More 2020 Hype: "If You Need A RB or WR, this is the draft for you."

[jenkins.math]

It's not ideal but not the end of the world either, Lamar Jackson scored a 13, Marino a 15, Jim Kelly 15, Mcnabb 14, Mcnair 14 etc etc

Yes, but the list of successful players around that number is much lower than the higher numbers. The etc. etc. isn't really, there aren't too many more you can find after the ones you listed. Bradshaw, but he had the benefit of an all time defense for most of his career.

I think Bradshaw has the lowest wonderlic score for any super bowl winning QB.

This is dated a few years but the numbers haven't changed that much.

https://public.tableau.com/views/DoWond ... VizHome=no

[Jigga94]

Is nobody concerned with the terrible defense that is displayed in 80 percent of Lamb's best plays? It reminds me of that RB who's best plays are all running through 10 foot lanes. I'm hearing some podcasters saying he's in a tier of his own, and he could be THE WR1, or a top 5 NFL WR, and I'm not seeing it. I think he's good, but I think his hype is going over my head.

So you are saying he played college football last year? Ha

I agree on the highlights. I see it more often than not when I watch highlight videos of most WR/RB prospects. Just like Henderson last year...that guy looked electric, but I saw him get touched once in a 5 minute cut up of plays. The disparity in college football makes it hard for my eye to evaluate most of the time. It's why I have to rely on the NFL most of the time to draft players into a tier for me. It's why I really appreciate when people do a film breakdown to show what they see and why it's important. (Like Mike's RB report, or Cameron Giles's Ruggs review)

At least with WRs you can see how they get off the line, how crisp they are in their routes, how much wasted movement they have, and how they catch the ball regardless of how quickly they burnt by the defender from Wofford picking daisies.

That was the biggest red flag for me on Henderson. His level of competition seemed like it was in a different league. Like High School

[Sriracha]

Tua’s wonderlic isnt a deathsentence... but he’s now my QB2 instead of the 1b behind Burrows

[Zacsby]

It's not ideal but not the end of the world either, Lamar Jackson scored a 13, Marino a 15, Jim Kelly 15, Mcnabb 14, Mcnair 14 etc etc

Yes, but the list of successful players around that number is much lower than the higher numbers. The etc. etc. isn't really, there aren't too many more you can find after the ones you listed. Bradshaw, but he had the benefit of an all time defense for most of his career.

Couldn't that just mean less QBs have lower scores overall? Like if we compared the hits vs busts ratio of quarterbacks with high scores that we expected to be good (drafted in 1st round) to the hits vs bust ratio of QBs with low scores that we expected to be good...would it be all that different? If it is, then the difference means something. But just saying there are more successful QBs with high scores than low scores doesn't truly indicate anything.

[FantasyFreak]

It's not ideal but not the end of the world either, Lamar Jackson scored a 13, Marino a 15, Jim Kelly 15, Mcnabb 14, Mcnair 14 etc etc

Yes, but the list of successful players around that number is much lower than the higher numbers. The etc. etc. isn't really, there aren't too many more you can find after the ones you listed. Bradshaw, but he had the benefit of an all time defense for most of his career.

Couldn't that just mean less QBs have lower scores overall? Like if we compared the hits vs busts ratio of quarterbacks with high scores that we expected to be good (drafted in 1st round) to the hits vs bust ratio of QBs with low scores that we expected to be good...would it be all that different? If it is, then the difference means something. But just saying there are more successful QBs with high scores than low scores doesn't truly indicate anything.

It's possible. I don't think there is really any way to spin Tua's score as anything but negative, though. (Which I'm not saying you are doing)

[DJB]

I think Wonderlic would have greater impact on verbiage and the "school" aspect of being a QB. Reading the defence understanding terminology and such.

Not how accurate they throw.

[FantasyFreak]

I think Wonderlic would have greater impact on verbiage and the "school" aspect of being a QB. Reading the defence understanding terminology and such.

Not how accurate they throw.

Exactly. There was a quote saying that Sark tried to go to some pro style stuff, and Tua couldn't handle it mentally, so they went back to all RPO stuff.

[alewilliam789]

Yeah I was already out on Tua due to the injuries, but a 13 for a QB is almost a death sentence.

Burrow 34
Herbert 25
Love 27
Eason 23
Hurts 18
Fromm 35
Gordon 25
Morgan 23

Awesome! Do you have a link? I'm hoping to see those for all the other skill positions as well.

Super appreciated!

Interesting because Tua clearly looks smarter on the field compared to Love. Love's decision making is terrible.

While this may test general intelligence/quickness to process information, it does not test football knowledge/football processing. Somebody posted a Wonderlic test on a feed I follow and by no means does it test actual football knowledge/processing.

[Johnny B. Goode]

Is nobody concerned with the terrible defense that is displayed in 80 percent of Lamb's best plays? It reminds me of that RB who's best plays are all running through 10 foot lanes. I'm hearing some podcasters saying he's in a tier of his own, and he could be THE WR1, or a top 5 NFL WR, and I'm not seeing it. I think he's good, but I think his hype is going over my head.

Not a major concern for me. Dude is a baller, you see it every time the ball comes his way. Still makes crazy catches, gets open before and after the catch, great athlete... Sometimes you just see a guy and know he's gonna be a star in the NFL and that's the feeling I get with him.

Yeah, but I don't see a star. I see a WR2 in the NFL. I guess I'm just not seeing what you are seeing. To each their own.

Some people see Ruggs as a WR1 and I dont see more than a big disappointment. You're right, to each their own.

