Antonio Gibson rocket ship

General talk about Dynasty Leagues.
CGW
All Pro
All Pro
Posts: 1564
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:31 pm

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby CGW » Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:09 am

joeday wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 5:51 am
I recently sold him for a 2021 1st (I took him at 2.10 this summer)
Huge win for you there. I've been fine with people drafting Gibson at the end of the 2nd or later, but lately I've seen him pumped into the early 2nd and late 1st. I'd much rather have some of these first round WRs than him in the 1st.
12 Team | SF | PPR | 6pt pass TD
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, SF

QB | Cousins, Darnold, Trubisky, Flacco
RB | Mixon, Singletary, Taylor, Gaskin, D'ernest Johnson, Wilkins
WR | Adams, Evans, Golladay, Cooper, D. Johnson, Washington, Miller, Cephas, G. Davis, Mooney, Pascal,
TE | Andrews, Herndon, Alie-Cox, Sternberger

10 Team | SF | PPR
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, SF

QB | Murray, Minshew, Tua
RB | Montgomery, Singletary, Murray, R. Jones, Dobbins, Swift, Vaughn
WR | Golladay, Godwin, AJ Brown, M. Brown, D. Johnson, Slayton, Aiyuk, Smith, Fulgham, Renfrow, Mooney
TE | Andrews, Henry, Herndon, Sample

12 Team | SF | PPR | 6pt pass TD
QB, RB, RB, WR, WR, WR, TE, FL, FL, SF

QB | Watson, Wilson, Darnold, Trubisky, Fromme, Smith, Flacco
RB | Guice, Hines, Penny, Henderson, Wilkins
WR | Evans, Golladay, Ridley, Kupp, D. Johnson, Pittman, Westbrook, Coutee, Mooney, Ward, T. Smith, Zaccheus
TE | Ertz, Herndon, Sternberger, Oliver, L. Thomas

Ice
MVP
MVP
Posts: 2642
Joined: Tue May 22, 2018 6:17 pm

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Ice » Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:31 am

Every player Ever Drafted qualifies as boom or bust before they play a down in the NFL people.

Btw, if you don’t discount future picks your not playing this game correctly.

If you can get a Gibson type ,if you like the player, by moving up a few spots a year earlier than the asset you’re giving up that is a win given your player gets an entire year to develop and produce.

Stop making it sound like a great deal. It’s as common as it gets; not a good deal or a bad deal but a fair deal.
The clock is running and there are no timeouts

Jigga94
Degenerate
Degenerate
Posts: 8337
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2017 8:38 pm

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Jigga94 » Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:35 am

I get discounting picks but I also don't think a mid to late 2nd = 1st next year. To each their own
2QB, 2RB, 3WR, TE, FLEX - PPR - [b]14 Keepers[/b]
QB: Mahomes, J. Allen, D. Jones, Baker
RB: JT, Mostert (IR), Dillon, Gaskin, Mattison, Pollard, Scott, Damien (IR)
WR: Tyreek, DJM, Jeudy, Hollywood, Cooks, Preston, Cole, G. Davis, Mims, Parris (IR)
TE: Andrews, Henry, Fant
2021: 1, 2, 3

2QB, 2RB, 2WR, TE, 3FLEX - PPR - [b]20 Keepers[/b]
QB: Mahomes, Ryan, Minshew, Hurts
RB: CMC (IR), Saquon (IR), Jacobs, Dobbins, Hunt, M. Davis, McFarland, Penny, Cohen
WR: DJM, Chark, Ruggs, Hardman, Mike Will, Lazard (IR), C. Davis, G. Davis, Washington, Parris (IR)
TE: Andrews, Henry, Gesicki, Irv, Tonyan
2021: 2, 3, 3
2022: 1, 2, 3, 3

Ice
MVP
MVP
Posts: 2642
Joined: Tue May 22, 2018 6:17 pm

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Ice » Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:49 am

Jigga94 wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:35 am
I get discounting picks but I also don't think a mid to late 2nd = 1st next year. To each their own
That is 💯 % based on the player you evaluated.
No such thing as random pick equality.

I typically offer 1st rounders next for a player on the board I covet starting at 2.1 for as long as a player I want is there.

Guess it’s more of a function of my draft board as opposed to to some random ADP or specific pick.
The clock is running and there are no timeouts

User avatar
murphysxm
Pro Bowler
Pro Bowler
Posts: 1469
Joined: Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:10 am

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby murphysxm » Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:45 am

I will also go on record that I severly doubt Gibson will ever be an every down RB. He's been a gadget player since HS, why will that change in the NFL? I have shares of him and do think he has big play potential, but I plan to sell the frst time he has a big play. I see him as Tavon Austin. Once every 8 games he will break a long TD, but will be worthless in 6 of the games between. Not a guy I want on my roster.

