Title Game Weekend Thread

[Ruggenater]

Purdy for league MVP! He would definitely be the latest draft pick to win one. Has an undrafted free agent ever won it?

The draft used to be longer. The lowest draft pick to ever win league MVP was Washington kicker Mark Moseley for the 1982 season (pick 346 in his draft class). Kurt Warner, who was undrafted, won it twice.

[killer_of_giants]

campbell got trapped in his own persona. he's one that goes for it, so he went for it.
maybe he learns from it, maybe he doubles down, but i really didn't think he'd do anything close to what he's done with this team. fair play to him.

[Pac_Eddy]

campbell got trapped in his own persona. he's one that goes for it, so he went for it.
maybe he learns from it, maybe he doubles down, but i really didn't think he'd do anything close to what he's done with this team. fair play to him.

You make it sound like he made bad decisions to go for it. I don't think he did. A couple times it didn't work. I think his process is fine.

[Cameron Giles]

campbell got trapped in his own persona. he's one that goes for it, so he went for it.
maybe he learns from it, maybe he doubles down, but i really didn't think he'd do anything close to what he's done with this team. fair play to him.

You make it sound like he made bad decisions to go for it. I don't think he did. A couple times it didn't work. I think his process is fine.

He did make a bad decision. It wasn't about what happened after. It was about the fact that Detroit to that point had no points in the second half and had a clear opportunity to tie the game and extend their chances.

It shouldn't always be "well, we go for it, because that's the brand". And to his credit, he demonstrated exactly that by kicking the FG up 21-7 before the first half ended. He needed to make the same call with 7 minutes left.

[Bronco Billy]

campbell got trapped in his own persona. he's one that goes for it, so he went for it.
maybe he learns from it, maybe he doubles down, but i really didn't think he'd do anything close to what he's done with this team. fair play to him.

You make it sound like he made bad decisions to go for it. I don't think he did. A couple times it didn't work. I think his process is fine.

I don’t know how anyone can reasonably support Campbell’s decisions in the second half. DET was dominating the game, in a road playoff game no less, and those decisions actively and directly contributed to his team’s collapse. How does anyone look at the results and come to the conclusion that the process was good? Those were horrendously poor judgments.

There are a lot of moving parts in sports, and more than a few of them cannot be quantified through analytic analysis. Case in point yesterday in SF - multiple times. Campbell needs to learn from this and take this as a lesson in advanced football theory and recognize where that should take precedence over being blindly beholden to statistics.

ETA

Dan Campbell on his fourth down decision-making:

"I don’t regret those decisions. I understand the scrutiny I will get. That's part of the gig."

Well, it looks like he has no intention of learning from his mistakes.

[Pac_Eddy]

campbell got trapped in his own persona. he's one that goes for it, so he went for it.
maybe he learns from it, maybe he doubles down, but i really didn't think he'd do anything close to what he's done with this team. fair play to him.

You make it sound like he made bad decisions to go for it. I don't think he did. A couple times it didn't work. I think his process is fine.

He did make a bad decision. It wasn't about what happened after. It was about the fact that Detroit to that point had no points in the second half and had a clear opportunity to tie the game and extend their chances.

It shouldn't always be "well, we go for it, because that's the brand". And to his credit, he demonstrated exactly that by kicking the FG up 21-7 before the first half ended. He needed to make the same call with 7 minutes left.

I'm not saying he should go for it for brand reasons, but for logic reasons. Do you think they shouldn't have gone for it when they converted that first down in the first half? I think most people are using hindsight. Had it worked the other times, people wouldn't be saying "he shouldn't have gone for it".

[Cameron Giles]

You make it sound like he made bad decisions to go for it. I don't think he did. A couple times it didn't work. I think his process is fine.

He did make a bad decision. It wasn't about what happened after. It was about the fact that Detroit to that point had no points in the second half and had a clear opportunity to tie the game and extend their chances.

It shouldn't always be "well, we go for it, because that's the brand". And to his credit, he demonstrated exactly that by kicking the FG up 21-7 before the first half ended. He needed to make the same call with 7 minutes left.

I'm not saying he should go for it for brand reasons, but for logic reasons. Do you think they shouldn't have gone for it when they converted that first down in the first half? I think most people are using hindsight. Had it worked the other times, people wouldn't be saying "he shouldn't have gone for it".

A lot of people were saying to kick the FG in the moment.

[Bronco Billy]

You make it sound like he made bad decisions to go for it. I don't think he did. A couple times it didn't work. I think his process is fine.

He did make a bad decision. It wasn't about what happened after. It was about the fact that Detroit to that point had no points in the second half and had a clear opportunity to tie the game and extend their chances.

It shouldn't always be "well, we go for it, because that's the brand". And to his credit, he demonstrated exactly that by kicking the FG up 21-7 before the first half ended. He needed to make the same call with 7 minutes left.

