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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby Lumps » Sat May 04, 2019 4:54 pm

Phaded wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 3:39 pm


The fact is that Campbell is exceedingly raw, not a good route runner and his YPR is shockingly low for such a "speedster".
Discussions of comparisons aside....

This is ignoring how he was used at Ohio. You can't complain about Edelman's yards per catch, when he's used to get 1st downs for that offense.

Campbell, as has been pointed out by PFF, was NOT targeted downfield despite his "speedster" status. He is indeed blazing fast, but they used McLauren in that role. I think Campbell only had a handful of downfield targets. He was basically used on crosses and hitches - yards per catch is irrelevant in this discussion.
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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby MrUbuto » Sat May 04, 2019 5:29 pm

dlf_mikeh wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 9:28 am
Yes.

He wasn't even on anyones radar as a top 12 prospect prior to the NFL draft. I think that's part of the problem. If he was mocked earlier I think he'd be in consideration as a top 3 dynasty asset.
I don't really think that's true. Do you mean a top 12 rookie pick or simply top 12 wr. Either way I dont think it's true.

I saw him as a top 3 or 4 wr pick in a lot of mocks
QB - DWatson(HOU)Winston(TB)Finely(DEN)
RB - TGurley(LAR)DJohnson(ARI)NChubb(CLE)DHenry(TEN)
WR - ODB(NYG)AJ Green(CIN)ACooper (DAL)CDavis(TEN)
TE - HHenry(SD)DGoeddart(PHI)
K - Zurlien(LAR)Badgley(LAC)
Def - JAGS DET
[rookie] NHarry(NE)MBrown(BAL)Haskins(WAS)

1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2 - 2020's
Rosters must always be 3qbs 4wrs 4rbs 2tes 2kickers 2dst and protected players dont take up a roster spot, but are only for rookie/2nd year players that were drafted

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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby MrUbuto » Sat May 04, 2019 5:29 pm

dlf_mikeh wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 9:28 am
Yes.

He wasn't even on anyones radar as a top 12 prospect prior to the NFL draft. I think that's part of the problem. If he was mocked earlier I think he'd be in consideration as a top 3 dynasty asset.
I don't really think that's true. Do you mean a top 12 rookie pick or simply top 12 wr. Either way I dont think it's true.

I saw him as a top 3 or 4 wr pick in a lot of mocks
QB - DWatson(HOU)Winston(TB)Finely(DEN)
RB - TGurley(LAR)DJohnson(ARI)NChubb(CLE)DHenry(TEN)
WR - ODB(NYG)AJ Green(CIN)ACooper (DAL)CDavis(TEN)
TE - HHenry(SD)DGoeddart(PHI)
K - Zurlien(LAR)Badgley(LAC)
Def - JAGS DET
[rookie] NHarry(NE)MBrown(BAL)Haskins(WAS)

1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2 - 2020's
Rosters must always be 3qbs 4wrs 4rbs 2tes 2kickers 2dst and protected players dont take up a roster spot, but are only for rookie/2nd year players that were drafted

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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby Forza_Azzurri » Sat May 04, 2019 6:45 pm

I liked Campbell & Metcalf as the top two WRs this year ... when I was forced to decide, I chose Metcalf & am already kicking myself. I’ve heard so many former NFL personnel guys (Bill Pollian & Pat Kirwan are the two that come to mind) that I respect say he is the best WR in this class.

The metric that is thrown around all the time is that only two of his catches last year were on balls that traveled 20 yards down field ... but his problem was that he was not used properly at OSU; just like Michael Thomas.

16 Team PPR | QB (1) RB (2-4) WR (2-5) TE (1-2) K (1) | DT (1-2) DE (2-4) LB (2-5) CB (3-6) S (2-5)

|QB| J. Allen, D. Carr, D. Lock, E. Stick (taxi)
|RB| A. Kamara, J. Jacobs, J. Mixon, L. Murray, R. Anderson (IR)
|WR| C. Godwin, D.J. Moore, D.K. Metcalf, M. Gallup, , J. Ross, Da. Moore
|TE| J. Hollister, M. Gesicki, K. Rudolph, T. Eifert, I. Thomas, M. LaCosse, R. Gronkowski
|K| B. Maher
|DT| S. Richardson, Q. Williams, T. Bryan, T. Hill (taxi)
|DE| J. Clowney, Y. Ngakoue, J. Pierre-Paul, D. Barnett, T. Charlton, E. Ansah, A. Key (IR), J. Sweat (taxi)
|LB| L. Vander Esch, D. Trevathan, C. Holcomb, N. Gerry, M. Kendricks, S. Dion Hamilton, S. Ebukam, T.J. Edwards, M. Jefferson, V. Joseph (IR), R. Foster (IR), K. Beckwith (IR), D. Cole (IR), S. Eguavoen (taxi)
|CB| S. Gilmore, M. Peters, D. Trufant, G. Conley, B. Jones, G. Haley
|S| M. Fitzpatrick, T. Walker, X. Woods, E. Thomas, E. Murray
|2020 PICKS| #1.03, 1.07, 2.05, 3.02 & 6.15
|2021 PICKS| #1, #2, #3

