Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

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bjd5211
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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby bjd5211 » Tue May 26, 2020 4:17 pm

StripesOfKC wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 3:02 pm
bjd5211 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 2:58 pm
Cameron Giles wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 2:35 pm


That's not really an argument against it.
Chase wouldn't have been drafted after Ruggs if he had been eligible this year. He will be a top 10 pick, could be top 5 but 3 of the top 5 slots are basically already taken by Lawrence, Fields and Oregon LT Penei Sewell, so that might be a tough barrier to crack.
Not sure Fields is as much of a top 5 lock as you are suggesting. Have a feeling the fantasy community is higher on hum for the rushing upside than the NFL is.

mid 1st round or higher? Yes, he is probably a lock. Top 5? Not at this point IMO
No, he's a lock, probably 2nd overall.

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby FantasyFreak » Tue May 26, 2020 5:50 pm

dynastyninja wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:24 am
Etienne looks solid for the NFL, but I'm not sure I'd be thrilled if he ended up being the top RB prospect in 2021. A lot can happen, though.
Totally agree. A senior RB who would not have been the top prospect in his junior class and returned. Next year's RB class looks really weak to me. Guys like Najee Harris even being mentioned near the top is concerning.

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby FantasyFreak » Tue May 26, 2020 5:53 pm

bjd5211 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 4:17 pm
StripesOfKC wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 3:02 pm
bjd5211 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 2:58 pm


Chase wouldn't have been drafted after Ruggs if he had been eligible this year. He will be a top 10 pick, could be top 5 but 3 of the top 5 slots are basically already taken by Lawrence, Fields and Oregon LT Penei Sewell, so that might be a tough barrier to crack.
Not sure Fields is as much of a top 5 lock as you are suggesting. Have a feeling the fantasy community is higher on hum for the rushing upside than the NFL is.

mid 1st round or higher? Yes, he is probably a lock. Top 5? Not at this point IMO
No, he's a lock, probably 2nd overall.
If he plays poorly I don't think that's the case. He's viewed as a top 5 pick right now, but it doesn't mean teams have written their boards for 2021 in permanent marker in May of 2020.

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby Packerland » Tue May 26, 2020 6:54 pm

FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 5:53 pm
bjd5211 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 4:17 pm
StripesOfKC wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 3:02 pm


Not sure Fields is as much of a top 5 lock as you are suggesting. Have a feeling the fantasy community is higher on hum for the rushing upside than the NFL is.

mid 1st round or higher? Yes, he is probably a lock. Top 5? Not at this point IMO
No, he's a lock, probably 2nd overall.
If he plays poorly I don't think that's the case. He's viewed as a top 5 pick right now, but it doesn't mean teams have written their boards for 2021 in permanent marker in May of 2020.
Trey Lance is getting a lot of hype right now and could end up passing Fields as well for 2nd QB off the board.
10 Team .5 PPR 1 QB League

QB: Goff, Brady, Herbert, Tannehill
RB: CEH, JT, Akers, Dobbins, Mixon
WR: Adams, Godwin, McLaurin, Lamb, Chark, Claypool, Pittman, Diontae, Anderson
TE: Andrews, Goedert

Picks:
2021: 4 1sts, 1 2nd
2022: 1 1st, 2 2nds

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby esloan35 » Tue May 26, 2020 8:10 pm

Johnny Canuck wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:12 am
This is an interesting topic, because there's a real chance that we don't get that much more info on these players (if there's no cfb season this yr). So I'll do a top 12 simply based on what we know now (which isn't a lot).

1. Travis Etienne (RB)
2. Ja'Marr Chase (WR)
3. Chuba Hubbard (RB)
4. Justyn Ross (WR)
5. Najee Harris (RB)
6. DeVonta Smith (WR)
7. Rondale Moore (WR)
8. Kylin Hill (RB)
9. C.J. Verdell (RB)
10. Tamorrion Terry (WR)
11. Kyle Pitts (TE)
12. Trevor Lawrence (QB)

*HM: Justin Fields

RBs always go to the top, so I'm going to put TE and CH up there. I think those are the only ones that could challenge Chase depending on landing spot
I agree with you, there is a real chance for that scenario to play out.

