Roster cloggers and back end roster depth

[The Grudge]

Roster cloggers. I hate them. But I cant seem to find a way to get rid of them. There they are, sitting on my bench mocking me. Some players I don't want to cut as think they might blow up, and never do. Or they have the talent, just cannot stay healthy. I sometimes hold onto players so other teams cannot get them then realize probably after its too late that the joke was on me. I was the silly one burning a roster spot on them. Just curious as to how people look at them on their own teams, and how you deal with your bench depth? Are you ruthless, and just cut if they don't perform right away? And if the player blows up after you dropped them you just brush it off and continue on? Do you give the cloggers a year and then move on? What do you believe is a roster clogger? I try to build my teams with my starters, then solid bye week/injury player replacements that I can plug in and get me through. Then I have the guys that are my stashes. I am always trying to turn my bench depth but find I get stuck on a player or like a player too much then realize I have had them on my bench for 2 or 3 years and never started them. Players on my team like McGuire, and Goodwin I feel clog up my bench. They are veterans that I think we know what they are by now in their careers. Then I have my stashes of rookies and young players that I am hopeful will get their shot and do not disappoint when and if they do. I am starting to ask my self, would I ever start this guy? If the answer is no, and they have sat a while, I throw them back in the trash heap. End of season I am trying to go through my roster, cut some players, then do a final cut of the questionable players after training camp and I know how depth charts have lined up. Its not easy sometimes, but I am determined to build an all around solid roster, as I am sure everyone here is also doing.

[Paul717]

In season, in a larger league like 16 teams, you may have to roster the backup QBs to your QBs for example. You may want to roster 2 kickers for one week if your normal starting guy is say top 5 at the position. Other handcuff situations may apply. When the end of the season is nearing, these are the first guys to cut in favor of some upside guys on the waiver wire. I guess you have to weigh each player against potential guys on the waiver wire, taking team strength and weaknesses into account. For example, my TE situation is sad at best, so when ASJ signed with NE I grabbed him immediately in favor of an RB or WR at the end of my bench. Good post I'm sure there will be some useful responses.

[Pac_Eddy]

I deliberately trade packages of players and/or draft picks for a better player to free up rosters space. I love taking a lot of stabs at free agents in season.

I'll also try to trade away roster cloggers but it rarely works. I'll then just make a cut even if someone else will immediately add the guy. Keep churning a few roster spaces for the next week's hot player. Sometimes it has a big payoff.

[Pet_Smith]

I agree with the churn for the cloggers - but you can easily go too far. Part of the skill is holding long enough to give them time to hit, combined with constantly reassessing who is available to pick up and who you think has the greatest opportunity to increase in value.

Never been able to trade these guys though (not buyers, not from want of trying) - just have to ride those that hit, then move on

[sugbear65]

Try not to get an emotional attachment to any players, they are just all assets of different value. It doesn’t matter if you recently traded for, have been holding for ahwile, burned FAB money on them... take all the irrational reasoning out and focus solely on player value and current heat factor. If there’s a better option available, swap them out. I always laugh at comments like “I’ve been holding him for two years, I’ll just keep holding”, or “I used a first round pick on him, I can’t just drop him”.
When it comes to the back end of your roster, take Robert De Niro’s advice from the classic movie “Heat”- “Don’t let yourself get attached to anything you’re not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner”

[Fezzik]

Really interesting post. I get the problem, but I don't think you're going to find the "right" answer.

I play in 3 leagues with a college buddy and text about dynasty all the time. He churns the bottom of his roster like constantly, extremely active. I'm the completely other end of the spectrum - I probably hold players for like way, way too long. I love being right on a player that I believed in - I have McKinnon in all 3 of those leagues and will basically throw an "I told you so" parade if he's a back end RB1, but it's hard to quantify what I've missed doing it that way. He's held and dropped excellent players for flashy new things - I know he rostered Gronk and Victor Cruz and then dropped them and I picked them up and held them for years.

I think the 'trade for future picks' is a great strategy. I like to roll picks forward if I can. I.e. if there's a guy I like on the waiver wire, i'll trade a current guy on my roster for his worth in a 2020 second and then grab the waiver guy.

[DelawareRiverEagles]

Roster cloggers. I hate them. But I cant seem to find a way to get rid of them. There they are, sitting on my bench mocking me. Some players I don't want to cut as think they might blow up, and never do. Or they have the talent, just cannot stay healthy. I sometimes hold onto players so other teams cannot get them then realize probably after its too late that the joke was on me. I was the silly one burning a roster spot on them. Just curious as to how people look at them on their own teams, and how you deal with your bench depth? Are you ruthless, and just cut if they don't perform right away? And if the player blows up after you dropped them you just brush it off and continue on? Do you give the cloggers a year and then move on? What do you believe is a roster clogger? I try to build my teams with my starters, then solid bye week/injury player replacements that I can plug in and get me through. Then I have the guys that are my stashes. I am always trying to turn my bench depth but find I get stuck on a player or like a player too much then realize I have had them on my bench for 2 or 3 years and never started them. Players on my team like McGuire, and Goodwin I feel clog up my bench. They are veterans that I think we know what they are by now in their careers. Then I have my stashes of rookies and young players that I am hopeful will get their shot and do not disappoint when and if they do. I am starting to ask my self, would I ever start this guy? If the answer is no, and they have sat a while, I throw them back in the trash heap. End of season I am trying to go through my roster, cut some players, then do a final cut of the questionable players after training camp and I know how depth charts have lined up. Its not easy sometimes, but I am determined to build an all around solid roster, as I am sure everyone here is also doing.

