Deshaun Watson without Hopkins

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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby sloth8u » Mon Oct 30, 2017 6:51 am

smoger45 wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 6:31 am
But it does help if you dont have any wr's producing and your still winning with Watson overproducing.
and....your not selling, he's your team. congrats...you have yourself a qb. in the big picture, it means very little unless you wish to sell for top dollar. my guess is....you will ride the hot streak and neglect the opportunity to add a significant "other piece" for the big picture.

dont blame you one bit for riding the hot hand. i would aswell. the idea of buying/selling qb though is league dependant, so you may very well be able to trade watson for a bunch...but the community could care less, most teams are content at qb.

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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby sloth8u » Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:07 am

bigchiefbc wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 6:48 am
StableOfRBs wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 6:17 am
sloth8u wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 5:52 am


i believe that your missing the point. most could care less who the overall qb 1 is. we could run down a list of the top scoring qb every year and most times we would find that it means absolutely nothing besides that you have an every week starter. of course we want the high end guys, who doesnt. if you drafted watson, your keeping him or selling for the farm...but it is truly irrelevant if he is the "#1 qb".

some are simply pointing out that others have been the top qb to be...in the past, and at the end of the day....does it really matter.
This.

Unless I'm in a 2QB league I don't care who my QB is, Dak/Wentz/Watson could all be the #1 dynasty QB but as long as it isn't like McCown or Hoyer/Beathard I'm not gonna sweat the position.

Watson could end his career 18 years from now having given you a minimum of 20 points each week or whatever and that's great for him and the people who own him but it's not like I'm gonna try and make a move to acquire him or reach for him in a startup, still gonna wait on QB like I have in redraft for the past 3 years and settle for a stable vet with less upside so I can upgrade at a different position.

I heard about it 2-3 years ago with Luck and I heard about it last year with Dak and I'm hearing about it this year with Watson, having the QB1 isn't as important as having a QB1, as long as I've got a solid starter every week (or even a couple low end guys to mix and match), I'm good.



Can't wait to have this conversation about Jackson or Darnold or Rosen or whoever in the next year or two, though.
You're totally right, but this answer is exactly why I hate 1QB leagues with less than 16 teams. Having an awesome QB should mean something, and formats that devalue QBs are lame to me. But this is off-topic I guess.
if you want to make qb's more valuable....just make passing td's worth 3....that should take care of it. the general idea here is...less is more. a guy could go for 200 and 4 tds, wind up with 20. a guy could go for 300 2tds...go for 18

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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby Phaded » Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:21 am

It is a little early to say that.. But he could get there.

He looks way better than Cam or RG3 ever did though.

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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby ninotoreS » Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:33 am

Just to be clear, folks: I agree it's too early to assert it. I don't think it's too early to begin considering it. Would any current Watson owners do a straight exchange for Carr, Mariota, Cam, Winston, or Wilson right now?

Anyway...

Richard Sherman on Deshaun Watson: "The best game any quarterback has ever played against us, and we’ve played all the legends"

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/rich ... gainst-us/
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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby ArrylT » Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:46 am

In answer to the original question ... Should he be in CONSIDERATION for QB1?

Sure.

Is he the QB1 in Dynasty?

Probably not.

Does it matter?

Obviously to some who have posted - not so much - but that obviously will depend on your league settings.

And that might be what matters most. How do the typical / average / generic dynasty rankings for a 12 team PPR league relate to your league? And how does that relate to how you build / run your team?

If you're happy or reasonably satisfied with the qb production from your team, then it probably means very little who is QB1 overall. But if you were unlucky with injuries and or have a hole to fill at QB down the stretch, it might matter some - because if you're trying to acquire a Watson or a Prescott or a Wentz - then you should want to know who has the most hyped value, so you can focus on acquiring possibly less expensive options - maybe Carr or Cousins - or bargain shop with a Dalton or a Tyrod Taylor

Anyways in dynasty as always, we are caught between the rock & the hard spot - short term current production vs. long term viability.

Can Watson keep this up for a full season? For a 2nd season? Prescott has been pretty solid (apart from this week) in his sophomore season, so one could argue even if Watson is "hotter" Prescott has been producing "longer".

In the end, I think what matters most is that Watson is

(a) showing that he is going to stick as a QB for at least a few years minimum (remember even worse case scenario RGIII had 3-4 year window)

(b) could be giving you an opportunity to either trade him for something you feel is more suited to you long term or cover holes on your team at another position.

(c) showing that maybe we do not have as much to worry about the QB position long term once Brees/Brady/Big Ben are gone.
Please speak to clarion contrarion before considering the use of vetos..

