OJ Howard Panic?

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joeya2001
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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby joeya2001 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:30 am

I traded him away in the off season for Amari Cooper, cashed in on the hype!
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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby qazxswedcvfrtgbnhyuj » Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:33 am

joeya2001 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:30 am
I traded him away in the off season for Amari Cooper, cashed in on the hype!
Unless that is a 2 ppr premium TE league or something similar that seems completely ridiculous to me, hype or no. I've never heard of him being valued even close to that.
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16 owner 1 PPR, Start QB, 2RB, 3WR, Flex, D
QB: Mahomes, Allen, RG3, Winston, Kessler, Mullens
RB: Hilliard, Ty Johnson
WR: Anderson, Washington, Hardman, Thomas, Jones, TJ Jones, Rogers
TE: Herndon, Knox, Oliver, Smith, Thomas
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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby sloth8u » Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:29 am

moishetreats wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:17 am
For the moment, I'm willing to chalk it up to Arians wanting to protect Winston more after Week 1 and help get the running game going. Howard is a fantastic athlete and pass-catcher, but he's also a fantastic run and pass blocker. Indeed, if we think back to his initial draft, he was so high on boards because his blocking insured that he wouldn't come off the field. That's an asset, one that Arians has been using.

That being said, there is cause for concern that this is more of a trend with Arians than a blip. We'll have to wait over the next few weeks to see if Arians tries to use Howard's receiving skill set or leaves that for Brate, a far less reliable blocker.
I own howard on a few teama via draft (not overly invested). Im pretty much on the same page. I expect him to be a td guy tbh.

We know arians wants to air it out.... I expect to see some usage inside the 30.

0 targets is concerning....but no reason to part ways here.

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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby BigBawseRoss » Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:50 am

bjd5211 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:31 pm
Jigga94 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:27 pm
Gotta hold... But I think that 4-6 tier (Engram and Henry includes) is just drifting further away from the top 3... I wouldn't blame someone for ranking Hock 4th in dynasty
I always had OJ at the bottom of the group of 4 (Henry, Njoku, Engram, OJ) behind the big 3, but ya I have Hockenson at least 4th now for sure. Hockenson might be my TE1 in dynasty by next year.
omg hock is just the best!!!!! love everything he does each and every week!!!
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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby Jigga94 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:54 am

BigBawseRoss wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:50 am
bjd5211 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:31 pm
Jigga94 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:27 pm
Gotta hold... But I think that 4-6 tier (Engram and Henry includes) is just drifting further away from the top 3... I wouldn't blame someone for ranking Hock 4th in dynasty
I always had OJ at the bottom of the group of 4 (Henry, Njoku, Engram, OJ) behind the big 3, but ya I have Hockenson at least 4th now for sure. Hockenson might be my TE1 in dynasty by next year.
omg hock is just the best!!!!! love everything he does each and every week!!!
Some solid input right there
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RB: Sony, D. Freeman, Penny, Ito, Edmonds, McKissic
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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby GridironGuerilla » Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:33 am

Jigga94 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:54 am
BigBawseRoss wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:50 am
bjd5211 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:31 pm


I always had OJ at the bottom of the group of 4 (Henry, Njoku, Engram, OJ) behind the big 3, but ya I have Hockenson at least 4th now for sure. Hockenson might be my TE1 in dynasty by next year.
omg hock is just the best!!!!! love everything he does each and every week!!!
Some solid input right there
I believe it was Sarcasm.
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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby Bot101 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:43 am

Im not concerned with the week 2 output. The Panthers have one of the best defensive lines in the league, and the Bucs Oline is a group of traffic cones. Arians needed Howard to block and it reminds me very similarly to 2 years ago when Hunter Henry goose egged everyone week 1 because he had the exact same scenario.

Week 1 Howard and Brate ran a similar number of routes per drop back. Week 2 Howard ran way more than Brate. Also from some clips on twitter that I've seen, Howard was running the same type of downfield routes hes always ran and was wide open multiple times. Winston just never looked his way at all. This is a golden opportunity to buy low for anyone who believes in the talent.

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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby Johnny Canuck » Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:44 am

This is directed at the overall thread theme thus far

Let's pump the brakes on a couple fronts here shall we...

1. Hock has played one game, one...against a bottom 5 NFL defense. Two of his big plays came on busted coverages, where he had nothing but space, without doing anything to really create it. He's a great prospect but before we anoint him TE4 status, maybe we should wait for, you know, maybe two games, or even three...OR be willing to put Mark Andrews in Hock's tier...let's just wait a few more games...

2. Why is Engram dropping tiers? or even dropping at all? Engram looked like a stud out there in week 1, and I'm not sure why he would drop tiers at all.