Patsfan86
Pro Bowler
Pro Bowler
Posts: 1103
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:28 am

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Patsfan86 » Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:15 am

I own this guy but how in the hell is he being talked about like he is CMC or Barkley lol. I got him at 2.10 and have been trying to trade him all over but cant. Like ive said before ill be ecstatic if he is a James White/ Chris Thompson type player. How he is getting this amount of hype is beyond me? Also what if Lenny goes to Washington?

Online
Mjvb5
Ring of Fame
Ring of Fame
Posts: 3864
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:29 am

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Mjvb5 » Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:26 am

Patsfan86 wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:15 am
I own this guy but how in the hell is he being talked about like he is CMC or Barkley lol. I got him at 2.10 and have been trying to trade him all over but cant. Like ive said before ill be ecstatic if he is a James White/ Chris Thompson type player. How he is getting this amount of hype is beyond me? Also what if Lenny goes to Washington?
Because he's big and fast and people think that because a coach who historically has throw minimally to his RB started throwing to mccaffrey that means his scheme is predicated around throwing to an RB.


But mainly because he's big and fast.

You wanna comp him to a guy on the Panthers, it's curtis samuel.

Ice
MVP
MVP
Posts: 2642
Joined: Tue May 22, 2018 6:17 pm

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Ice » Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:36 am

murphysxm wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:45 am
I will also go on record that I severly doubt Gibson will ever be an every down RB. He's been a gadget player since HS, why will that change in the NFL? I have shares of him and do think he has big play potential, but I plan to sell the frst time he has a big play. I see him as Tavon Austin. Once every 8 games he will break a long TD, but will be worthless in 6 of the games between. Not a guy I want on my roster.
If you have shares you probably got him at pretty affordable prices. Think you might want to hold a bit. He may have a couple of big plays in a game.

He is absolutely nothing like Tavon Austin. Austin was a converted RB much like Tyreek Hill except Hill actually hit. Gibson was primarily a RB in High School but went the other way to a degree in college.

Looks like he is coming back full circle to RB which is an easier position to play with much shorter routes.

No one is claiming he is not raw but at some point the fact that he averaged over 11.2 yards per rush and 19.3 yards per catch, broke 33 tackles on 77 touches and scored 14 TD's on those 77 touches should take notice that this kid oozes potential no matter where he lines up. BTW, I too have watched a lot of film and gadget plays as some think, not you, isn't remotely accurate.

Big Play is correct but it's 100 % skill based on tape.

12 of his TD's
Base set:
3 TD's running left from HB, 1 was a cut back to right. Nothing fancy.
1 TD running right from HB

Passing: All these are from X, Slot, or from HB position with no basic tricks.
Straight drop back mid level crossing 2 TD's
Bomb from slot 1 TD
Post from slot 1 TD
Slot TD from red zone 1 TD
Stacked set out pattern 1 TD
QB Option roll out from X 1 TD

On tape it's pretty obvious why Rivera really likes him. He can option from the backfield and potentially excel from the slot much like CMC.

His slot work on tape is really good.

The real argument one could make is he does have pretty small hands. Shorter touch throws will help him.

His volume is lacking but his skill set within the volume he actually outstanding. NFL teams draft on the potential they see.

This conversation id much like DK last year. Fantasy players and some GM's alike discounted him due to volume of work over quality of work IMO.

I get blasting this player on volume but the quality of the worked preformed does jump off the page.
The clock is running and there are no timeouts

User avatar
Dynasty DeLorean
Legend
Legend
Posts: 6409
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 8:45 am

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Dynasty DeLorean » Tue Sep 01, 2020 10:02 am

DK's volume per game was good though, Gibsons is not.

perkinsrooster
All Pro
All Pro
Posts: 1683
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2015 8:16 pm

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby perkinsrooster » Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:22 am

Ice wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:31 am
Every player Ever Drafted qualifies as boom or bust before they play a down in the NFL people.

Btw, if you don’t discount future picks your not playing this game correctly.

If you can get a Gibson type ,if you like the player, by moving up a few spots a year earlier than the asset you’re giving up that is a win given your player gets an entire year to develop and produce.

Stop making it sound like a great deal. It’s as common as it gets; not a good deal or a bad deal but a fair deal.
I don't get why future picks should be discounted. I get it in finance but how does that work here?

