Antonio Gibson Rocket Ship - Round 2

[Ice]

Just for the record.

The Loser that is Guice, who many had as the 2nd best RB fell to the 7th RB drafted in the 2018 NFL Draft. He played 5 Games in the NFL starting 1.

He managed to rush over 42 yards in one of those 5 games. 129 of his total 245 yards came in one game on 10 carries.

Prior to that 10 carry game he averaged 1.8, 3.43, and 3.2 YPC on his first 27 carries in his first 3 games. He had a total of 42 carries in his career.

He was a BUST and is a LOSER.

[Bronco Billy]

There are times when I pay attention to a HC/OC because they have a history of thinking outside the box and see in RBs something more than what the rest of us do, picking up guys that others bypass and think little of because they see something that fits what they run. They have a vision and see talent that transcends traditional thinking.

Mike Shanahan/Gary Kubiak did it with Terrell Davis, who was little used at Georgia but ended up being prolific after getting drafted by DEN in the 6th round. So when they picked up on guys like Olandis Gary and Mike Anderson for cheap, so did I and as a result reaped the FF benefits. Then Kubiak goes to HOU and continues the magic with a big slow UDFA like Arian Foster no less.

And Reid has that. He finds RBs that others bypass and turns them into FF gold. Small slow guys out of colleges like Villanova like Brian Westbrook or slow MAC guys like Kareem Hunt.

Now I’m wondering if Rivera/Turner aren’t those kinds of guys also. The took a small white kid out of Stanford and turned him into arguably the most valuable FF asset in the league right now. Yeah, CMC showed us a lot in college, but he came out into the draft with a ton of questions - that he was white, had to be a CoP because of his size, couldn’t possibly run between the tackles in the bigs, went down on first contact too easily, etc. And when they go to WAS together, see something in a guy like Gibson that others don’t enough to draft him when they did then I pay attention - because they’ve shown me that they see things others don’t, won’t, or can’t.

So yeah, like Shanahan/Kubiak or Reid, these guys miss sometimes, They’re human. But they also seem to have vision and identify fit when others let it slip by. Gibson may bust. But he just may be in the exact mold of the type of RB that Rivera and Turner are looking for. That’s enough for me to spend more time studying film and then ultimately trust their judgment over the conventional NFL or FF MB experts wisdom. And I sure don’t risk turning that potential over to another owner in my league for another unknown down the road in the form of a mid to late 1st/high 2nd round pick in a later year - not when we’ve haven’t seen the guy play a regular season snap yet.

[Pullo Vision]

CMC showed us a lot in college, but he came out into the draft with a ton of questions - that he was white, had to be a CoP because of his size, couldn’t possibly run between the tackles in the bigs, went down on first contact too easily, etc.

Pardon for focusing on one part of a much more intricate post, but I'm having difficulties telling if this is a joke. The flip side of this is saying "he has a great chance to succeed in the NFL because he's black." You can't really be dinging an entire group because they're white, right? I mean, they aren't ALL bad. Not every single one of them.

And yes, that's a joke, but I fail to see what his skin has to do with his prospects for NFL success.

[Mike from Canada]

Of course skin pigmentation has nothing to do with it. But all we here these days is that skin pigmentation matters more than anything else so you can't blame someone for bringing it up.

[Mjvb5]

CMC showed us a lot in college, but he came out into the draft with a ton of questions - that he was white, had to be a CoP because of his size, couldn’t possibly run between the tackles in the bigs, went down on first contact too easily, etc.

Pardon for focusing on one part of a much more intricate post, but I'm having difficulties telling if this is a joke. The flip side of this is saying "he has a great chance to succeed in the NFL because he's black." You can't really be dinging an entire group because they're white, right? I mean, they aren't ALL bad. Not every single one of them.

And yes, that's a joke, but I fail to see what his skin has to do with his prospects for NFL success.

I mean as screwed up as it is he's not wrong. A lot of the knocks on mccaffrey were people finding ways to knock him for that by not saying it
"he's quicker than he is fast"
"he's a smart player but he's not physical enough to be an RB"
"Is he willing to take the hits"
stuff like that. Its the same things that guys like lamar, russell, teddy, etc go through because of qbs. They got questioned endlessly on if there smart enough to play qb in the nfl.

[Bronco Billy]

CMC showed us a lot in college, but he came out into the draft with a ton of questions - that he was white, had to be a CoP because of his size, couldn’t possibly run between the tackles in the bigs, went down on first contact too easily, etc.

