Baker mayfield

[Valhalla]

I’d decline that without thought, but I admittedly am quite low on Miller and higher than consensus on Mayfield.

[WhatWouldDitkaDo]

I'm thinking of making a move for Baker as his value is pretty low. Is offering Anthony Miller straight up a fair deal? 1 QB, 0.5 ppr.

Seems fair in 1QB. I'd value both players around a mid 2nd.

[Pac_Eddy]

Thanks for the trade value opinions. Should've put this into the team advice.

[Pullo Vision]

New OC Alex Van Pelt having Mayfield change his footwork. Always get nervous about changes in mechanics like this. Thoughts?

Feb 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... plays.html
https://www.nfl.com/news/browns-oc-van- ... 0001102421

May 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... etter.html

[FantasyFreak]

New OC Alex Van Pelt having Mayfield change his footwork. Always get nervous about changes in mechanics like this. Thoughts?

Feb 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... plays.html
https://www.nfl.com/news/browns-oc-van- ... 0001102421

May 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... etter.html

Trying to change footwork in year 3 isn't a good sign IMO. Who knows, though.

[ericanadian]

New OC Alex Van Pelt having Mayfield change his footwork. Always get nervous about changes in mechanics like this. Thoughts?

Feb 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... plays.html
https://www.nfl.com/news/browns-oc-van- ... 0001102421

May 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... etter.html

Trying to change footwork in year 3 isn't a good sign IMO. Who knows, though.

Could be necessary though. He’s been too busy working on learning new offenses to work on fundamentals.

[Bronco Billy]

New OC Alex Van Pelt having Mayfield change his footwork. Always get nervous about changes in mechanics like this. Thoughts?

Feb 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... plays.html
https://www.nfl.com/news/browns-oc-van- ... 0001102421

May 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... etter.html

Switching from strong foot up in shotgun to weak foot up in shotgun? That’s hardly an overhaul of his mechanics. It’s just a minor muscle memory item that will make him more efficient.

I’m foreseeing a huge rebound for him and a return to form that made him a record setting QB his rookie year. Getting some O-line upgrades is going to make a big difference.

[FantasyFreak]

New OC Alex Van Pelt having Mayfield change his footwork. Always get nervous about changes in mechanics like this. Thoughts?

Feb 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... plays.html
https://www.nfl.com/news/browns-oc-van- ... 0001102421

May 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... etter.html

Switching from strong foot up in shotgun to weak foot up in shotgun? That’s hardly an overhaul of his mechanics. It’s just a minor muscle memory item that will make him more efficient.

I’m foreseeing a huge rebound for him and a return to form that made him a record setting QB his rookie year. Getting some O-line upgrades is going to make a big difference.

I'd say somewhere in between. I don't think he's that talented a player, unless everything is right for him. The second things break down, he's simply not good. However, whith this system, it's based on putting him in positions that are workable, lot's of PA, early down screens, roll outs that help a guy with minimal athleticism in the pocket, and lack of height as well. I don't think Baker is an elite QB, but last year was also not what I think he is, either.

[jenkins.math]

New OC Alex Van Pelt having Mayfield change his footwork. Always get nervous about changes in mechanics like this. Thoughts?

Feb 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... plays.html
https://www.nfl.com/news/browns-oc-van- ... 0001102421

May 2020-
https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/0 ... etter.html

Switching from strong foot up in shotgun to weak foot up in shotgun? That’s hardly an overhaul of his mechanics. It’s just a minor muscle memory item that will make him more efficient.

I’m foreseeing a huge rebound for him and a return to form that made him a record setting QB his rookie year. Getting some O-line upgrades is going to make a big difference.

I'd say somewhere in between. I don't think he's that talented a player, unless everything is right for him. The second things break down, he's simply not good. However, whith this system, it's based on putting him in positions that are workable, lot's of PA, early down screens, roll outs that help a guy with minimal athleticism in the pocket, and lack of height as well. I don't think Baker is an elite QB, but last year was also not what I think he is, either.

Aren't the majority of players products of their system to some extent? There are very few guys that you can just roll the ball out and say "go win". Aaron Rodgers of old and Russ Wilson are the only 2 QBs I can think of that really fit the "make chicken salad out of chicken ...." on the regular and perform at a high level over the last decade or so. As awesome as Mahomes is, it is very hard for me not to believe Andy Reid is a very large part in Mahomes success.

As it pertains to Baker; I had Baker as a sell high this time last year but I think he might be a buy low now. Assuming the line play improves (and it should) he has all the weapons at his disposal to be in the mix as a low end QB1.