Ice
MVP
MVP
Posts: 2642
Joined: Tue May 22, 2018 6:17 pm

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Ice » Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:38 am

perkinsrooster wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:22 am

I don't get why future picks should be discounted. I get it in finance but how does that work here?
Not really sure this needs an explanation. If I own 2.5 as an example and you want it do you really think you can acquire it for some future random 2nd?

I have been doing this for decades and I just don't see this unless a specific draft class may be perceived extremely weak by pretty much everyone.

This class was considered deep at RB, and WR which drives up value. Next Year's class by comparison is full of question marks especially due to Covid.

One would be a fool IMO to trade away 2.5 as an example unless they got at least a projected middle 1st next and would pretty much have to really dislike this class.

A player you can get today has an entire year to develop and get better vs a complete unknown.

Think Bird in the hand so to speak.
The clock is running and there are no timeouts

Online
jenkins.math
Pro Bowler
Pro Bowler
Posts: 1143
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2018 10:56 am

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby jenkins.math » Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:12 pm

Ice wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:38 am
perkinsrooster wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:22 am

I don't get why future picks should be discounted. I get it in finance but how does that work here?
Not really sure this needs an explanation. If I own 2.5 as an example and you want it do you really think you can acquire it for some future random 2nd?

I have been doing this for decades and I just don't see this unless a specific draft class may be perceived extremely weak by pretty much everyone.

This class was considered deep at RB, and WR which drives up value. Next Year's class by comparison is full of question marks especially due to Covid.

One would be a fool IMO to trade away 2.5 as an example unless they got at least a projected middle 1st next and would pretty much have to really dislike this class.

A player you can get today has an entire year to develop and get better vs a complete unknown.

Think Bird in the hand so to speak.
See I think the fool would be anybody offering a mid 1st for a mid 2nd regardless of the class. As awesome as the 2020 class was hyped, according the Mizelle's ADP (single QB), the 2.05 equates to Zack Moss. Around the mid first range for 2021 (seen as much weaker even before COVID) you're probably talking Najee Harris, Jaylen Waddle, Rashod Bateman. I think all of those guys are going to be seen as superior prospects in comparison to Moss.

Draft picks a year out shouldn't equate to an entire round of value lost.
Team 1: 14 team dynasty, 25 man roster, keep 14
QB, 2RB, 2WR, TE, 2Flex, D/ST, K, DL, LB, DE
QB: Ryan, Mayfield
RB: Barkley, CEH, Kelley, Darrel Williams, Gaskin, Snell
WR: OBJ, Evans, Juju, Moore, Jeudy, Reagor, Corey Davis, Cooks
TE: Kittle, Schultz
K: Butker
D/ST: Titans, Bears
DL: Heyward
LB: K. White
DB: B. Baker

Team 2: 12 team PPR Salary Cap
QB: Watson, Goff
RB: Barkley, CEH, Gibson, Howard, Perine, Lewis, Ozigbo
WR: Hill, Allen, Boyd, Landry, Sims, DJax, Hamler, Westbrook
TE: Schultz, Ebron, Thomas, Keene, Jarwin
K: Tucker
D/ST: Steelers, Bills
Taxi: Lock, Bryce Love, Higgins

Team 3: 12 team SF
QB: Wentz, Mayfield, Love
RB: AP, Lewis, Perine, JJ Taylor, Vaughn, Mack
WR: Jeudy, Jeffrey, P Williams, Mooney, Cephus, Fitz, Gandy-Golden, Hightower, Swain, Bisi Johnson, Tate
TE: Doyle, Smith, Trautman, Keene, Warring

Jetsfan06
Rookie
Rookie
Posts: 85
Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:05 am

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Jetsfan06 » Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:21 pm

Geez tough crowd in here. Which I get, we didn’t see a ton of work from him college. But a few things to point out:

1. He literally has 30 pounds Curtis samuel. He has a running back build with good height and solid wide frame.
2. To spin the lack of carries in a positive manner, you certainly won’t have to worry about him breaking down in the NFL. He definitely isn’t one of those guys who’s body is worn down after being a 4 year starter for example. So if he does become the starter we hope and envision then that is a great positive.
3. Athleticism is on his side. He hardly ever had to pass protect in college for example, but he has the frame to do it and there is nothing physically holding him back from being good at it. A lot of players in college get used incorrectly, Gibson appears to be one of them. But most teams in the NFL can maximize a players abilities, and it appears as though Washington wants to do that(as long as they don’t claim fournette)
4. From the camp notes I’ve seen he has had very good vision and terrific change of direction. Plus he has a receiver pedigree which as a RB puts him in great shape to be a bellcow one day. Even if it doesn’t work out then at least he has a safe 3rd down RB floor. I just can’t see how he would be out of the NFL in a few years with his athleticism/talent combo.
5. Lastly how often do you get the opportunity to take a RB with this kind of upside in the mid to late second? Hell I got him in the early third this year in a draft. If the price keeps going up then it won’t be as beneficial, but how often do you get to draft a RB late 2nd that has the potential to be as good as the first few rbs off the board? Seriously it’s insane value not to take a chance on. Draft one of the stud receivers in the first and take the ultimate potential reward with Gibson at the price of a 2nd.
______________
12 team .5 PPR Dynasty. 1 QB/2 WR/2 RB/1 TE/3 Flex