Pardon for focusing on one part of a much more intricate post, but I'm having difficulties telling if this is a joke. The flip side of this is saying "he has a great chance to succeed in the NFL because he's black." You can't really be dinging an entire group because they're white, right? I mean, they aren't ALL bad. Not every single one of them.

And yes, that's a joke, but I fail to see what his skin has to do with his prospects for NFL success.

Seriously, instead or worrying about being woke or not look at the stats. How many starting white RBs are there in the league right now, or even over the past 20 years? Now, how many of them were studs?

Instead of being politically correct, look at the facts. There were absolutely people judging him on the color of his skin, and not because of being racist but rather but of the data in the pool of RBs in recent history.

GDB the people who don’t recognize actuarial/statistical analysis for examining data for what it is and instead have to read ulterior motives into everything.

[Bronco Billy]

Of course skin pigmentation has nothing to do with it. But all we here these days is that skin pigmentation matters more than anything else so you can't blame someone for bringing it up.

Oh bite me. See the post above.

[Csl312]

And I sure don’t risk turning that potential over to another owner in my league for another unknown down the road in the form of a mid to late 1st/high 2nd round pick in a later year - not when we’ve haven’t seen the guy play a regular season snap yet.

Understanding that a large chunk of your argument is contingent on the actual coaching staff that you have a lot of faith in, I still wonder how you are making this value calculation.

Gibson is going in the mid second. Granted you personally value him higher than that. But for most people who don't, if you are offered a future 1st for your mid second this year I think you take that trade every time. It shouldn't really matter that you have selected a player already with that mid second (again assuming you value him around that level). But if you value him that highly, I'd expect you are selecting him around the 1.06 1.07 range? Otherwise it seems at least fair value to trade for next year's first.

That said I definitely get having guys you think are being under valued and wanting to sit on them. Which I think is basically the situation for you. But wanted to clarify.

[Bronco Billy]

And I sure don’t risk turning that potential over to another owner in my league for another unknown down the road in the form of a mid to late 1st/high 2nd round pick in a later year - not when we’ve haven’t seen the guy play a regular season snap yet.

Understanding that a large chunk of your argument is contingent on the actual coaching staff that you have a lot of faith in, I still wonder how you are making this value calculation.

Gibson is going in the mid second. Granted you personally value him higher than that. But for most people who don't, if you are offered a future 1st for your mid second this year I think you take that trade every time. It shouldn't really matter that you have selected a player already with that mid second (again assuming you value him around that level). But if you value him that highly, I'd expect you are selecting him around the 1.06 1.07 range? Otherwise it seems at least fair value to trade for next year's first.

That said I definitely get having guys you think are being under valued and wanting to sit on them. Which I think is basically the situation for you. But wanted to clarify.

Why would you draft a RB in the middle of the 1st when his ADP indicates he’ll drop into the 2nd - unless you were 100% sold on his talent and you were sure you knew more than everyone else? I’m certain that I am not the smartest guy in the room.

And if you do believe more strongly in a RB based upon incrementally greater information getting out, or that you have faith in the coaching staff, once you have him in the fold by drafting on an earlier date why would you then swap him out later for a future complete unknown unless that exchange was for a substantial increase in value?

It seems like you are making an assumption that value is static, both in the same year and from year to year. I would disagree with that.

[Jigga94]

Of course skin pigmentation has nothing to do with it. But all we here these days is that skin pigmentation matters more than anything else so you can't blame someone for bringing it up.

Oh bite me. See the post above.

CMC would be a great slot WR for Brady

[Mike from Canada]

Of course skin pigmentation has nothing to do with it. But all we here these days is that skin pigmentation matters more than anything else so you can't blame someone for bringing it up.

Oh bite me. See the post above.

I wasn't attacking you.

[Bronco Billy]

Of course skin pigmentation has nothing to do with it. But all we here these days is that skin pigmentation matters more than anything else so you can't blame someone for bringing it up.

Oh bite me. See the post above.

I wasn't attacking you.

My apologies for misinterpreting in that case.

[SoftwoodGrampian]

🤮

[Mjvb5]

Moving on from the above...
I like the talk coming out about Gibson and how this backfield is shaping up for his future. I still just don't have enough faith in the talent given how raw he is. As a mid 2nd I loveeeeee him. But I cant justify him in the first over the wrs available still.

[FantasyFreak]

🤮

Rocket ships have been know to cause nausea.