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby FantasyFreak » Tue May 26, 2020 8:16 pm

I'm Canadian, and want Hubbard to do well, but I don't see him as a top prospect. Very straight line, and I just don't think he's a guy that is going to enamour a lot of NFL teams as a lead back. Rondale Moore is a really good college player, but I think he is a complimentary piece to an NFL offense, not a focal point. Najee Harris just isn't that good. He's not fast, he's not elusive, and he's going to be 23 next year. Etienne went back to school this year vs the RB class. The RB class next year is very weak compared to this year, IMO. Chase looks very good. Lawrence and Fields should be top end SF prospects. I like Devonta Smith, but again, he returned and that's concerning. The fact that so many of the "top" guys next year returned as seniors vs this class tells me next year isn't as deep, or as good. Still some good players, but I don't see the talent vs this year.

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby StripesOfKC » Tue May 26, 2020 8:28 pm

FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 8:16 pm
I'm Canadian, and want Hubbard to do well, but I don't see him as a top prospect. Very straight line, and I just don't think he's a guy that is going to enamour a lot of NFL teams as a lead back. Rondale Moore is a really good college player, but I think he is a complimentary piece to an NFL offense, not a focal point. Najee Harris just isn't that good. He's not fast, he's not elusive, and he's going to be 23 next year. Etienne went back to school this year vs the RB class. The RB class next year is very weak compared to this year, IMO. Chase looks very good. Lawrence and Fields should be top end SF prospects. I like Devonta Smith, but again, he returned and that's concerning. The fact that so many of the "top" guys next year returned as seniors vs this class tells me next year isn't as deep, or as good. Still some good players, but I don't see the talent vs this year.
Players are allowed return for reasons other than their draft stock not being high. Age is a consideration; but besides that, I don’t see how a player returning should dock them or change what you think of them as a prospect.

Smith probably wanted to boost his draft stock with Jeudy+Ruggs gone and more of a feature role opened up.
Etienne received a second round grade lol. You’re acting like he was a day 3 pick compared to this class. A player is allowed to want another year as a college kid before entering the NFL or be pissed at ending his career with a Championship game loss and want another crack without it being a red flag or indication of inferior talent

I do overall agree that the RB class is weaker compared to this year (though I think the WR class is just as good or close to as good), but I disagree with your reasons
Team 1

8 Team PPR
2 QB, 2 RB, 3 WR, 3 FLEX, 1 TE, 1 D, 1 K
2019-20 Champion
QB: Burrow, Tannehill, Stafford, Eason
RB: Jonathan Taylor, JK Dobbins, CEH, D'Andre Swift, Damien Harris, Pollard, Cohen, Darrynton Evans
WR: AJ Brown, McLaurin, Justin Jefferson, Julio, DJ Moore, Courtland Sutton, Jerry Jeudy, DJ Chark, Gallup, Mims, Pittman, Bryan Edwards, Parris Campbell, Mooney, Collin Johnson, Marquez Callaway
TE: Kittle, Hockenson, Gesicki, Trautman
D: Steelers
K: Random Dude

2021: 1.6
2022: 3 1sts, 1 2nd, 2 3rd, 2 4ths
2023: 2 1sts, 3 2nds, 1 3rd, 1 4th

Team 2

IDP Orphan 12 Team 1 QB PPR 0.5 Pt Per Comp, -0.5 Pt for Incomp
QB: Rodgers, Brady, Tua
RB: Mixon, CEH, Michel, James White
WR: Lockett, Gallup, Justin Jefferson, Reagor, Mims
TE: Gesicki, Goedert

DL: Chris Jones, Grady Jarrett, Jeffrey Simmons
LB: Brian Burns, Logan Wilson, Jordyn Brooks, K'Lavon Chiasson
DB: Marlon Humphrey, Eddie Jackson, Chuck Clark, Xavier McKinney, Kyle Dugger

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby FantasyFreak » Tue May 26, 2020 8:45 pm

StripesOfKC wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 8:28 pm
FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 8:16 pm
I'm Canadian, and want Hubbard to do well, but I don't see him as a top prospect. Very straight line, and I just don't think he's a guy that is going to enamour a lot of NFL teams as a lead back. Rondale Moore is a really good college player, but I think he is a complimentary piece to an NFL offense, not a focal point. Najee Harris just isn't that good. He's not fast, he's not elusive, and he's going to be 23 next year. Etienne went back to school this year vs the RB class. The RB class next year is very weak compared to this year, IMO. Chase looks very good. Lawrence and Fields should be top end SF prospects. I like Devonta Smith, but again, he returned and that's concerning. The fact that so many of the "top" guys next year returned as seniors vs this class tells me next year isn't as deep, or as good. Still some good players, but I don't see the talent vs this year.
Players are allowed return for reasons other than their draft stock not being high. Age is a consideration; but besides that, I don’t see how a player returning should dock them or change what you think of them as a prospect.

