien Harris, Mattison

2018 3rd round RBs: Royce Freeman

2017 3rd round RBs: Kamara, Hunt, Foreman, Conner

2016 3rd round RBs: Drake, Prosise
Team 1: 14 team dynasty, 25 man roster, keep 14
QB, 2RB, 2WR, TE, 2Flex, D/ST, K, DL, LB, DE
QB: Ryan, Mayfield
RB: Barkley, CEH, Kelley, Darrel Williams, Gaskin, Snell
WR: OBJ, Evans, Juju, Moore, Jeudy, Reagor, Corey Davis, Cooks
TE: Kittle, Schultz
K: Butker
D/ST: Titans, Bears
DL: Heyward
LB: K. White
DB: B. Baker

Team 2: 12 team PPR Salary Cap
QB: Watson, Goff
RB: Barkley, CEH, Gibson, Howard, Perine, Lewis, Ozigbo
WR: Hill, Allen, Boyd, Landry, Sims, DJax, Hamler, Westbrook
TE: Schultz, Ebron, Thomas, Keene, Jarwin
K: Tucker
D/ST: Steelers, Bills
Taxi: Lock, Bryce Love, Higgins

Team 3: 12 team SF
QB: Wentz, Mayfield, Love
RB: AP, Lewis, Perine, JJ Taylor, Vaughn, Mack
WR: Jeudy, Jeffrey, P Williams, Mooney, Cephus, Fitz, Gandy-Golden, Hightower, Swain, Bisi Johnson, Tate
TE: Doyle, Smith, Trautman, Keene, Warring

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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby FantasyFreak » Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:12 am

jenkins.math wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:01 am
FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:25 am
Seems like that 3rd round draft capital is really risky for a RB, in terms of a first round rookie pick. DJ was a hit, but over the past few drafts Royce Freeman, Henderson, and now a 23 year old Vaughan seem like bad investments. I won't include Antonio Gibson in the conversation, because we're talking about running backs....... :whistle: :whistle: :whistle: (Just "taking the piss", as the British would say)
That seems a bit like a hot take to call a 3rd round rookie a bad investment before he has ever set foot in an NFL game. If you invested in him for production this year that does seem like a bad investment. But why don't we let him actually play a game in the NFL before we bury him.

Obviously it depends on where you take a rookie in general, but I see 7 of the 12 guys on this list being worth (or have been) a first round pick that were 3rd round RBs. Of the 5 guys that aren't, Harris has a chance this year to show his worth, and Foreman tore his achilles before he ever really got started. Not sure they are than more risky than 2nd round RBs.

2019 3rd round RBs: Henderson, Montgomery, Singletary, Damien Harris, Mattison

2018 3rd round RBs: Royce Freeman

2017 3rd round RBs: Kamara, Hunt, Foreman, Conner

2016 3rd round RBs: Drake, Prosise
Yeah. When I said first round rookie pick, I meant at the time. Not revisionist. Drake wasn't a first, to my knowledge. Kamara and Hunt would have been hits. That was an arguably generational RB class overall. Vaughan is an older RB. 23, and a lot of his perceived value was instant opportunity and production. Maybe it is a hot take, but if you took Vaughn with a first, you lost IMO. Unless he takes on a meaningful role, and I mean startable, either this year or next. Maybe next year is his year, but his value has, and should be dropped significantly, at the moment. I said they seem like bad investments. In other words, there is a possibility that can change, but it doesn't seem all that likely.

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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby jenkins.math » Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:29 am

FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:12 am
jenkins.math wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:01 am
FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:25 am
Seems like that 3rd round draft capital is really risky for a RB, in terms of a first round rookie pick. DJ was a hit, but over the past few drafts Royce Freeman, Henderson, and now a 23 year old Vaughan seem like bad investments. I won't include Antonio Gibson in the conversation, because we're talking about running backs....... :whistle: :whistle: :whistle: (Just "taking the piss", as the British would say)
That seems a bit like a hot take to call a 3rd round rookie a bad investment before he has ever set foot in an NFL game. If you invested in him for production this year that does seem like a bad investment. But why don't we let him actually play a game in the NFL before we bury him.

Obviously it depends on where you take a rookie in general, but I see 7 of the 12 guys on this list being worth (or have been) a first round pick that were 3rd round RBs. Of the 5 guys that aren't, Harris has a chance this year to show his worth, and Foreman tore his achilles before he ever really got started. Not sure they are than more risky than 2nd round RBs.

