Kyler Murray Thread

[Anteaters]

Now this, is very Mahomes like.

https://twitter.com/32BeatWriters/statu ... 8606541982

I love Caleb, but c'mon. That was against Nevada. It might as well have been against SDSU. If you're going to provide proof of his immense talent, show me something against a T20 team.

[FantasyFreak]

Now this, is very Mahomes like.

https://twitter.com/32BeatWriters/statu ... 8606541982

I love Caleb, but c'mon. That was against Nevada. It might as well have been against SDSU. If you're going to provide proof of his immense talent, show me something against a T20 team.

I mean, Mahomes played against a lot of weak competition in college too. I am not saying he's Mahomes, I'm saying he has some attributes that show similarily. Awareness of space and time, and ability to maneuver to extend the play, and find an open guy. I realize this isn't vs NFL competition. It's still a play show showcases some of his abilities.

How about this? Or does the team he's playing mean this isn't sort of like Mahomes too? I'm not saying he's on par with Mahomes (although he's the better college prospect), I want that to be clear. Just some of the same types of things he does off script that few can do, that's all.

https://twitter.com/HaydenWinks/status/ ... 7012727946

[Anteaters]

Now this, is very Mahomes like.

https://twitter.com/32BeatWriters/statu ... 8606541982

I love Caleb, but c'mon. That was against Nevada. It might as well have been against SDSU. If you're going to provide proof of his immense talent, show me something against a T20 team.

I mean, Mahomes played against a lot of weak competition in college too. I am not saying he's Mahomes, I'm saying he has some attributes that show similarily. Awareness of space and time, and ability to maneuver to extend the play, and find an open guy. I realize this isn't vs NFL competition. It's still a play show showcases some of his abilities.

How about this? Or does the team he's playing mean this isn't sort of like Mahomes too? I'm not saying he's on par with Mahomes (although he's the better college prospect), I want that to be clear. Just some of the same types of things he does off script that few can do, that's all.

https://twitter.com/HaydenWinks/status/ ... 7012727946

I'm just effin' with you. I'm not convinced AZ is ready to give Kyler away for peanuts, but I'm all about the Caleb bandwagon.
And yes, that was a hell of an over the head thirty yard toss!

[FantasyFreak]

I love Caleb, but c'mon. That was against Nevada. It might as well have been against SDSU. If you're going to provide proof of his immense talent, show me something against a T20 team.

I mean, Mahomes played against a lot of weak competition in college too. I am not saying he's Mahomes, I'm saying he has some attributes that show similarily. Awareness of space and time, and ability to maneuver to extend the play, and find an open guy. I realize this isn't vs NFL competition. It's still a play show showcases some of his abilities.

How about this? Or does the team he's playing mean this isn't sort of like Mahomes too? I'm not saying he's on par with Mahomes (although he's the better college prospect), I want that to be clear. Just some of the same types of things he does off script that few can do, that's all.

https://twitter.com/HaydenWinks/status/ ... 7012727946

I'm just effin' with you. I'm not convinced AZ is ready to give Kyler away for peanuts, but I'm all about the Caleb bandwagon.

All good. Kid is special. I think there will be someone who wants Kyler, I just don't think there will be teams lined up in a bidding war, and I just don't think you can pass on this kid, if you get the chance. It would be kind of funny, if Kyler got Rosened. Cards would be a 1st round pick turnstile at QB.

[Anteaters]

It would be kind of funny, if Kyler got Rosened. Cards would be a 1st round pick turnstile at QB.

Kyler is to Rosen, what driving to work in a Porsche is to walking to work in a rainstorm without an umbrella in the mud in 33 degrees.

Whether or not AZ trades him, Kyler has a long future ahead of him of being a very good NFL quarterback.

[Valhalla]

It would be kind of funny, if Kyler got Rosened. Cards would be a 1st round pick turnstile at QB.

Kyler is to Rosen, what driving to work in a Porsche is to walking to work in a rainstorm without an umbrella in the mud in 33 degrees.

Whether or not AZ trades him, Kyler has a long future ahead of him of being a very good NFL quarterback.

Not everyone likes Porsche.

[FantasyFreak]

It would be kind of funny, if Kyler got Rosened. Cards would be a 1st round pick turnstile at QB.

Kyler is to Rosen, what driving to work in a Porsche is to walking to work in a rainstorm without an umbrella in the mud in 33 degrees.

Whether or not AZ trades him, Kyler has a long future ahead of him of being a very good NFL quarterback.

He'll be good until he can't run. We'll see how long he lasts, but I think his best days for FF are behind him. He's a mid tier QB for real football IMO. In a big group of guys behind the top tier. Didn't rank well on PFF last year, and I think it may take him some time post injury to find his game with a lengthy layoff.

In no way was I comparing Rosen's talents to anyone's, relax. I just think it would be funny if the Cards had 3 top 10 QB's inside 5 years, with 2 being 1.01. Would have to be a record.

[mild]

Picking this back up here:

You think that contract is reasonable? IDK man, and when you are paying JJ 30 million plus a year and Hock 18 or whatever, I just don't see it. The team that signed Kyler to that deal put in a study clause. Then they want to get out of it 2 years later? I think someone takes it, but I'd be shocked if they want to pay a load of draft capital for someone else's mistake.

If Kyler doesn't play as you suggest, it's going to be hard to convince someone with no evidence he can still and will still move the same way on the field, and whether he'll be gun shy or not.

Yeah, presuming your evaluation of Kyler is that he is still a Top 10 QB in the NFL (whichever way you want to slice that evaluation) then that is -absolutely- a reasonable contract, and it will be bordering on a bargain by this time next year.

