Dynasty rankings for premium members only now?

[themburns]

The popularity of the site in the dynasty community is in large part due to the adp and rankings provided. I think shutting those off from new viewers will hurt dlf's web traffic and more over cast a pall over the metagame in regards to the true perceived value of players. Decisions are made for a reason, but if I'm prioritizing football content, there is a list of sites and analysts that do get my money before dlf. As it stands, and I know it means little, I won't be participating in any more mocks. Doesn't feel like such a community thing anymore.

[chadtriumph]

As a paid subscriber, I think the big thing I'm expecting now with this change, is the ranking to actually be updated frequently. I've always thought that it's pretty ridiculous that some rankers either don't update frequently, or just put up horrible ranking in general (i.e. Leaving out guys/grossly under rankings guys bc of sheer laziness to notice how low they had someone). Now that you've put them behind our "paid wall" I'm absolutely expecting them to have deadlines on updates. It seems like the last few years you guys just keep adding more writers instead of just perfecting what you already have. I don't need ranking from a ton of new guys if most of them (new and old.. Mostly not new) aren't even paying attention to them. I'm paying for this service so I expect it to be regulated. I've already spent most of my time the last two years at other sites, and if things don't change I doubt I'll be renewing coming this offseason when my subscription runs out. Not to mention other sites specifically, but at least they keep up with their rankings (and/or statistical analysis) regularly.
I've noticed over the last few years that DLF has tried to produce more articles that are "Matthew Berry-like entertainment", and I for one HATE it. I mentioned it a couple years ago, and it seems like it's become more prevalent. I reccomend working more about cold hard facts, or even bold predictions, than fluff cheap entertainment. I'm not trying to be hateful, but it's cheap material. I've always had no problem paying for content, but I feel like you guys need to allocate your effort/funds into something besides just hiring more ppl.
I hate to come off as rude, but I think you guys need to rethink your current business model. I've always reccomended DLF as the go to site for dynasty, but I'm not sure how much longer that will last. I hope you guys decide to a step back, and get back to the great content that is up to date, and without Berry-like cheap twists!
I definitely want to say thanks for giving us a place to voice our feedback, and actually responding!

[Pix]

Just like many others, I came for the rankings and stayed for the premium articles, and also because I felt I ought to contribute to such a great site.

And as many others have said, I hope this move will lead to an improvement in the rankings, starting with more frequent and more thorough updates with date-stamped comments. The sad case of Stedman Bailey currently bears witness to this need for improvement.

However, what I would really like to see is contender rankings and rebuild rankings. The other site that I subscribe to has started to do this but not very convincingly IMO. If done well, and again with the top ten visible to non-subscribers, I think this would attract new members.

[TomBobAnderson]

I agree with you Telperion. I have learned more from you than some of the writers on this site. The forum is what keeps me coming back daily. You truly are one of my favorite posters. I do think the rankings should be free BUT I'll say that $30/ year is nothing. If most of the posters on here would have subscribed earlier, I'm sure this wouldn't have ever happened. We have to look at ourselves first. Your and other people's post alone is worth the $30/ year. If you can't afford less than $3/ month for this hobby of ours then like someone said, you should be playing less ff and working more. I just truly hope it all works out one way or another and that this site keeps running for 10 more years. I would hate to lose posters like you and Water Buffalo.

[operwapitsai]

If rankings now fall under the paid member subscriptions. They should be maintained better than they were before.

If that is the case for DLF putting them behind a paywall, then that is fair.

However, if there are still comments and blanks from 2+ months ago, what is the incentive for the subscriber? They will just scroll down to the next link on Google searched under 'dynasty rankings'


I am willing to continue to pay, even as the membership price increases. As long as the service provided is on par with the cost. Which I think it has always been above and beyond, but moving a bit closer recently.

[Cameron Giles]

I agree with you Telperion. I have learned more from you than some of the writers on this site. The forum is what keeps me coming back daily. You truly are one of my favorite posters. I do think the rankings should be free BUT I'll say that $30/ year is nothing. If most of the posters on here would have subscribed earlier, I'm sure this wouldn't have ever happened. We have to look at ourselves first. Your and other people's post alone is worth the $30/ year. If you can't afford less than $3/ month for this hobby of ours then like someone said, you should be playing less ff and working more. I just truly hope it all works out one way or another and that this site keeps running for 10 more years. I would hate to lose posters like you and Water Buffalo.

Why should we look at ourselves? It's poor business to blame the consumer for not subscribing to a product. If that's the case, its masquerading a problem with the website and its overall substance.

[steelman]

This is a huge mistake. The rankings were what got me to this site. If the rankings were available to premium members only, I would never have stayed on this site.

I used to be a premium member and I didn't think it was worth it. It's not the fact that it's $30, it's the fact that I didn't see it being worth even that much. I got access to the war forum which has almost no activity. I didn't see any other premium section on the main site that I got access to. I really don't even know what I got as a premium member because the only thing different that I got access to was the War forum, which I don't even go into anymore. I don't see how that's worth $30

[bonscott]

Honestly I don't have a lot of worry for the forums. While much larger then DLF by far, Footballguys maintains a FREE massive volume forum while having most of their content...including rankings...behind the paywall. Fantasy Sharks is another example, they went premium this year as well, although many of their articles and rankings are still on the free side, and their forums are still busy too. I think DLF can maintain that free forum community no problem even with the rankings behind the paywall.

So here is an off the wall idea:
Footballguys doesn't do a whole lot in the off-season but what they do is free to all and they don't erect the paywall until early summer.
Perhaps DLF could play with a similar formula but the other way around. DLF to me is all about winter/spring/summer, the off-season which is when most dynasty sites get things done. Then perhaps they could go free for maybe last half of the season to give people a taste and then erect the paywall again after week 17.