QB's - Dak, Brees, Stafford.
RB's - Chris Carson, David Johnson, Antonio Gibson, James White, Boston Scott, Latavius Murray, Justin Jackson, Rashaad Penny
WR's - Chris Godwin, DK Metcalf, Diontae Johnson, Jarvis Landry, Denzel Mims, Russell Gage, Curtis Samuel, Anthony Miller, Darnell Mooney, Antonio Brown,
TE's - George Kittle, Dallas Goedert, Jonnu Smith, Greg Olsen, Dalton Keene

Ice
MVP
MVP
Posts: 2642
Joined: Tue May 22, 2018 6:17 pm

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Ice » Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:22 pm

jenkins.math wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:12 pm
Ice wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:38 am
perkinsrooster wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:22 am

I don't get why future picks should be discounted. I get it in finance but how does that work here?
Not really sure this needs an explanation. If I own 2.5 as an example and you want it do you really think you can acquire it for some future random 2nd?

I have been doing this for decades and I just don't see this unless a specific draft class may be perceived extremely weak by pretty much everyone.

This class was considered deep at RB, and WR which drives up value. Next Year's class by comparison is full of question marks especially due to Covid.

One would be a fool IMO to trade away 2.5 as an example unless they got at least a projected middle 1st next and would pretty much have to really dislike this class.

A player you can get today has an entire year to develop and get better vs a complete unknown.

Think Bird in the hand so to speak.


Draft picks a year out shouldn't equate to an entire round of value lost.
Should or shouldn't isn't really relative in my example. Sometimes value is greater or less. The point is no one really trades a pick for a pick. The person acquiring the current pick, if they have any sense at all, is targeting a specific asset and if they have a 1st round grade on the player they will pay the price obviously.

Obviously, there isn't a hard and fast rule but if you live by those in fantasy, your competition will ultimately see it and run over those type of players more often than not from what I have seen over the last 30 plus years playing this crazy game.
The clock is running and there are no timeouts

Bronco Billy
Role Player
Role Player
Posts: 490
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:12 am

Re: Antonio Gibson rocket ship

Postby Bronco Billy » Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:27 pm

perkinsrooster wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:22 am
Ice wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:31 am
Every player Ever Drafted qualifies as boom or bust before they play a down in the NFL people.

Btw, if you don’t discount future picks your not playing this game correctly.

If you can get a Gibson type ,if you like the player, by moving up a few spots a year earlier than the asset you’re giving up that is a win given your player gets an entire year to develop and produce.

Stop making it sound like a great deal. It’s as common as it gets; not a good deal or a bad deal but a fair deal.
I don't get why future picks should be discounted. I get it in finance but how does that work here?
Because relevant information has substantial value, and future draft picks have virtually none of that. There’s no way to know how a player will perform in the NFL until they get to the NFL and start competing against NFL level competition. So even a top rookie FF pick has a lot more unknowns than any rookie who has been going head to head with their NFL peers for a while. Think of even sure things like Trent Richardson and Charles Rogers - they were supposed to be locked in FF plug-and-play players for years.

We simply know a lot more about Gibson right now than we do about 2021 pick 1.10. We don’t even know who 2021 1.10 would be, much less whether he even looks capable at the NFL level, but we would know right now if Gibson had no business being on the field or if, like we do now, that he has exhibited some traits in TC and preseason that indicate that he could have a FF valuable career. That doesn’t mean he’s turned that corner yet - that will happen in anywhere from 1 1/2 weeks to 1 1/2 years from now. But so far the signs are much more positive than they were say 6 months ago. A bird in the hand indeed.
Last edited by Bronco Billy on Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: bjd5211, BucFanJKE, drobes, DynastyDrum30, Forza_Azzurri, JJRules, jomaed, Mjvb5, My BallZach Ertz, Oddball456, PTW32, TaquitoPeddler and 15 guests