2019 3rd round RBs: Henderson, Montgomery, Singletary, Damien Harris, Mattison

2018 3rd round RBs: Royce Freeman

2017 3rd round RBs: Kamara, Hunt, Foreman, Conner

2016 3rd round RBs: Drake, Prosise
Yeah. When I said first round rookie pick, I meant at the time. Not revisionist. Drake wasn't a first, to my knowledge. Kamara and Hunt would have been hits. That was an arguably generational RB class overall. Vaughan is an older RB. 23, and a lot of his perceived value was instant opportunity and production. Maybe it is a hot take, but if you took Vaughn with a first, you lost IMO. Unless he takes on a meaningful role, and I mean startable, either this year or next. Maybe next year is his year, but his value has, and should be dropped significantly, at the moment. I said they seem like bad investments. In other words, there is a possibility that can change, but it doesn't seem all that likely.
Your original point was that 3rd round rookie RB's are risky as first round FF picks. The last 4 years (not including 2020 because they haven't played a down) have given us 12 3rd round rookie RBs and 7 of those 12 have shown to have been worth a 1st, whether they were drafted there or not. Where you draft guys in your league is up to you, your scouting/process, and knowing your league. Obviously where you would have taken them in the first changes the equation as there is a huge difference in taking Montgomery in the top 4 or the late first, but he is still worth a first at this point. The point being that over half of the guys on that list you would be at least satisfied that you took them in round 1. Not sure they are that much more risky than any other group after round 1 of the NFL draft.

I just think you feel a certain way about them (maybe you were burned by Freeman or one of the busts) that isn't necessarily rooted in facts.
Team 1: 14 team dynasty, 25 man roster, keep 14
QB, 2RB, 2WR, TE, 2Flex, D/ST, K, DL, LB, DE
QB: Ryan, Mayfield
RB: Barkley, CEH, Kelley, Darrel Williams, Gaskin, Snell
WR: OBJ, Evans, Juju, Moore, Jeudy, Reagor, Corey Davis, Cooks
TE: Kittle, Schultz
K: Butker
D/ST: Titans, Bears
DL: Heyward
LB: K. White
DB: B. Baker

Team 2: 12 team PPR Salary Cap
QB: Watson, Goff
RB: Barkley, CEH, Gibson, Howard, Perine, Lewis, Ozigbo
WR: Hill, Allen, Boyd, Landry, Sims, DJax, Hamler, Westbrook
TE: Schultz, Ebron, Thomas, Keene, Jarwin
K: Tucker
D/ST: Steelers, Bills
Taxi: Lock, Bryce Love, Higgins

Team 3: 12 team SF
QB: Wentz, Mayfield, Love
RB: AP, Lewis, Perine, JJ Taylor, Vaughn, Mack
WR: Jeudy, Jeffrey, P Williams, Mooney, Cephus, Fitz, Gandy-Golden, Hightower, Swain, Bisi Johnson, Tate
TE: Doyle, Smith, Trautman, Keene, Warring

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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby Jigga94 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 4:27 am

The person who picked him at 11 just dropped him for Dion Lewis
2QB, 2RB, 3WR, TE, FLEX - PPR - [b]14 Keepers[/b]
QB: Mahomes, J. Allen, D. Jones, Baker
RB: JT, Mostert, Dillon, Gaskin, McFarland, Jeff Wilson, Mattison, Pollard, Damien (IR)
WR: Tyreek, DJM, Jeudy, Hollywood, Cooks, Preston, Cole, G. Davis, Parris (IR), Mims (IR)
TE: Andrews, Henry, Fant
2021: 1, 2, 3

2QB, 2RB, 2WR, TE, 3FLEX - PPR - [b]20 Keepers[/b]
QB: Mahomes, Ryan, Minshew, Hurts
RB: CMC (IR), Saquon (IR), Jacobs, Dobbins, Hunt, M. Davis, McFarland, Penny, Cohen
WR: DJM, Chark, Ruggs, Hardman, Mike Will, Lazard (IR), C. Davis, G. Davis, Washington, Parris (IR)
TE: Andrews, Henry, Gesicki, Irv, Tonyan
2021: 2, 3, 3
2022: 1, 2, 3, 3

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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby FantasyFreak » Wed Sep 23, 2020 4:33 am

jenkins.math wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:29 am
FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:12 am
jenkins.math wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:01 am


That seems a bit like a hot take to call a 3rd round rookie a bad investment before he has ever set foot in an NFL game. If you invested in him for production this year that does seem like a bad investment. But why don't we let him actually play a game in the NFL before we bury him.

