Why not D'Andre Swift?

General talk about Dynasty Leagues.
honcho55
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby honcho55 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:50 pm

Mike11 wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:28 pm
honcho55 wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:59 pm Well, you’ll see it repeated often, and in general terms it’s good advice: talent over situation.

Fact is, situation *does* matter.

Detroit is scoring like 15 points a game. Even if he gets a large part of that pie, even if he elevates the offense, the TDs just aren’t gonna be there. If you wanna bet that that franchise turns a corner, or he gets moved, I’d argue you are doing this wrong.

Really like the talent, have him in a couple spots. Was interchangeable as 1.01 that year for me pre NFL Draft. I dropped him down when he landed in Detroit just like everyone else. Heck of an asset in fantasy and real football, but not in that top tier, and won’t be imo.
Objectively incorrect, he was my RB 3 ahead of Akers and Dobbins because he can catch passes and was extremely versatile. Situation does matter but he's in legitimately the worst situation you can conceivably create and he's a top 5 scoring RB on the year that already has almost 1000 all purpose yards, he has 6 all purpose touchdowns and then on top of it has over 50 receptions on the year too. James Robinson was RB7 on the year last year on a truly awful team, Gibson was between RB11-14 also in a bad situation.

Nail in the coffin, CMC's best scoring year, a historic year where he went 1k receiving and rushing that team was 5-11. Your process is a common one on the forums but talented players produce. However you want to cut it he's producing extremely well on a team with no WRs, a horrid QB and a very injured O-Line. So quiet honestly you should go buy (if you can) because the situation will only get better when this team gets other weapons around Swift.
Definitely see your side, I like the guy a lot and have him in 2/5 leagues.

It’s tough to call a dynasty value ranking comment ‘objectively incorrect’ though, imo. For ROS even, I don’t have swift in that elite tier with cmc, kamara, cook, Taylor. Could argue Henry if/when he’s back, ekeler, Zeke, Chubb Barkley as well. He’s just not in that top of the top tier for me. That’s fine if he is for a someone else, can’t call that objectively incorrect by any stretch.

There’s a comparison at WR this year that I think applies somewhat, too. Are we ready to put Deebo in the elite top of the top tier? By his stats this year and his age, if you put Swift there, you must put Deebo there. Likewise I’ve got Deebo just outside that tier also, nice pleasant surprise as what I thought was my WR3-4 on the one team I have him haha.
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby Mike11 » Tue Nov 23, 2021 6:53 am

honcho55 wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:50 pm
Mike11 wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:28 pm
honcho55 wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:59 pm Well, you’ll see it repeated often, and in general terms it’s good advice: talent over situation.

Fact is, situation *does* matter.

Detroit is scoring like 15 points a game. Even if he gets a large part of that pie, even if he elevates the offense, the TDs just aren’t gonna be there. If you wanna bet that that franchise turns a corner, or he gets moved, I’d argue you are doing this wrong.

Really like the talent, have him in a couple spots. Was interchangeable as 1.01 that year for me pre NFL Draft. I dropped him down when he landed in Detroit just like everyone else. Heck of an asset in fantasy and real football, but not in that top tier, and won’t be imo.
Objectively incorrect, he was my RB 3 ahead of Akers and Dobbins because he can catch passes and was extremely versatile. Situation does matter but he's in legitimately the worst situation you can conceivably create and he's a top 5 scoring RB on the year that already has almost 1000 all purpose yards, he has 6 all purpose touchdowns and then on top of it has over 50 receptions on the year too. James Robinson was RB7 on the year last year on a truly awful team, Gibson was between RB11-14 also in a bad situation.

Nail in the coffin, CMC's best scoring year, a historic year where he went 1k receiving and rushing that team was 5-11. Your process is a common one on the forums but talented players produce. However you want to cut it he's producing extremely well on a team with no WRs, a horrid QB and a very injured O-Line. So quiet honestly you should go buy (if you can) because the situation will only get better when this team gets other weapons around Swift.
Definitely see your side, I like the guy a lot and have him in 2/5 leagues.