Smith probably wanted to boost his draft stock with Jeudy+Ruggs gone and more of a feature role opened up.
Etienne received a second round grade lol. You’re acting like he was a day 3 pick compared to this class. A player is allowed to want another year as a college kid before entering the NFL or be pissed at ending his career with a Championship game loss and want another crack without it being a red flag or indication of inferior talent

I do overall agree that the RB class is weaker compared to this year (though I think the WR class is just as good or close to as good), but I disagree with your reasons
Yep, but the few I mentioned went through the process, and didn't like the results. Any RB who goes back is making a mistake, unless it's someone like Chubb, with injury issues hurting his production, IMO/ In terms of our rookie drafts, Etienne lose a full year of his prime at his position. The fact Senior RB's are the top of the class isn't good, and Chuba is a RS Junior, so basically the same thing, in regards to age. My point about Etienne is, he was lumped somewhere in between the top backs this year, but certainly not at the top. The fact he is THE top back for next near is concerning, especially since other seniors like Harris, are as well. BTW, you're reasoning on Etienne isn't really valid either. He already won a National Championship. It's not about talent inferiority, (apparently he made remarks about wanting to sit around and play video games rather than return to class as one of the reasons for waiting on his declaration, too. Not exactly a great answer) It's about not being superior to this years talent, but clearly being defined as the superior talent in next years class, but a year older. Next years top RB's all appear to be seniors, and that's not good. Maybe that clarifies it, more?

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby StripesOfKC » Tue May 26, 2020 9:07 pm

FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 8:45 pm
StripesOfKC wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 8:28 pm
FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 8:16 pm
I'm Canadian, and want Hubbard to do well, but I don't see him as a top prospect. Very straight line, and I just don't think he's a guy that is going to enamour a lot of NFL teams as a lead back. Rondale Moore is a really good college player, but I think he is a complimentary piece to an NFL offense, not a focal point. Najee Harris just isn't that good. He's not fast, he's not elusive, and he's going to be 23 next year. Etienne went back to school this year vs the RB class. The RB class next year is very weak compared to this year, IMO. Chase looks very good. Lawrence and Fields should be top end SF prospects. I like Devonta Smith, but again, he returned and that's concerning. The fact that so many of the "top" guys next year returned as seniors vs this class tells me next year isn't as deep, or as good. Still some good players, but I don't see the talent vs this year.
Players are allowed return for reasons other than their draft stock not being high. Age is a consideration; but besides that, I don’t see how a player returning should dock them or change what you think of them as a prospect.

Smith probably wanted to boost his draft stock with Jeudy+Ruggs gone and more of a feature role opened up.
Etienne received a second round grade lol. You’re acting like he was a day 3 pick compared to this class. A player is allowed to want another year as a college kid before entering the NFL or be pissed at ending his career with a Championship game loss and want another crack without it being a red flag or indication of inferior talent

I do overall agree that the RB class is weaker compared to this year (though I think the WR class is just as good or close to as good), but I disagree with your reasons
Yep, but the few I mentioned went through the process, and didn't like the results. Any RB who goes back is making a mistake, unless it's someone like Chubb, with injury issues hurting his production, IMO/ In terms of our rookie drafts, Etienne lose a full year of his prime at his position. The fact Senior RB's are the top of the class isn't good, and Chuba is a RS Junior, so basically the same thing, in regards to age. My point about Etienne is, he was lumped somewhere in between the top backs this year, but certainly not at the top. The fact he is THE top back for next near is concerning, especially since other seniors like Harris, are as well. BTW, you're reasoning on Etienne isn't really valid either. He already won a National Championship. It's not about talent inferiority, (apparently he made remarks about wanting to sit around and play video games rather than return to class as one of the reasons for waiting on his declaration, too. Not exactly a great answer) It's about not being superior to this years talent, but clearly being defined as the superior talent in next years class, but a year older. Next years top RB's all appear to be seniors, and that's not good. Maybe that clarifies it, more?
Yes, it does. I didn't significantly disagree with you. I do believe Etienne made a mistake in returning, and a bunch of seniors isn't ideal for the RB position. But for the championship loss, I can imagine that--even having a championship--seeing a 29 game win streak end in a near blowout loss is a sour note to leave on, especially considering that a return for Etienne means returning to a team in a puffball conference with an easy route to come back to the playoff next year.

For Smith, I just don't know that it was about draft process results being bad vs thinking he can make them better with him and Waddle as clear alphas next year.