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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby Cameron Giles » Sat May 04, 2019 7:01 pm

Forza_Azzurri wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 6:45 pm
I liked Campbell & Metcalf as the top two WRs this year ... when I was forced to decide, I chose Metcalf & am already kicking myself. I’ve heard so many former NFL personnel guys (Bill Pollian & Pat Kirwan are the two that come to mind) that I respect say he is the best WR in this class.

The metric that is thrown around all the time is that only two of his catches last year were on balls that traveled 20 yards down field ... but his problem was that he was not used properly at OSU; just like Michael Thomas.
I disagree with this. Michael Thomas problem wasn't that he was used improperly; it was that he didn't have enough volume. The way they used him was good. He ran a variety of routes. We just wanted to see it more.

Campbell wasn't used improperly. They played to his strengths near the LOS and prevented him from having to run a variety of routes which he's raw in.

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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby Dynasty DeLorean » Sat May 04, 2019 7:01 pm

Forza_Azzurri wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 6:45 pm
I liked Campbell & Metcalf as the top two WRs this year ... when I was forced to decide, I chose Metcalf & am already kicking myself. I’ve heard so many former NFL personnel guys (Bill Pollian & Pat Kirwan are the two that come to mind) that I respect say he is the best WR in this class.

The metric that is thrown around all the time is that only two of his catches last year were on balls that traveled 20 yards down field ... but his problem was that he was not used properly at OSU; just like Michael Thomas.
MT actually had a very high college dominator and average YPR. Campbell both on the low end. Not saying its the be all end all but on paper not really the same.

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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby Cult of Dionysus » Sat May 04, 2019 7:02 pm

If anyone else would have gone to Indy in the 2nd round of the 2019 NFL Draft in Nashville Tennessee, he would likely be a top 3 rookie pick.

Hollywood, yes.
AJ Brown, yes.
DK3©one, yes.
Dweebo, yes.
Nkeal Harry, for sure.

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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby Forza_Azzurri » Sat May 04, 2019 7:20 pm

Cameron Giles wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 7:01 pm
Forza_Azzurri wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 6:45 pm
I liked Campbell & Metcalf as the top two WRs this year ... when I was forced to decide, I chose Metcalf & am already kicking myself. I’ve heard so many former NFL personnel guys (Bill Pollian & Pat Kirwan are the two that come to mind) that I respect say he is the best WR in this class.

The metric that is thrown around all the time is that only two of his catches last year were on balls that traveled 20 yards down field ... but his problem was that he was not used properly at OSU; just like Michael Thomas.
I disagree with this. Michael Thomas problem wasn't that he was used improperly; it was that he didn't have enough volume. The way they used him was good. He ran a variety of routes. We just wanted to see it more.

Campbell wasn't used improperly. They played to his strengths near the LOS and prevented him from having to run a variety of routes which he's raw in.
If Michael Thomas didn’t receive enough targets, doesn’t that mean he wasn’t used properly? :think:

16 Team PPR | QB (1) RB (2-4) WR (2-5) TE (1-2) K (1) | DT (1-2) DE (2-4) LB (2-5) CB (3-6) S (2-5)

|QB| J. Allen, D. Carr, D. Lock, E. Stick (taxi)
|RB| A. Kamara, J. Jacobs, J. Mixon, L. Murray, R. Anderson (IR)
|WR| C. Godwin, D.J. Moore, D.K. Metcalf, M. Gallup, , J. Ross, Da. Moore
|TE| J. Hollister, M. Gesicki, K. Rudolph, T. Eifert, I. Thomas, M. LaCosse, R. Gronkowski
|K| B. Maher
|DT| S. Richardson, Q. Williams, T. Bryan, T. Hill (taxi)
|DE| J. Clowney, Y. Ngakoue, J. Pierre-Paul, D. Barnett, T. Charlton, E. Ansah, A. Key (IR), J. Sweat (taxi)
|LB| L. Vander Esch, D. Trevathan, C. Holcomb, N. Gerry, M. Kendricks, S. Dion Hamilton, S. Ebukam, T.J. Edwards, M. Jefferson, V. Joseph (IR), R. Foster (IR), K. Beckwith (IR), D. Cole (IR), S. Eguavoen (taxi)
|CB| S. Gilmore, M. Peters, D. Trufant, G. Conley, B. Jones, G. Haley
|S| M. Fitzpatrick, T. Walker, X. Woods, E. Thomas, E. Murray
|2020 PICKS| #1.03, 1.07, 2.05, 3.02 & 6.15
|2021 PICKS| #1, #2, #3