It’s tough to call a dynasty value ranking comment ‘objectively incorrect’ though, imo. For ROS even, I don’t have swift in that elite tier with cmc, kamara, cook, Taylor. Could argue Henry if/when he’s back, ekeler, Zeke, Chubb Barkley as well. He’s just not in that top of the top tier for me. That’s fine if he is for a someone else, can’t call that objectively incorrect by any stretch.

There’s a comparison at WR this year that I think applies somewhat, too. Are we ready to put Deebo in the elite top of the top tier? By his stats this year and his age, if you put Swift there, you must put Deebo there. Likewise I’ve got Deebo just outside that tier also, nice pleasant surprise as what I thought was my WR3-4 on the one team I have him haha.
It just feels like Swift is getting dinged for his team but is producing elite numbers regardless of the fact that the team is a dumpster fire, now is it possible other varies affect this, definitely. As it stands right now though if you’re talking yearly I agree, but you brought up New Orleans and ironically they have no receivers and no QB to keep defenses honest so Kamara’s situation is actually very similar to Swifts. CMC has the track record and no ones really touching Taylor’s production so if you have him behind those guys and Cook I get it. In terms of dynasty tiers however I think he deserves to be right behind Taylor when you factor in these other guys being 3+ years older. Everyone’s rankings are different so didn’t mean to come in too hot there but Swift was dropped to some peoples RB5 “cuz lions” and it felt like too quick of a dismissal.

Deebo is an animal, I moved my shares late in his rookie year and it’s crazy how much he’s exploded. The difference for receivers is how many good young ones there are. It makes there a little more competition at the top but it’s hard to argue against Deebo as a top 8-12 dynasty WR.
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby Cameron Giles » Tue Nov 23, 2021 7:39 am

honcho55 wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:59 pm Well, you’ll see it repeated often, and in general terms it’s good advice: talent over situation.

Fact is, situation *does* matter.

Detroit is scoring like 15 points a game. Even if he gets a large part of that pie, even if he elevates the offense, the TDs just aren’t gonna be there. If you wanna bet that that franchise turns a corner, or he gets moved, I’d argue you are doing this wrong.

Really like the talent, have him in a couple spots. Was interchangeable as 1.01 that year for me pre NFL Draft. I dropped him down when he landed in Detroit just like everyone else. Heck of an asset in fantasy and real football, but not in that top tier, and won’t be imo.
In terms of dynasty, how isn't he in the top tier? He's 22 and currently RB5 in PPR. I can't think of many RBs I'd take before him in a startup.

I don't think he's ever going to lead the league in rushing or something, but the fact that he's been this good in an undesirable situation is extremely encouraging for his future.

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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby FantasyFreak » Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:51 pm

I just traded for Swift a few weeks ago. Figures. Out, and will be missing time. Sigh. He's always getting dinged up, unfortunately. Love the talent.
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby nathanq42 » Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:54 pm

FantasyFreak wrote: Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:51 pm I just traded for Swift a few weeks ago. Figures. Out, and will be missing time. Sigh. He's always getting dinged up, unfortunately. Love the talent.
I dont think there has been a week this year he hasn't had some reported ailment. Thanks for ruining my shot at winning... Swift was a pretty integral part of my run
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby SoftwoodGrampian » Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:58 pm

Seacrest. Swift. Out

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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby Pac_Eddy » Thu Nov 25, 2021 1:04 pm

Jamaal Williams is more valuable than the average backup for this reason. Similar in value to Darrell Williams.
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby Anteaters » Fri Nov 26, 2021 3:23 am

Pac_Eddy wrote: Thu Nov 25, 2021 1:04 pm Jamaal Williams is more valuable than the average backup for this reason. Similar in value to Darrell Williams.
++
I'm much more excited about Jamaal than I every was about Swift!

Of course, that's probably because I have Jamaal on two teams and Swift on none. On one team in particular, Jamaal might turn a playoff team into the team to beat in that league. :mrgreen:
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby Pullo Vision » Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:04 pm

Just heard a bit that Dan Campbell took over playcalling duties from Anthony Lynn drying the week 9 bye. Best I couldn't find was Campbell became more "involved" in game planning and game day playcalls.