I do see Hubbard as a guy the NFL isn't as high on as the fantasy community though. I can take a linear runner (like Etienne) if they have excellent contact balance and see a potential fantasy stud in the rough, but Hubbard doesn't have that.

Harris I also agree on to a point. He is making his name off pass catching skill which is rare for that size but the combine and 40 time will be very telling for him.

I hope the CFB season gets played because this class could really use a Josh Jacobs type late bloomer (not necessarily a player like Jacobs--just of a similar trajectory). I think Max Borghi, Zamir White if he stays healthy and possibly Kylin Hill with the pass catching work that comes from a Mike Leach system could fit that bill (although Hill is a senior).

Overall though, I see next year's draft as a time to get a WR, QB or TE and be set at RB in advance.
Team 1

8 Team PPR
2 QB, 2 RB, 3 WR, 3 FLEX, 1 TE, 1 D, 1 K
2019-20 Champion
QB: Burrow, Tannehill, Stafford, Eason
RB: Jonathan Taylor, JK Dobbins, CEH, D'Andre Swift, Damien Harris, Pollard, Cohen, Darrynton Evans
WR: AJ Brown, McLaurin, Justin Jefferson, Julio, DJ Moore, Courtland Sutton, Jerry Jeudy, DJ Chark, Gallup, Mims, Pittman, Bryan Edwards, Parris Campbell, Mooney, Collin Johnson, Marquez Callaway
TE: Kittle, Hockenson, Gesicki, Trautman
D: Steelers
K: Random Dude

2021: 1.6
2022: 3 1sts, 1 2nd, 2 3rd, 2 4ths
2023: 2 1sts, 3 2nds, 1 3rd, 1 4th

Team 2

IDP Orphan 12 Team 1 QB PPR 0.5 Pt Per Comp, -0.5 Pt for Incomp
QB: Rodgers, Brady, Tua
RB: Mixon, CEH, Michel, James White
WR: Lockett, Gallup, Justin Jefferson, Reagor, Mims
TE: Gesicki, Goedert

DL: Chris Jones, Grady Jarrett, Jeffrey Simmons
LB: Brian Burns, Logan Wilson, Jordyn Brooks, K'Lavon Chiasson
DB: Marlon Humphrey, Eddie Jackson, Chuck Clark, Xavier McKinney, Kyle Dugger

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby FantasyFreak » Tue May 26, 2020 9:11 pm

StripesOfKC wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:07 pm
FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 8:45 pm
StripesOfKC wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 8:28 pm


Players are allowed return for reasons other than their draft stock not being high. Age is a consideration; but besides that, I don’t see how a player returning should dock them or change what you think of them as a prospect.

Smith probably wanted to boost his draft stock with Jeudy+Ruggs gone and more of a feature role opened up.
Etienne received a second round grade lol. You’re acting like he was a day 3 pick compared to this class. A player is allowed to want another year as a college kid before entering the NFL or be pissed at ending his career with a Championship game loss and want another crack without it being a red flag or indication of inferior talent

I do overall agree that the RB class is weaker compared to this year (though I think the WR class is just as good or close to as good), but I disagree with your reasons
Yep, but the few I mentioned went through the process, and didn't like the results. Any RB who goes back is making a mistake, unless it's someone like Chubb, with injury issues hurting his production, IMO/ In terms of our rookie drafts, Etienne lose a full year of his prime at his position. The fact Senior RB's are the top of the class isn't good, and Chuba is a RS Junior, so basically the same thing, in regards to age. My point about Etienne is, he was lumped somewhere in between the top backs this year, but certainly not at the top. The fact he is THE top back for next near is concerning, especially since other seniors like Harris, are as well. BTW, you're reasoning on Etienne isn't really valid either. He already won a National Championship. It's not about talent inferiority, (apparently he made remarks about wanting to sit around and play video games rather than return to class as one of the reasons for waiting on his declaration, too. Not exactly a great answer) It's about not being superior to this years talent, but clearly being defined as the superior talent in next years class, but a year older. Next years top RB's all appear to be seniors, and that's not good. Maybe that clarifies it, more?
Yes, it does. I didn't significantly disagree with you. I do believe Etienne made a mistake in returning, and a bunch of seniors isn't ideal for the RB position. But for the championship loss, I can imagine that--even having a championship--seeing a 29 game win streak end in a near blowout loss is a sour note to leave on, especially considering that a return for Etienne means returning to a team in a puffball conference with an easy route to come back to the playoff next year.