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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby ninotoreS » Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:49 am

Btw, I think it's also not too early to start considering Carson Wentz in this context. He should get a thread here, too.
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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby ArrylT » Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:53 am

ninotoreS wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:33 am
Just to be clear, folks: I agree it's too early to assert it. I don't think it's too early to begin considering it. Would any current Watson owners do a straight exchange for Carr, Mariota, Cam, Winston, or Wilson right now?

Anyway...

Richard Sherman on Deshaun Watson: "The best game any quarterback has ever played against us, and we’ve played all the legends"

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/rich ... gainst-us/
I think what gets overlooked - maybe because it is expected - is that Seattle still won, and Wilson had a better scoring game than Watson in some scoring formats.

I think this is part of the "expectation". We expect certain production from certain players, so if they maintain that production, well thats expected. But very little expected Watson to be as hot so soon - I am sure there are lots of Watson believers and I am not a doubter myself - but like with Alex Smith - we are getting a lot more production than we anticipated.

Maybe Russell Wilson should be QB1 not Watson. ;)
Please speak to clarion contrarion before considering the use of vetos..

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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby sloth8u » Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:03 am

ninotoreS wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:49 am
Btw, I think it's also not too early to start considering Carson Wentz in this context. He should get a thread here, too.
the problem is....a year or so ago....bortles "shoulda gotta thread". last season...."ryan shoulda gotta thread"...you get the idea. its irrelevant in the dynasty community, because everyone would like to think that they have the answer at qb. the qb 1 is irrelevant, thats why owners wait to draft them.

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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby Goddard » Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:14 am

He's definitely not RG3 or Cam. Those guys were doing it more with their running than their passing. If anything, he's more similar to Wilson where he uses his feet to buy time and make plays downfield, something RG3 or Cam never did. If their first read wasn't open, they'd take off and run. Watson is somewhere in-between those two and Wilson, but has impressed me much more throwing the ball than RG3 or Cam. Definitely not ready to put him as my QB1, but he's making a case for possibly top 5 at the end of the season.

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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby dm1129 » Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:46 am

Defenses have not adjusted to the offense Houston put in place for Watson. There will be adjustments coming, then we will have a much better picture of what the Houston passing game is or isn't.

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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby maxhyde » Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:59 am

dm1129 wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:46 am
Defenses have not adjusted to the offense Houston put in place for Watson. There will be adjustments coming, then we will have a much better picture of what the Houston passing game is or isn't.
Pretty much
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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby maxhyde » Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:59 am

dm1129 wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:46 am
Defenses have not adjusted to the offense Houston put in place for Watson. There will be adjustments coming, then we will have a much better picture of what the Houston passing game is or isn't.
Pretty much
DLF HOF League 16 team PPR
QB: Brees, Bradford, Lock(3.07)
RB: David Johnson, Penny, Sanders(1.07), Montgomery(1.06), Love(2.07) Bernard, MLynch, Morris, TJLogan, Joe Williams, Shaun Wilson
WR: Jeffery,Cooper, Josh Gordon, Dede Westbrook, Cam Meredith, Brice Butler, Chester Rogers, Lockett, Switzer, Malone, Cain (IR)
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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby Slackalacker » Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:13 am

He’s a stud. Not close to the number 1 QB, but in my mind he’s now a startable QB1 in any situation until he puts up a dud.
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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby Dynasty DeLorean » Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:41 am

sloth8u wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 5:03 am
Dare we consider....he's rg3
lol right? It's exhausting reading all these things after just a few games for what seems like literally every player. When it comes to guys like Hunt, Watson, Fuller and whoever else, we understand the regression is coming. Let the regression hit and then we can fairly evaluate these players.

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Re: Dare we consider Deshaun Watson...

Postby Friction » Mon Oct 30, 2017 10:03 am

I agree with the let this play out a little more crowd and regression to the mean for sure. My question in regards top Watson is, how much should being a "gamer' be taken into consideration into football/FF? Everyone knows how Dabo Swinney came and called all the GM's out in regards to DeShaun being a winner/gamer/certain intangibles probably more towards the mental and cerebral aspect of the game. I also know QB is probably the biggest position potentially affected by this. Watson just seemed so inaccurate in college that I was sure it would really catch up to him in the pros, albeit he has thrown some picks and some balls have been caught that might not normally when you heave them up there. I keep telling people that a guy like Baker Mayfield just is a gamer and will find at least a solid job as a backup in the pros (many think he has little to no chance at that). In the same tone, Johnny Alcohol had one of the biggest "IT" factors I had ever seen coming out of college, along with incredible athleticism,but he is a completely different story. Guess its somewhat hard to judge since so many college "winners" come from successful programs.
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