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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby Cameron Giles » Sat May 04, 2019 8:18 pm

Forza_Azzurri wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 7:20 pm
Cameron Giles wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 7:01 pm
Forza_Azzurri wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 6:45 pm
I liked Campbell & Metcalf as the top two WRs this year ... when I was forced to decide, I chose Metcalf & am already kicking myself. I’ve heard so many former NFL personnel guys (Bill Pollian & Pat Kirwan are the two that come to mind) that I respect say he is the best WR in this class.

The metric that is thrown around all the time is that only two of his catches last year were on balls that traveled 20 yards down field ... but his problem was that he was not used properly at OSU; just like Michael Thomas.
I disagree with this. Michael Thomas problem wasn't that he was used improperly; it was that he didn't have enough volume. The way they used him was good. He ran a variety of routes. We just wanted to see it more.

Campbell wasn't used improperly. They played to his strengths near the LOS and prevented him from having to run a variety of routes which he's raw in.
If Michael Thomas didn’t receive enough targets, doesn’t that mean he wasn’t used properly? :think:
Not really.

To me, I don't see anything that suggests Campbell wasn't used properly. They manufactured touches for him to hide his weaknesses.

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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby Phaded » Sat May 04, 2019 9:02 pm

Lumps wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 4:54 pm
Phaded wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 3:39 pm


The fact is that Campbell is exceedingly raw, not a good route runner and his YPR is shockingly low for such a "speedster".
Discussions of comparisons aside....

This is ignoring how he was used at Ohio. You can't complain about Edelman's yards per catch, when he's used to get 1st downs for that offense.

Campbell, as has been pointed out by PFF, was NOT targeted downfield despite his "speedster" status. He is indeed blazing fast, but they used McLauren in that role. I think Campbell only had a handful of downfield targets. He was basically used on crosses and hitches - yards per catch is irrelevant in this discussion.
And he was used like that because of a massive deficiency in his talents. In other words, he cannot run routes. The fact that he is capable of that athletically but was not used downfield is a massive red flag in itself.

Campbell is a fine athlete, but is extremely raw and is a high-risk pick.

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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby ninotoreS » Sat May 04, 2019 10:34 pm

Immediately after the real draft, I saw Campbell going mid-1st in rookie-drafts, so no, I don't think people are sleeping.
Phaded wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 9:02 pm
And he was used like that because of a massive deficiency in his talents. In other words, he cannot run routes. The fact that he is capable of that athletically but was not used downfield is a massive red flag in itself.

Campbell is a fine athlete, but is extremely raw and is a high-risk pick.
But aren't you high on Deebo? Much of this works as a critique of his prospect reality, too. Deebo and Parris have a lot in common as prospects.
And he was used like that [at Ohio State] because of a massive deficiency in his talents. In other words, he cannot run routes.
And be real careful of this assumption, btw -- don't make the mistake I made about Michael Thomas. To some extent, Urban Meyer's offense artificially restricted WRs' usage. It was true at Florida, too. Campbell has undeveloped elements to his craft because Meyer didn't care about developing them. That doesn't prove he can't, though.
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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby Pete Carroll's Gum » Sat May 04, 2019 11:17 pm

I got drunk at my rookie draft (ugh). Traded tevin Coleman and 2020 1st (late) for 2.02, took Parris Campbell. Now that I’ve had time to think about it, not pleased haha.
12 Team, 2 QB Dynasty League, 1 Point PPR
2QB, 2WR, 2RB, 1TE, 2 Flex

QB: Jackson, Goff, Trubisky, Keenum, Kyle Allen, Mullens, Taylor, Finley
RB: Gordon, Mack, Drake, Burkhead, Duke Johnson, Mattison, D. Williams, Armstead, Ajayi
WR: Jones, Cooper, Cooks, Campbell, Gage, Patrick, Watson, Cain
TE: Engram, Waller
K: Zuerlein
D: Minnesota, SF

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2021: 1, 2, 3, 4

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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby joeya2001 » Sat May 04, 2019 11:54 pm

so Deon Cain not a thing anymore?
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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby ninotoreS » Sun May 05, 2019 12:11 am

He's a thing, but from draft capital spent it's apparent Indy has greater expectations for Campbell.
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Re: Are we too low on Parris Campbell?

Postby Goirish374 » Sun May 05, 2019 4:22 am

Nope.

We are too high.

Campbell and Isabella are both being "May-bumped" above their station. There are legitimate concerns about Campbell's ability to play WR and those are not addressed by his landing spot.
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