[OhCruelestRanter]

Two Wonderlic thoughts:

1. This is a useless test for football. It’s centered around English language proficiency and is used as a proxy for reading defenses and playbooks. I would ignore it completely. There might be some correlation, but if you’re a slow reader of English because you’ve spent all of your formative years learning how to read defenses, you’re going to do poorly.

2. Why are agents letting guys take this? Seriously, I don’t understand why this is the only test that nobody skips. Guys refuse to throw, run the 40, do the agility drills, bench press, etc., but it seems like they all take the Wonderlic. I do not get it.

[Ice]

Yes, but the list of successful players around that number is much lower than the higher numbers. The etc. etc. isn't really, there aren't too many more you can find after the ones you listed. Bradshaw, but he had the benefit of an all time defense for most of his career.

Couldn't that just mean less QBs have lower scores overall? Like if we compared the hits vs busts ratio of quarterbacks with high scores that we expected to be good (drafted in 1st round) to the hits vs bust ratio of QBs with low scores that we expected to be good...would it be all that different? If it is, then the difference means something. But just saying there are more successful QBs with high scores than low scores doesn't truly indicate anything.

It's possible. I don't think there is really any way to spin Tua's score as anything but negative, though. (Which I'm not saying you are doing)

The Reigning MVP scored the same as Tua. just sayin.......

[FantasyFreak]

Couldn't that just mean less QBs have lower scores overall? Like if we compared the hits vs busts ratio of quarterbacks with high scores that we expected to be good (drafted in 1st round) to the hits vs bust ratio of QBs with low scores that we expected to be good...would it be all that different? If it is, then the difference means something. But just saying there are more successful QBs with high scores than low scores doesn't truly indicate anything.

It's possible. I don't think there is really any way to spin Tua's score as anything but negative, though. (Which I'm not saying you are doing)

The Reigning MVP scored the same as Tua. just sayin.......

Sure. Point is this isn't a good thing for Tua's draft stock. Teams already have questions about him. Not sure it would change anyone's evaluation, but if anyone was still on the fence, it might. Lamar wins due to his elite athleticism at the position, Tua doesn't. If Lamar had to be a pocket passer he wouldn't be the reigning MVP.

From what I read, Tua couldn't mentally process the pro concepts Sark tried to implement, so they had to stick to RPO's. Doesn't mean Tua can't succeed being strictly an RPO guy, but if his ability to process systems etc. is limited, it limits what a team can do with him, especially since he isn't a major dual threat QB like Lamar.

[Packerland]

It's possible. I don't think there is really any way to spin Tua's score as anything but negative, though. (Which I'm not saying you are doing)

The Reigning MVP scored the same as Tua. just sayin.......

Sure. Point is this isn't a good thing for Tua's draft stock. Teams already have questions about him. Not sure it would change anyone's evaluation, but if anyone was still on the fence, it might. Lamar wins due to his elite athleticism at the position, Tua doesn't. If Lamar had to be a pocket passer he wouldn't be the reigning MVP.

From what I read, Tua couldn't mentally process the pro concepts Sark tried to implement, so they had to stick to RPO's. Doesn't mean Tua can't succeed being strictly an RPO guy, but if his ability to process systems etc. is limited, it limits what a team can do with him, especially since he isn't a major dual threat QB like Lamar.

That's interesting, where did you read that about Tua and Steve Sarkisian? You're definitely right about him not being the same type of threat like Lamar. I'm sure whichever team drafts him will actually cringe whenever he takes off and decides to run with his bum hip and numerous ankle injuries. Where do you think he goes in the draft? I feel like the Chargers are going to take him since they just upgraded the right side of their line with Bulaga and Trai Turner. If they don't take him I think he falls.

[cantguardjake]

Is nobody concerned with the terrible defense that is displayed in 80 percent of Lamb's best plays? It reminds me of that RB who's best plays are all running through 10 foot lanes. I'm hearing some podcasters saying he's in a tier of his own, and he could be THE WR1, or a top 5 NFL WR, and I'm not seeing it. I think he's good, but I think his hype is going over my head.

I am. It may be “hot takey” or whatever but I genuinly feel Lamb and Tua are the 2 most overrated prospects in the draft - mainly just for the stuff you mentioned above with Lamb being in a tier of his own / potential top 5 wr. He’s ok but he wouldn’t have even been the best prospect in last years draft for mine.

Tau I think will be fairly average, he probably won’t outright bust but he’s not as great as everyone is saying.

The whole class is still overrated imo, the top 3 backs are decent but now all early later round prospects that I was interested in are looking like they’ll need to be drafted relatively early (Mims, Aiyuk etc). Feels like last year had more top end prospects and more depth.

[FantasyFreak]

The Reigning MVP scored the same as Tua. just sayin.......

Sure. Point is this isn't a good thing for Tua's draft stock. Teams already have questions about him. Not sure it would change anyone's evaluation, but if anyone was still on the fence, it might. Lamar wins due to his elite athleticism at the position, Tua doesn't. If Lamar had to be a pocket passer he wouldn't be the reigning MVP.

From what I read, Tua couldn't mentally process the pro concepts Sark tried to implement, so they had to stick to RPO's. Doesn't mean Tua can't succeed being strictly an RPO guy, but if his ability to process systems etc. is limited, it limits what a team can do with him, especially since he isn't a major dual threat QB like Lamar.

That's interesting, where did you read that about Tua and Steve Sarkisian? You're definitely right about him not being the same type of threat like Lamar. I'm sure whichever team drafts him will actually cringe whenever he takes off and decides to run with his bum hip and numerous ankle injuries. Where do you think he goes in the draft? I feel like the Chargers are going to take him since they just upgraded the right side of their line with Bulaga and Trai Turner. If they don't take him I think he falls.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/288 ... rlic-score

I really don't know about the spot. Miami or LA, most likely.