Trade Etiquette Questions Thread

[jordanzs]

I would tell the commissioner what happened.

And either make that owner give you his 2020 & 2021 3rds.

Or have the commissioner add in a compensatory 3.13 in 2019/2020 or 2020/2021. Commish did you a disservice by keeping you on a flawed platform for so long. This is the least he can do to right the ship.

Otherwise I would bail out of the league. The other owner shouldn't have the right to back out of the (flawed system) trade.

[Cult of Dionysus]

It was a gentleman's agreement. It's not enforceable. If the dude wants to back out, he can, for any reason or no reason at all. Makes him look like a douche, but that's why it's called a "gentlemans" agreement.

This isnt a league issue or a commissioner issue or a platform issue. It's a Dudes issue.

We have trade moratoriums in DLF Premuim League and USFl Superflex, while fees are collected and salary caps are updated. However, I'm still open for trades during this time. So even in leagues with top-notch Bylaws, there's still a place for gentleman's agreements. Just need gentleman to execute it.

[never_punts]

Seeking advice from vets. What's the best way to "shop" picks or players to get the best return while not upsetting other owners?

For example, say you want to shop a 1st to get the best WR you can get in return. Do you approach each owner individually? And then choose the best offer? How do you handle multiple negotiations for the same asset? Is it best to just announce to everyone that "Pick XX is for sale and I'll take the best offer"? Or do you let each owner know in private that you are fielding multiple offers for the asset on the table?

[Ice]

In large leagues I my use trade bait to let owners know players are available for high asset players or picks but I contact owners individually.

Openly trying to play owners against each other is bush league. I may ask an owner what it will take to get a deal done from time to time just find out how serious an owner really is.

If they are stupid with a crazy offer I usually write that owner off and will only counter offers as that type of owner is a waste of time.

Ultimately trading with experienced owners will require win/win deals within each owners risk tolerance and leaning an owners risk tolerance is a key component to trading.

[Pac_Eddy]

Seeking advice from vets. What's the best way to "shop" picks or players to get the best return while not upsetting other owners?

For example, say you want to shop a 1st to get the best WR you can get in return. Do you approach each owner individually? And then choose the best offer? How do you handle multiple negotiations for the same asset? Is it best to just announce to everyone that "Pick XX is for sale and I'll take the best offer"? Or do you let each owner know in private that you are fielding multiple offers for the asset on the table?

I'd post something to the league on a message board, trade block, or whatever your league uses.

Then follow up with some ballpark opening offers for WRs that you want. Don't super low-ball people, that can be a big turnoff.

And yes, let others know that you're in other trade talks if it's true. They should assume as much, but tell them too.

And don't consider any offer legit until it's offered through the website. Verbal or written offers fall through, don't think it's a done deal.

[never_punts]

Thanks a ton for the prompt feedback. I am only a 2nd year dynasty player and I've never truly 'shopped' a pick and want to make sure I do so respectfully. I just acquired a 2020 1st and want to see what I could get for it without seeming as if I am pitting owners against each other.

Given advice above I think I'll post on our trade block so that it's public knowledge and then reach out privately about the players I like.

[Bronco Billy]

Obviously there’s lots of different ways of getting this done. There’s really no right way, but rather finding something that fits your style. Do you want to do the work? Then figure what pieces you are willing to move in a trade, research through FF sites or MBs like this one what value those pieces have, review all the rosters in your league and see who has expendable players that you want to acquire and research their value likewise, and then put together and email out some trade offers.

If you don’t want to do the work but rather have others do it, post on the league MB or an all league email that you’re looking for XX position and are willing to trade or look at rosters where there appear to be expendable pieces and shoot off emails to those owners asking if they are interested in trading.

I’ll put forth some of my MO for trading and some thoughts:

I like putting forth specific trade offers. I don’t like it when I get an email saying things like “What would you want for XX?” or “XX is available, what will you give me?”. If a guy wants to trade with me for some of my players, don’t expect me to assign the value on both sides of the trade. Come to me with an idea of what your idea of value is and maybe a short explanation why. I’m not interested in trying to read your mind or create my idea if of your value for you, so I don’t do it to others when I am shopping.