You can see the change in the boxscores-
33/130/0 rushing, 6/3/5/0 receiving
14/136/1 rushing, 4/3/0/0 receiving

That's 10 targets, 6 catches 5 total yards over two games, against his only two 100+ yard rushing games this year. Now, he has a sprained shoulder, so we'll see if the trend continues.
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby nathanq42 » Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:34 pm

Pullo Vision wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:04 pm Just heard a bit that Dan Campbell took over playcalling duties from Anthony Lynn drying the week 9 bye. Best I couldn't find was Campbell became more "involved" in game planning and game day playcalls.

You can see the change in the boxscores-
33/130/0 rushing, 6/3/5/0 receiving
14/136/1 rushing, 4/3/0/0 receiving

That's 10 targets, 6 catches 5 total yards over two games, against his only two 100+ yard rushing games this year. Now, he has a sprained shoulder, so we'll see if the trend continues.
I was not a fan of his usage being predominantly on the ground for this exact reason. The man needs catches in space
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WR CeeDee Lamb, Justin Jefferson, DJ Moore, Hollywood Brown, Brandin Cooks, Odell Beckham Junior, Marvin Jones, Braxton Berrios, Richie James
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby Pac_Eddy » Fri Nov 26, 2021 2:08 pm

nathanq42 wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:34 pm
Pullo Vision wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:04 pm Just heard a bit that Dan Campbell took over playcalling duties from Anthony Lynn drying the week 9 bye. Best I couldn't find was Campbell became more "involved" in game planning and game day playcalls.

You can see the change in the boxscores-
33/130/0 rushing, 6/3/5/0 receiving
14/136/1 rushing, 4/3/0/0 receiving

That's 10 targets, 6 catches 5 total yards over two games, against his only two 100+ yard rushing games this year. Now, he has a sprained shoulder, so we'll see if the trend continues.
I was not a fan of his usage being predominantly on the ground for this exact reason. The man needs catches in space
Truth. Coaches should be using star players to maximize their strengths.
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby Pullo Vision » Fri Nov 26, 2021 6:06 pm

Pac_Eddy wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 2:08 pm
nathanq42 wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:34 pm
Pullo Vision wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:04 pm Just heard a bit that Dan Campbell took over playcalling duties from Anthony Lynn drying the week 9 bye. Best I couldn't find was Campbell became more "involved" in game planning and game day playcalls.

You can see the change in the boxscores-
33/130/0 rushing, 6/3/5/0 receiving
14/136/1 rushing, 4/3/0/0 receiving

That's 10 targets, 6 catches 5 total yards over two games, against his only two 100+ yard rushing games this year. Now, he has a sprained shoulder, so we'll see if the trend continues.
I was not a fan of his usage being predominantly on the ground for this exact reason. The man needs catches in space
Truth. Coaches should be using star players to maximize their strengths.
One of the "situation+talent" arguments I heard in the offseason was that, not only was Swift a very talented back in his own right, but Lynn could unlock him. He has a history of leaning on a lead back, as well as giving him a healthy number of targets.

Read an article from a few weeks ago speculating if Lynn should be let go. If Campbell is really driving these recent offensive changes, this is reason for concern.
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby DJB » Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:29 pm

Remember when people passed on this guy for CEH due to landing spot?

Good times by those fools.
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby Pac_Eddy » Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:49 pm

DJB wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:29 pm Remember when people passed on this guy for CEH due to landing spot?

Good times by those fools.
I'm one of those fools. It's closer now, but I think I'd still take CEH.
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Re: Why not D'Andre Swift?

Postby SoftwoodGrampian » Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:52 pm

Pac_Eddy wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:49 pm
DJB wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:29 pm Remember when people passed on this guy for CEH due to landing spot?

Good times by those fools.
I'm one of those fools. It's closer now, but I think I'd still take CEH.
So... So you're still calling yourself a fool?


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