I'm not saying he should go for it for brand reasons, but for logic reasons. Do you think they shouldn't have gone for it when they converted that first down in the first half? I think most people are using hindsight. Had it worked the other times, people wouldn't be saying "he shouldn't have gone for it".

You don’t need a Doctorate in Mathematics to understand that when you are on the road in the playoffs that you should happily be willing to trade FGs to go back up by 3 scores while you take take time off the clock and reduce your opponent’s possessions.

This is just easy and the decision was poor - as my wife can testify that I was saying as they were leaving the O on the field before the play went off. And as I said when KC bypassed the FG to go for it on 4th (and failed) in the first game, and when DET did it again later in the game when they could have tied.

When you’re on the road in the playoffs and a reasonable FG gives you the lead, ties the game or extends your lead you take the points. Period. This is not difficult. This kind of coaching where the HC is a slave to analytics is just nuts. So these guys are just that much smarter than all the legendary coaches that have gone before them, huh?

[Bronco Billy]

And to add to the sentiment, that Campbell “doesn’t regret the decision”. He ought to be regretting the hell out of it and at a minimum seriously revisiting and adjusting his thinking process. He ought to be losing sleep every night all offseason. His team was playing great on the way to the SB and he failed them. And that doesn’t even seem to enter his head.

[killer_of_giants]

And to his credit, he demonstrated exactly that by kicking the FG up 21-7 before the first half ended.

well, that's almost automatic though: part of the "going for it" thing is that if you don't succeed, the opponent will have to drive down the whole field. if that part is taken off, then the benefits are halved and you just take the three points.

campbell got trapped in his own persona. he's one that goes for it, so he went for it.
maybe he learns from it, maybe he doubles down, but i really didn't think he'd do anything close to what he's done with this team. fair play to him.

You make it sound like he made bad decisions to go for it. I don't think he did. A couple times it didn't work. I think his process is fine.

there's a time and place to be overly aggressive. i don't think up by 14 in the 3rd quarter is one of those times.
it would be one thing if it was near the goal line, but it wasn't. they were doing whatever they wanted on third down in the first half, so i get it, but keep them 17 points away, don't get them that extra bit of confidence and you might just take it home.

[killer_of_giants]

And to add to the sentiment, that Campbell “doesn’t regret the decision”. He ought to be regretting the hell out of it and at a minimum seriously revisiting and adjusting his thinking process. He ought to be losing sleep every night all offseason. His team was playing great on the way to the SB and he failed them. And that doesn’t even seem to enter his head.

that's what he tells to the press though, doesn't mean he won't learn or lose sleep.

[Needalife]

And to add to the sentiment, that Campbell “doesn’t regret the decision”. He ought to be regretting the hell out of it and at a minimum seriously revisiting and adjusting his thinking process. He ought to be losing sleep every night all offseason. His team was playing great on the way to the SB and he failed them. And that doesn’t even seem to enter his head.

Well said. This may have been the best chance DET will have for a long time to win this Super Bowl and I feel like coaching hubris and this "brand" bs got in the way. Coaches and players will depart this offseason and it'll be interesting to see how well they keep it going after a crushing loss like this. We will find out if Campbell or Ben Johnson was the main reason for their success. With Jordan Love ascending and maybe Caleb to CHI, the division won't be as much of a layup as it was this year too. I'm not even a Lions fan but I was crushed by this game.

[murphysxm]

I think it is very fair to say that the Lions are not in this game had it not been for this same aggressive style Campbell has shown all season. His players love him for it. He was making consistent decisions that he has made all season. It just didn't work today.

[killer_of_giants]

I think it is very fair to say that the Lions are not in this game had it not been for this same aggressive style Campbell has shown all season. His players love him for it. He was making consistent decisions that he has made all season. It just didn't work today.

again, you don't have to be 100% aggressive, 100% of the times.
gutsy calls at the right time get you there, but not going for a 3-scores advantage so that you can try and get, guess what, a three score advantage (maybe, they still had some field to go) it's certainly not what took them there.

[YouMightDieTryin]

Way too predictable 2nd half by the Lions. DC is a boxer who always goes for the uppercut TKO. Really cool to watch and see when it lands, but eventually EVERYONE knows what's coming.

The first half I was on the edge of my seat just waiting to see what play DET would do next. Their play calls were so diverse. 2nd half hit and it was the opposite. Granted there were a few fluke plays that aided in the comeback, but it wasn't the same team. They felt stiff.

As for kicking the FG...yes, they should've. BUT outside of 45 they hadn't used their Kicker (Badgley+Patterson) all season. Patterson did have one 52 yarder. So there was no real reason to think things were going to change there. They just don't trust him.