I don’t throw out lowball offers or a bunch of crap against the wall offers hoping to get someone to bite. I treat others with some respect for their teams and expect others to do likewise with me. I know some guys enjoying trying to screw over other owners and treat them accordingly, but I like doing relatively fair deals and want to keep dealing in the future with everyone. I don’t want the league reputation of being a bad trader or the guy always looking to take advantage. In a good trade, both sides should walk away feeling that while they gave something of value up that their both improved their overall teams. A lowball offer to me turns me off immediately and makes me think negatively of the other owner, so I don’t do it to others. Everyone wants to walk away from a trade feeling good about the deal.

Different people value their assets differently, and usually value what pieces they already have higher than those they don’t have. If you can’t come to anywhere near agreement on value of players, be cordial in the disagreement and don’t take it personally. It’s okay to part ways thinking very differently of the same player, but I don’t want to disparage his view point because I want to trade in the future with them. Be polite and walk away with kindness. You want to kill any future deals with me? Treat me like I’m an idiot for not thinking like you.

I don’t mind giving up a bit more value than I know one of my players is worth if I am getting back a piece that I feel has great upside. Even if I’m wrong in hindsight and end up losing in the long run, if there is a player that I really want I’ll pay a bit of a premium for them. You’ve got to give something of value to get something of value. Besides, getting burned occasionally happens to anyone who trades and it will make the other owner a more likely future trade partner. Take your lumps with grace and some self-degrading humor. It will pay off in the long run.

Just my thoughts. Find your trade partner with specific players in mind and not nebulous and vague offers, do your homework ahead of the offer and know values on each side. Find try to put forth a pretty fair deal early on and be prepared to substitute closely valued alternatives, try to see the other owner’s players from their point of view, and be positive and have fun with it, even when the trade doesn't work out. When I put forth trade offers, other owners always listen and discuss rather than just shutting it down - because I’ve made myself a person others like to trade with.

[never_punts]

Just my thoughts. Find your trade partner with specific players in mind and not nebulous and vague offers, do your homework ahead of the offer and know values on each side. Find try to put forth a pretty fair deal early on and be prepared to substitute closely valued alternatives, try to see the other owner’s players from their point of view, and be positive and have fun with it, even when the trade doesn't work out. When I put forth trade offers, other owners always listen and discuss rather than just shutting it down - because I’ve made myself a person others like to trade with.

This is a super helpful perspective, I appreciate you taking the time to share. In the past when I've traded, I've had folks approach me with a specific offer, or I've approached another owner with a very specific opening offer. I've never used the trade block or publicly asked folks to give offers for an asset of high value, so it is very valuable to get input from others for this type of situation. I just want to ensure that I am doing it the right way and staying valued as a trade partner while also not missing out on the best deal. I think I'll just have to keep working and find that balance.

[Bronco Billy]

Just my thoughts. Find your trade partner with specific players in mind and not nebulous and vague offers, do your homework ahead of the offer and know values on each side. Find try to put forth a pretty fair deal early on and be prepared to substitute closely valued alternatives, try to see the other owner’s players from their point of view, and be positive and have fun with it, even when the trade doesn't work out. When I put forth trade offers, other owners always listen and discuss rather than just shutting it down - because I’ve made myself a person others like to trade with.

This is a super helpful perspective, I appreciate you taking the time to share. In the past when I've traded, I've had folks approach me with a specific offer, or I've approached another owner with a very specific opening offer. I've never used the trade block or publicly asked folks to give offers for an asset of high value, so it is very valuable to get input from others for this type of situation. I just want to ensure that I am doing it the right way and staying valued as a trade partner while also not missing out on the best deal. I think I'll just have to keep working and find that balance.