Honestly, I just look at how they're doing on PFF and if they are trash there, then I can probably dump. But it also depends on the numbers I fell in love with when I drafted them (like college dominator, target share, breakout age, speed, agility, etc.), and then their current production. Can't overlook depth charts and backup QB-WR chemistry either.

Typically though, I will give the prospect a year if they were drafted, but there are some, like Devon Cajuste, who went undrafted and I just took a flyer on. Those are the types you can dump. Same with a guy like George Atkinson III and Darius Jackson.

I picked up Jalin Marshall his rookie year, but after injuries, his suspension, and the emergence of Robby Anderson, I had to dump him.

[The Grudge]

I don't think I am looking for the right answer. But more so seeing how others view their depth to try to hone my skill of building a great all around roster. I believe that you have to pay attention to the depth of your squad to be a contending team each year. In my league some guys do and some guys hold onto players that go no where, as do their teams year in and year out. I have played in multiple dynasty leagues in the past, but currently only in 1, and 1 keeper league and its always the same. So far I think everyone has posted very good thoughts on the subject. Sometimes you know what needs to be done, but you need to also hear it to get the point across. For example I could have picked up Philip Lindsay numerous times for free last season. I kept going back and forth on him but didn't want to dump some of those guys I kind of had the "emotional" connection to. In the end he hit and a guy went big on BB waiver and snatched him and I held onto the players that did nothing for me. He wasn't the first player I waited on and lost out on. But that was kind of the final straw and I have started to change my strategy up since then. So a lot of what has been said so far in this post I find will be extremely useful going forward for my self.

[moishetreats]

I'm going to copy a post that I made on another thread because I think that it applies here, too.

"I look at things a little differently:

I want my starters and their immediate back-ups (for byes, injuries, suspensions, etc.) set. At that point, I simply want the best players (by whatever definition I use) on my team regardless of position. Those players are there to start for me; they're there either as potential trade value OR so that I can trade a bigger "name" who is starting or an immediate back-up and then rely on them."

It's the last sentence that I think is relevant. Do I think that my end-of-roster player can either evolve into a replacement player for me as a starter or immediate back-up? Or do I think that he will ever hold any meaningful trade value (i.e., better than a 4th- or 5th-round pick)? If the answer to either is "yes", then I'm inclined to keep the player. If the answer is "no" to both, then I'll trade for literally ANY pick or then cut him.

Examples from Team 1:
-I'll be keeping St. Brown, David Moore
-I'll be cutting D. Thomas, T. Taylor
-Depending on whether I need the roster spots, Seals-Jones and Hurst are on the bubble.

Examples from Team 2:
-I'll be cutting Lynch, Z. Jones (given his contract), Gronk, Vannett
-I also just traded away McCoy as part of the get-what-I-can-for-a-guy-that-is-a-roster-clogger-by-my-definition mindset

Yes, I'll certainly cut a player sometimes who ends up exploding or at least becoming valuable. But, it's FAR more likely that I'll miss out on multiple players or opportunities by holding on to one of those roster-clogger players.

[meineymoe]

churning for sure here - each week, I look at the waiver, and I look at the weakest players on my roster, and if there is a free agent I think is better than the guy I have, then instant upgrade!

Of course, there are the other puzzlers - for instance, I invested in Treadwell in all of my leagues, and am still holding in a couple of leagues. I even played a little head game with myself and cut him late last season in one league since, as we all know, once you cut a guy he blows up! Of course, he's still gathering dust on the ends of the bench in my other leagues...

The beauty of having a deep enough roster in your league is that you can hold onto these cloggers, waiting out suspensions or injuries or lack of opportunity.

Good luck!
-oo-

[The Grudge]

I'm going to copy a post that I made on another thread because I think that it applies here, too.

"I look at things a little differently:

I want my starters and their immediate back-ups (for byes, injuries, suspensions, etc.) set. At that point, I simply want the best players (by whatever definition I use) on my team regardless of position. Those players are there to start for me; they're there either as potential trade value OR so that I can trade a bigger "name" who is starting or an immediate back-up and then rely on them."

It's the last sentence that I think is relevant. Do I think that my end-of-roster player can either evolve into a replacement player for me as a starter or immediate back-up? Or do I think that he will ever hold any meaningful trade value (i.e., better than a 4th- or 5th-round pick)? If the answer to either is "yes", then I'm inclined to keep the player. If the answer is "no" to both, then I'll trade for literally ANY pick or then cut him.

Examples from Team 1:
-I'll be keeping St. Brown, David Moore
-I'll be cutting D. Thomas, T. Taylor
-Depending on whether I need the roster spots, Seals-Jones and Hurst are on the bubble.

Examples from Team 2:
-I'll be cutting Lynch, Z. Jones (given his contract), Gronk, Vannett
-I also just traded away McCoy as part of the get-what-I-can-for-a-guy-that-is-a-roster-clogger-by-my-definition mindset

Yes, I'll certainly cut a player sometimes who ends up exploding or at least becoming valuable. But, it's FAR more likely that I'll miss out on multiple players or opportunities by holding on to one of those roster-clogger players.

Right here. I like this. And I think that is a very sound strategy.

I am also a waiver wire hawk. I have picked guys like Tyrell, Barber, Goodwin, Hamilton and Allan to name a few off wiavers, and either kept them and played them in bye weeks or traded for something. I just think you can always do better. And everyone here has had some very good examples of how to attack roster construction.