3. It's two games for OJH. He's got a bad situation, so fine drop him rankings a bit to reflect his redraft/2019 value, but not that much because we're playing dynasty obviously. He's the TE version of Corey Davis...so if you've ever used the talent vs situation argument...this is the same. He's a great blocker, and the Buc's have a trash o-line...just the way it goes some games.
Last edited by Johnny Canuck on Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby GridironGuerilla » Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:47 am

Johnny Canuck wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:44 am
This is directed at the overall thread theme thus far

Let's pump the brakes on a couple fronts here shall we...

1. Hock has played one game, one...against a bottom 5 NFL defense. Two of his big plays came on busted coverages, where he had nothing but space, without doing anything to really create it. He's a great prospect but before we anoint him TE4 status, maybe we should wait for, you know, maybe two games, or even three...

2. Why is Engram dropping tiers? or even dropping at all? Engram looked like a stud out there in week 1, and I'm not sure why he would drop tiers at all.

3. It's two games for OJH. He's got a bad situation, so fine drop him rankings a bit to reflect his redraft/2019 value, but not that much because we're playing dynasty obviously. He's the TE version of Corey Davis...so if you've ever used the talent vs situation argument...this is the same. He's a great blocker, and the Buc's have a trash o-line...just the way it goes some games.
This is spot on IMO.
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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby bjd5211 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:06 am

Sure if Hockenson was some mid round pick who came in and had a great game it would be too early to give it much thought or bump him up. He's not though, he was a top 10 pick touted as one of the best TE prospects to ever enter the league, and he's done nothing to show that wasn't warranted. I was also told I was crazy and being premature last year saying I would take Barkley before he ever played a game last year over guys like David Johnson and Leveon Bell, hell I was willing to take him 1.01 in startups if I had done any last year. I value guys on what I expect them to do going forward, not what they have done. I already had Hockenson as the #8 TE in Dynasty from the moment he entered the league, so to jump him up to 4 after what he and the others that were ahead of him have done is not a big reach in my opinion. Hockenson is a special player and now is the time to acquire him, his value os only going to go up going forward.

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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby grandmabetty » Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:30 am

bjd5211 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:06 am
Sure if Hockenson was some mid round pick who came in and had a great game it would be too early to give it much thought or bump him up. He's not though, he was a top 10 pick touted as one of the best TE prospects to ever enter the league, and he's done nothing to show that wasn't warranted. I was also told I was crazy and being premature last year saying I would take Barkley before he ever played a game last year over guys like David Johnson and Leveon Bell, hell I was willing to take him 1.01 in startups if I had done any last year. I value guys on what I expect them to do going forward, not what they have done. I already had Hockenson as the #8 TE in Dynasty from the moment he entered the league, so to jump him up to 4 after what he and the others that were ahead of him have done is not a big reach in my opinion. Hockenson is a special player and now is the time to acquire him, his value os only going to go up going forward.
To some extent yes i agree with you that you should trust your own evaluation and determine what your expectations for a player are going to be but cmon man we are talking about a rookie. You had high expectations for a rookie???? You don't say. NOBODY on this message board or in draft rooms/locker rooms, has ever had high expectations for a rookie only to watch them wash out of the league after accomplishing nothing. I can think of about a trillion rookie players i had high expectations for and maybe 5% of them ever amounted to more than a flex option. My point is to say you base your evaluations of a rookie solely on what your expectations of them are is about the most flawed way i can imagine building a team.
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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby bjd5211 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:00 am

Every single great player in this league was an unknown and unproven rookie at one point. I'm not counting on rookies, I'm betting on their careers as a whole and Hockenson is about as good a bet as there as ever been at his position. Sure I get burned occasionally, but the hits outweigh the misses and there are always new bets coming into the league every year. My ranking of Hockenson doesn't mean I expect him to finish as the #4 TE in scoring this year or potentially #1 next year, it means that's where I rank him in value in Dynasty. Acquiring players BEFORE everyone else is ready to rank them as top players at their position results in a great deal of savings, opposed to trying to draft or trade for them when they are eatablished as top options.

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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby Space Cowboy » Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:45 am

moishetreats wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:17 am
For the moment, I'm willing to chalk it up to Arians wanting to protect Winston more after Week 1 and help get the running game going. Howard is a fantastic athlete and pass-catcher, but he's also a fantastic run and pass blocker. Indeed, if we think back to his initial draft, he was so high on boards because his blocking insured that he wouldn't come off the field. That's an asset, one that Arians has been using.

That being said, there is cause for concern that this is more of a trend with Arians than a blip. We'll have to wait over the next few weeks to see if Arians tries to use Howard's receiving skill set or leaves that for Brate, a far less reliable blocker.
Yes, this. It was one game. Sheesh.

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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby Space Cowboy » Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:50 am

Wasn’t arians the OC in Pittsburgh when they featured heath miller for years?

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Re: OJ Howard Panic?

Postby ericanadian » Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:18 pm

Space Cowboy wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:50 am
Wasn’t arians the OC in Pittsburgh when they featured heath miller for years?
Heath Miller did alright, but not sure he was ever “featured”. His best season in terms of production was after Arians departed.
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