Consider the overall Cap figures I linked you. We are talking year-on-year jumps of 14%, 25% and 38% cap space proportional to the current value at $224 million. Those cap figures are possible thanks to the new TV deals kicking in this season. In short: once again, as ever - QB contracts are set to absolutely explode over the next three years in relation to their currently structured amounts. The rising tide is going to lift all ships.

Back to Kyler's contract. By this time next year, it will be -at best- the 7th highest value QB contract - and more likely, will be bringing up the rear (or even out!) of the top 10 - because I think at least one of Tua / Fields / Mahomes / Allen will get new contracts, if not even all of them.

Burrow and T-Law's contracts will easily displace Kyler at #5 - and we'll see how far he falls from there.

Both Lamar and Herbert are earning 6 million more per year than Kyler already. That's a whole role-player salary right there.

If you think Kyler Murray still has Top 10 arm talent in the league (I do, and I believe other GM's will also tell themselves some version of this story) then I think it will be looked upon as a more than reasonable contract when the time comes for other teams to bid for him.

There is no reason that J-Jefferson and TJ Hockensen contract pairing would preclude you from paying top 10 QB money, any more than having Tee Higgins and Ja'marr Chase should preclude the Bengals from no-brainer-ing Joe Burrow to a max. Besides which - if Minnesota *was* the acquiring team, they'd be getting Kyler at *at least* 7 mil less per season than Burrow, and Hockensen for -well less- than either of those Top 5 WR contracts.

Kyler's back-of-the-Top 10 QB contract will be practically a bargain!

Kyler's not a top 10 NFL QB. For FF, sure. Not real football. He certainly didn't grade out that way last year, and post ACL, I can't imagine he'll be better fresh of that. I don't think anyone will be talking about how Kyler's contract is a bargain in a few years. FWIW, let's take this over to the Kyler thread, so as not to take up the Hock thread with Kyler talk.

So leaving aside your own evaluation of him - are you really contending that when it comes time for Arizona to auction him off - that there won't still be teams and GM's that think that he's still a Top 10 talent, or that he might have that ceiling?

I think - much like Watson - there are going to be teams that think the best version of Kyler might still be in there, or that they might be able to unlock him with the right scheme/coach/motivators - and that they will be willing to gamble on that idea.

To me: the tools are still there. The problem is the intangibles - and I believe that those can still be taught, and mature - especially for a guy that was last on a football field at age 25.

[Kurtrambis1]

There will be a market for Kyler, but I doubt it is going to be as robust as we all think. The last time we were preparing for him to play, his team put in a film watching clause. A lot was going on with the Cardinals, but this is a major red flag. I agree with Mild that the intangibles aren’t there, at least from a fan’s perspective.

A small mobile quarterback coming off a major injury, who has preparation flaws so serious a team wrote required studying into his contract? I bet a lot of teams will pass but there will be some desperate GMs trying to save their jobs who will think they can fix him.

[murphysxm]

This is going to be a very interesting off season narrative. I will say that I believe there will be a market, but teams that we deem “smart” won’t be involved. He has skills and talents, but his drawbacks are only going to continue to be on the forefront. Add a possibly great QB rookie class to the mix, I just don’t see the line to bid on Kyler being long.

[CGW]

Can some of you never-kylers explain the 2020-2021 Pro Bowl seasons? What makes 2022 more indicative of his talent than the seasons where he graded out as a top five QB by PFF?

I get the bad season, but can we agree that the O-line was decimated for the cards, the coach was terribly inept at running an NFL offense, and Murray's primary weapons were suspended/injured more than half the games he started? There are some reasonable excuses for his poor play and I can imagine there is at least one GM in the league who looks at 2020-2021 Murray as a potential steal.

I count seven QBs that I'd absolutely take over Murray. After that it's pretty darn fluid when looking at long term franchise plans.

[Cameron Giles]

Just thinking as simple as possible:

- Kyler Murray will be 27 next season
- He's been a good QB overall as a pro.
- There are multiple teams where he would be a significant upgrade (Atlanta, Washington, Tampa, New England, Las Vegas, Tennessee)
- Teams get desperate, especially when they aren't bad enough to draft a strong QB prospect.
- He's under contract through 2028. Team can always restructure to loosen up some cap.

I just don't see why there wouldn't be teams lining up for him. What's the plan to get a QB as good or better?

[dynastyninja]

Barring some crazy injury, Kyler is going to have a list of suitors a mile long if he's available. Wentz got multiple shots, same with Baker, Teddy B, and plenty of others guys worse than Kyler.

[FantasyFreak]

Barring some crazy injury, Kyler is going to have a list of suitors a mile long if he's available. Wentz got multiple shots, same with Baker, Teddy B, and plenty of others guys worse than Kyler.

Yeah, but I don't think anybody's arguing that. Of course he's going to get another shot. Disagree with a list of suitors a mile long. He's got a large contract, injury concerns and attitude concerns. Undoubtedly someone will take him, but I don't think teams will get into a giant bidding war over him.

[TheTroll]

Barring some crazy injury, Kyler is going to have a list of suitors a mile long if he's available. Wentz got multiple shots, same with Baker, Teddy B, and plenty of others guys worse than Kyler.

Yeah, but I don't think anybody's arguing that. Of course he's going to get another shot. Disagree with a list of suitors a mile long. He's got a large contract, injury concerns and attitude concerns. Undoubtedly someone will take him, but I don't think teams will get into a giant bidding war over him.

Yeppers, the contract is the biggest thing here. He’s in a catch 22 in 2023. Needs to play great this year to showcase his skills for the next suitor however AZ as a team doesn’t want that.