Obviously it depends on where you take a rookie in general, but I see 7 of the 12 guys on this list being worth (or have been) a first round pick that were 3rd round RBs. Of the 5 guys that aren't, Harris has a chance this year to show his worth, and Foreman tore his achilles before he ever really got started. Not sure they are than more risky than 2nd round RBs.

2019 3rd round RBs: Henderson, Montgomery, Singletary, Damien Harris, Mattison

2018 3rd round RBs: Royce Freeman

2017 3rd round RBs: Kamara, Hunt, Foreman, Conner

2016 3rd round RBs: Drake, Prosise
Yeah. When I said first round rookie pick, I meant at the time. Not revisionist. Drake wasn't a first, to my knowledge. Kamara and Hunt would have been hits. That was an arguably generational RB class overall. Vaughan is an older RB. 23, and a lot of his perceived value was instant opportunity and production. Maybe it is a hot take, but if you took Vaughn with a first, you lost IMO. Unless he takes on a meaningful role, and I mean startable, either this year or next. Maybe next year is his year, but his value has, and should be dropped significantly, at the moment. I said they seem like bad investments. In other words, there is a possibility that can change, but it doesn't seem all that likely.
Your original point was that 3rd round rookie RB's are risky as first round FF picks. The last 4 years (not including 2020 because they haven't played a down) have given us 12 3rd round rookie RBs and 7 of those 12 have shown to have been worth a 1st, whether they were drafted there or not. Where you draft guys in your league is up to you, your scouting/process, and knowing your league. Obviously where you would have taken them in the first changes the equation as there is a huge difference in taking Montgomery in the top 4 or the late first, but he is still worth a first at this point. The point being that over half of the guys on that list you would be at least satisfied that you took them in round 1. Not sure they are that much more risky than any other group after round 1 of the NFL draft.

I just think you feel a certain way about them (maybe you were burned by Freeman or one of the busts) that isn't necessarily rooted in facts.
Beyond Kamara and Hunt, not seeing value on that list, for a first round rookie. Monty at 1.03 wasn't really worth an early first IMO, and Drake's value was tanked for so long it really doesn't qualify as a hit in my books. He really hasn't done much, beyond the last few games of last year.

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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby Bronco Billy » Wed Sep 23, 2020 5:09 am

FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:25 am
Seems like that 3rd round draft capital is really risky for a RB, in terms of a first round rookie pick. DJ was a hit, but over the past few drafts Royce Freeman, Henderson, and now a 23 year old Vaughan seem like bad investments.
This is what can happen with impatient owners. The landscape may have changed with Henderson - we’ll see in the upcoming games - but owners who wanted immediate gratification, didn’t get it, and dropped him may have weakened their own team while strengthening and opponent.

And I won’t even touch your relentless fixation on the myth that Gibson has never played RB before.

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Re: Is Vaughn a drop?

Postby CGW » Wed Sep 23, 2020 5:55 am

Was also just dropped in my 10man SF league where he went 1.10. To this point he has to be this year's biggest bust, overvalued player.
12 Team | SF | PPR | 6pt pass TD
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, SF

QB | Cousins, Darnold, Trubisky, Flacco
RB | Mixon, Singletary, Taylor, Gaskin, D'ernest Johnson, Wilkins
WR | Adams, Evans, Golladay, Cooper, D. Johnson, Washington, Miller, Cephas, G. Davis, Mooney, Pascal,
TE | Andrews, Herndon, Alie-Cox, Sternberger

10 Team | SF | PPR
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, SF

QB | Murray, Minshew, Tua
RB | Montgomery, Singletary, Murray, R. Jones, Dobbins, Swift, Vaughn
WR | Golladay, Godwin, AJ Brown, M. Brown, D. Johnson, Slayton, Aiyuk, Smith, Fulgham, Renfrow, Mooney
TE | Andrews, Henry, Herndon, Sample

12 Team | SF | PPR | 6pt pass TD
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, FL, SF

QB | Watson, Wilson, Darnold, Trubisky, Fromme, Smith, Flacco
RB | Guice, Hines, Penny, Henderson, Wilkins
WR | Evans, Golladay, Ridley, Kupp, D. Johnson, Pittman, Westbrook, Coutee, Mooney, Ward, T. Smith, Zaccheus
TE | Ertz, Herndon, Sternberger, Oliver, L. Thomas


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