For Smith, I just don't know that it was about draft process results being bad vs thinking he can make them better with him and Waddle as clear alphas next year.

I do see Hubbard as a guy the NFL isn't as high on as the fantasy community though. I can take a linear runner (like Etienne) if they have excellent contact balance and see a potential fantasy stud in the rough, but Hubbard doesn't have that.

Harris I also agree on to a point. He is making his name off pass catching skill which is rare for that size but the combine and 40 time will be very telling for him.

I hope the CFB season gets played because this class could really use a Josh Jacobs type late bloomer (not necessarily a player like Jacobs--just of a similar trajectory). I think Max Borghi, Zamir White if he stays healthy and possibly Kylin Hill with the pass catching work that comes from a Mike Leach system could fit that bill (although Hill is a senior).

Overall though, I see next year's draft as a time to get a WR, QB or TE and be set at RB in advance.
Agreed. :thumbup:

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby Straycatz2 » Tue May 26, 2020 10:09 pm

FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 8:45 pm
My point about Etienne is, he was lumped somewhere in between the top backs this year, but certainly not at the top.
PFF had Etienne rated as nations best RB. And if one place rated him that way, it's not a stretch to say another team could have.
I'm pretty sure most teams wouldn't have guessed CEH would be first RB taken nor Ruggs as first WR taken.... it only takes 1 team to fall in love as we've seen so many times.

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby Straycatz2 » Tue May 26, 2020 10:16 pm

bjd5211 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:00 am
Because there hasn't been a WR the caliber of Chase for several years, added to the fact that the RB class is weak and he pretty easily goes to the top of the list.
Have you see Lamb player comp on player profiler? The only player to receive this comp!

All jokes aside, can't wait to see how Chase handles this season to cement his top status.

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby FantasyFreak » Tue May 26, 2020 10:32 pm

Straycatz2 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:09 pm
FantasyFreak wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 8:45 pm
My point about Etienne is, he was lumped somewhere in between the top backs this year, but certainly not at the top.
PFF had Etienne rated as nations best RB. And if one place rated him that way, it's not a stretch to say another team could have.
I'm pretty sure most teams wouldn't have guessed CEH would be first RB taken nor Ruggs as first WR taken.... it only takes 1 team to fall in love as we've seen so many times.
So what? Who are PFF? Clearly if he was the nations top RB he would have declared. PFF is massively over rated. PFF had Moss as the top RB out of declared RB's. Weak argument. Monty was too high the year before. Penny the year before that because IMO, broken tackles are are off. Penny, Monty etc faced inferior completion, and a broken tackles, which is basically being touched. PFF isn't the be all and end all. They are a source, that's it. Clearly, over the last few years, they haven't sourced out well on their top RB's.

BTW, to the bolded: CEH still declared. Apparently Etienne was not very confident in any 1 of the 32 NFL teams falling in love with him.

Who cares about Lamb's PPF comp? Again, Matt Kelley provides a valuable service but it's far from infallible. I'd take Chase over Lamb all day, based on metrics AND tape. Just wait until Chase has his PFF comp. Chase looks better to me. I like Lamb, but have my doubts he can be a true WR1. Chase I think may have that ability, although I nave concerns about his hands, and the double catches. Lamb's hands are glue. Chasw will obviously have a down year, but I like his game more than Ceedee's.

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby ericanadian » Wed May 27, 2020 4:36 am

I’m curious to see how Master Teague performs as the lead back in Ohio State. CJ Verdell has NFL size and speed. Not a top tier guy, but could provide some depth for the class.
All I Der Is Win - 16 Team IDP League (Pass TD 6pts)

QB - Stafford, Tannehill, Mariota
RB - Gordon, Cook, Penny, Guice, Harris, Laird, Love
WR - Julio, C. Davis, AJ Brown, Samuel, Washington, Di. Johnson, Isabella
TE - Henry, Andrews
LB - Kuechly, R. Smith
DL - Hunter, Armstead, Quinn
DB - D. James, Baker, Edmunds
K - Just a stupid kicker

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Re: Way too Early 2021 Draft Thread

Postby FantasyFreak » Wed May 27, 2020 4:40 am

ericanadian wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 4:36 am
I’m curious to see how Master Teague performs as the lead back in Ohio State. CJ Verdell has NFL size and speed. Not a top tier guy, but could provide some depth for the class.
Hopefully well. So much potential for team names with this guy. Well on the way to a solid rap career with the name alone, if it doesn't work out.


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