Just some ideas.

[Tsunami]

I subscribe to the free Footballguys newsletter and the free DLF newsletter. FBG sends me an email every day (even through most of the off-season) which usually contains 15-20 timely and relevant fantasy news blurbs. DLF sends me an email every week or two that often starts out with such information as "nothing much happened this week..."

Don't get me wrong, I have been here for years now and I love the forum and I love the ADP/rankings, and I try to support the community by contributing since I am unable financially. I am afraid these changes are going to hurt this community.

PS: footballguys dynasty rankings free: http://subscribers.footballguys.com/app ... wrecent=14

[49ersFaithful80]

$30 per year is literally nothing..$2.50 per month. Nothing to complain about BUT I certainly don't think calling everyone in hear cry babies is the best tactic to get them to sign up.

If you want me to sign up for premium make the rankings worth looking at first and foremost. The averaged rankings among many writers is a fantastic concept but it is horribly executed.

I'd see a certain player ranked WAY higher or lower than they should be and when I investigate into why I figure out it's because a few writers haven't updated their rankings in 6 months and are throwing off the averages. This fact makes the rankings nearly worthless.

If you want the rankings to be accurate designate a mandatory day once per month where every writer has to update their rankings. I would be much more likely to sign up if these rankings were accurate.

[HawkeyeState]

$30 per year is literally nothing..$2.50 per month. Nothing to complain about BUT I certainly don't think calling everyone in hear cry babies is the best tactic to get them to sign up.

If you want me to sign up for premium make the rankings worth looking at first and foremost. The averaged rankings among many writers is a fantastic concept but it is horribly executed.

I'd see a certain player ranked WAY higher or lower than they should be and when I investigate into why I figure out it's because a few writers haven't updated their rankings in 6 months and are throwing off the averages. This fact makes the rankings nearly worthless.

If you want the rankings to be accurate designate a mandatory day once per month where every writer has to update their rankings. I would be much more likely to sign up if these rankings were accurate.

You could just filter out the rankers who haven't updated their rankings recently by clicking the check mark next to their name.

Also even if you made it a once per month mandatory ranking change, it could still go out of date.
Think about the ranking of Devonta Freeman before he started to explode. Then when he did explode and a lot of people were scrambling to get him or get a gauge on his value. If you went to the rankings I'm sure a ton of rankers had him ranked quite low because he had been a backup and hadn't proven much of anything. So X person goes out and looks at the ranks and wants to know what DLF thinks of Freeman now that he's exploding and it's still the old ranks for possibly up to 3 weeks until the update date of once per month.

Basically I'm just saying ranking is an inexact science and one that isn't easy to do.
Heck, I have tried numerous times to make my own rankings and I get through about 20 guys at each spot and then have trouble because I run into players and keep putting them ahead of who I have ranked and then rethinking and it just becomes a mess.

[dlf_jules]

Clarion, I appreciate the intent behind your post, but I don't want this to get personal against any forum member.

[clarion contrarion]

no issues I went to grab a bite and after thinking it over was going to pull it down ... alas you cleared leather 1st amigo

[Cameron Giles]

$30 per year is literally nothing..$2.50 per month. Nothing to complain about BUT I certainly don't think calling everyone in hear cry babies is the best tactic to get them to sign up.

If you want me to sign up for premium make the rankings worth looking at first and foremost. The averaged rankings among many writers is a fantastic concept but it is horribly executed.

I'd see a certain player ranked WAY higher or lower than they should be and when I investigate into why I figure out it's because a few writers haven't updated their rankings in 6 months and are throwing off the averages. This fact makes the rankings nearly worthless.

If you want the rankings to be accurate designate a mandatory day once per month where every writer has to update their rankings. I would be much more likely to sign up if these rankings were accurate.

You could just filter out the rankers who haven't updated their rankings recently by clicking the check mark next to their name.

Also even if you made it a once per month mandatory ranking change, it could still go out of date.
Think about the ranking of Devonta Freeman before he started to explode. Then when he did explode and a lot of people were scrambling to get him or get a gauge on his value. If you went to the rankings I'm sure a ton of rankers had him ranked quite low because he had been a backup and hadn't proven much of anything. So X person goes out and looks at the ranks and wants to know what DLF thinks of Freeman now that he's exploding and it's still the old ranks for possibly up to 3 weeks until the update date of once per month.

Basically I'm just saying ranking is an inexact science and one that isn't easy to do.
Heck, I have tried numerous times to make my own rankings and I get through about 20 guys at each spot and then have trouble because I run into players and keep putting them ahead of who I have ranked and then rethinking and it just becomes a mess.

Good point.

I don't know if it's possible, but I think DLF should have more user-generated comments in the ADP. It would probably be something that's supervised more, but I think it would be a good way of keeping the rankings fresh and updated during the transition to monthly changes. Also it shows great interaction with your audience. Have an open comment box on the page and let users submit a comment that's within a certain amount of characters. The best comments make it to the main page in addition to the writers comments.

[teprovich88]

I don't know if it's possible, but I think DLF should have more user-generated comments in the ADP..

In terms of a sustainable business model, the move of the rankings behind the pay wall in/was a necessary move. But as others have noted, it is necessary that these become a well-maintained tool now. There should also be a "community" ranking which could easily be put together via a surveymonkey vote which I typically see Ryan McDowell use throughout the year to collect data via twitter. I think that this would be a good way to get a general community feel for player rankings. That way there is always (say every 2 weeks) an updated dynasty ranking which would fall on ALL OF US in the forum to be responsible for. This community ranking is something that can be put out "free" to the public to attract individuals to the site and then use the paid wall for specific writers rankings.

Jules, do we know if this is plausible?