[DLF3000]

I had Baker as a sell high this time last year but I think he might be a buy low now. Assuming the line play improves (and it should) he has all the weapons at his disposal to be in the mix as a low end QB1.

Spot on. Wish I had traded Mayfield early last summer when the hype was out of control, because once he started to suck I couldn't even move him for a 2nd.

Now I'm content to just keep him because, like you, I see a real level of bounce-back.

I don't really need him, but not selling super low right now either.

[FantasyFreak]

Switching from strong foot up in shotgun to weak foot up in shotgun? That’s hardly an overhaul of his mechanics. It’s just a minor muscle memory item that will make him more efficient.

I’m foreseeing a huge rebound for him and a return to form that made him a record setting QB his rookie year. Getting some O-line upgrades is going to make a big difference.

I'd say somewhere in between. I don't think he's that talented a player, unless everything is right for him. The second things break down, he's simply not good. However, whith this system, it's based on putting him in positions that are workable, lot's of PA, early down screens, roll outs that help a guy with minimal athleticism in the pocket, and lack of height as well. I don't think Baker is an elite QB, but last year was also not what I think he is, either.

Aren't the majority of players products of their system to some extent? There are very few guys that you can just roll the ball out and say "go win". Aaron Rodgers of old and Russ Wilson are the only 2 QBs I can think of that really fit the "make chicken salad out of chicken ...." on the regular and perform at a high level over the last decade or so. As awesome as Mahomes is, it is very hard for me not to believe Andy Reid is a very large part in Mahomes success.

As it pertains to Baker; I had Baker as a sell high this time last year but I think he might be a buy low now. Assuming the line play improves (and it should) he has all the weapons at his disposal to be in the mix as a low end QB1.

Of course. Some systems can fit a players strengths and weaknesses better than others, though. Some players have fewer strengths and more weaknesses than others, too.

[Sriracha]

Baker wasn't a 1st round prospect until his final season.

Is this sarcasm?

[StripesOfKC]

Baker wasn't a 1st round prospect until his final season.

Is this sarcasm?

No that part is true for the most part. I don’t remember Baker getting first round talk until he beat Ohio State

[Sriracha]

Baker wasn't a 1st round prospect until his final season.

Is this sarcasm?

No that part is true for the most part. I don’t remember Baker getting first round talk until he beat Ohio State

Media hype != prospect evaluation.

Mayfield set the all time NCAAF QBR his junior year, then broke that record again his senior season; while doing this primarily on the strength of his passing -- which translates better to the NFL. Granted, this record was broken 3 times in the next 2 years with Burrow, Tua, and Kyler.. but the idea that Baker is a one year wonder is absurd.

He was primarily being knocked because of his height, not his play.

[StripesOfKC]

Is this sarcasm?

No that part is true for the most part. I don’t remember Baker getting first round talk until he beat Ohio State

Media hype != prospect evaluation.

Mayfield set the all time NCAAF QBR his junior year, then broke that record again his senior season; while doing this primarily on the strength of his passing -- which translates better to the NFL. Granted, this record was broken 3 times in the next 2 years with Burrow, Tua, and Kyler.. but the idea that Baker is a one year wonder is absurd.

He was primarily being knocked because of his height, not his play.

Oh I watch a lot of Big 12 football and absolutely agree that he wasn’t a one year wonder

He was a fantastic player his first year at OU and well above my expectations from what I saw at Tech—even better his second year.

BUT in both those two years remember that he faced legit super talented defenses with future NFL stars 3 times:

At Tennessee in Knoxville in 2015–a game in which he struggled mightily and put up a donut by halftime before Butch Jones choked it away and OU escaped with a win

Vs Clemson in the semifinal that same year—where he was fazed and eventually shut down in the second half

At home against Ohio State in 2016—another subpar performance and embarassing loss

It might not have been fair considering how excellent he was in all the other games; but for a short air raid QB in a conference stigmatized for its lack of defense, it was a black mark.

That is: until the Ohio State game and dominating a recent national champ with NFL talent on defense in their house, and later that same year slicing apart the Georgia defense in the semifinals

He was definitely not a one season wonder and known as a Heisman candidate and incredible college player after his first year at OU, even more so after his second, but his stock as an NFL prospect? I don’t think it really took flight until his senior season.

Before that all the hype was around Sam Darnold and to a slightly lesser extent Josh Rosen with some hipsters giving steam to Josh Allen

I know it’s fun to rib at Kiper, McShay and the drafting media, but they do have genuine connections in scouting circles—maybe not as much as they suggest but they do exist, so I don’t think you can just discard the spike in his projections that happened over that 2017 season