There’s nothing wrong with posting at the trade bait page or sending out an all-call to a MB or the league email. Just a couple of thoughts from my perspective on doing that: 1) you are giving the perception to others that you don’t value those players as highly and that they are expendable. That may not be your intent or position, but it is a likely and reasonable reaction from others. Be aware of that, 2) by doing so, you are putting others in the drivers seat as far as assigning value. That’s fine, but know that their idea of value may not match yours, and 3) you are asking others to do the work and be the aggressors. You may miss out on opportunities for trades from more passive owners who prefer to let the offers come to them. In fact, you may find that you are one of the more passive owners and don’t mind letting others do the heavy lifting in trade deals. That’s okay too. There are others in the league who likely enjoy doing the research and value fitting.

It’s all a matter of finding what works best for you.

[ckrumm24]

A helpful tip for making offers or countering to owners who are clearly not as "informed" as you is to use ADP and/or trade analyzer tools to support your offers. Don't automatically do this as you could be shooting yourself in the foot, but if you are dealing with an owner that asks/makes absurd offers (might just be using an anchoring technique), but can be reasoned with, I would use this technique. A lot of the less informed owners just don't want to feel like they are getting taken advantage of so using a "neutral" index can help you make a deal.

[ckrumm24]

I don't know if my post rebutting "pinning owners against each others" got deleted or i just didn't post it, but I strongly disagree with that sentiment. You are just eBaying players, it is not Bush league. There's a way to do it tastefully and in a less obvious/public way.

[never_punts]

What I usually like to do is go straight to an owner, propose a deal and negotiate from there. I'm typically the "aggressor" type and I come well researched with ADP and trade values to back my valuations if it comes down to it. I would like to "shop" my 1st this go 'round since it is inarguably an appreciating asset right now and maybe i could get some bites from owners who value it more highly than I do that I'd otherwise miss out on. I guess I'm sort of hoping that a player will be on the table that i would have otherwise not expected to be.

[Bronco Billy]

What I usually like to do is go straight to an owner, propose a deal and negotiate from there. I'm typically the "aggressor" type and I come well researched with ADP and trade values to back my valuations if it comes down to it. I would like to "shop" my 1st this go 'round since it is inarguably an appreciating asset right now and maybe i could get some bites from owners who value it more highly than I do that I'd otherwise miss out on. I guess I'm sort of hoping that a player will be on the table that i would have otherwise not expected to be.

If you are in a league like mine that holds its rookie draft simultaneous to or immediately subsequent to the NFL draft, this is an optimal time to milk value from draft picks. Owners are hyped on the impending draft and some want to trade before the rookies are selected to teams - get in before situations solidify and they could be forced into bidding wars to jockey into the slot they need for their preferred player.

Theoretically the picks could gain value if a lot of rookies end up in desirable spots, but value could also drop after the draft if some rookies end up in perceived bad spots. Right now you can play on the uncertainty of the situation, which in my opinion only adds leverage to whomever holds the pick. This is a great time to be aggressive and shop to multiple owners rather than being passive and letting the NFL draft dictate some value

[FantasyFreak]

You can post it publicly, no issues. That's basically what a trade block is. However never say you will take the best offer. Don't give the impression you "have to" sell the player, or you will not get the return you are looking for. It reeks of desperation. I prefer going to multiple owners in private, and exploring trades I want. Peruse rosters, and think, "what do I want out of trading this player". Then send them a DM, exploring those possibilities.

It's also not an issue telling somebody you have some offers from other owners. It sometimes helps to create more demand, but you need to be sincere about it, as if you try to drum up interest like that consistently without anything ever happening, owners may become wary of your tactics. Letting them know there are others interested also creates more urgency to get a deal done, if they are interested. I have always found being pro active if I want to trade a player works best. Don't wait for others to come to me, go to them. You get a better idea of the demand for the player in your league, and what possibilities are out there.

[lawilt]

use the trade block, giving others an idea what you're looking for in return.

don't be that guy that sends offers saying "what do you want for x?", those are the worst when they're never willing to make the first move. don't send long paragraphs how it's a great trade for the other guy, those are generally lies.