Dynasty League Football Forum

American legal system: innocent until proven guilty
Media and court of public opinion: guilty until proven innocent (and then still lingering doubts about innocence)

I understand it is the offseason and we run out of stuff to talk about until camp starts... but the top 4 of 5 non-pinned topics are Zeke in trouble, Bell in trouble, Crowell in trouble, Gordon in trouble. I understand that in fantasy football there may be suspensions and repercussions due to player actions.

But ever since the Iverson and Moss era there has been this massive cry to police the behavior of [NFL] athletes. The amount of ink given to these events, regardless of which player it is, vastly precedes and outlives any legal proceedings. It is as if the event of spectating and calling for the head of NFL players has become its own fantasy football event.

I think we are far from the worst here on the forums, and the casual football fan with their anger that these players are rich (and often subconscious racial bias against them being rich) fuels this more than anything. The media just proceeds to cater to this mindset that professional sports leagues should police and punish people for off-field conduct, but nowhere do they exert this influence greater than the NFL.

I think as dynasty owners and forum participators (and in being so, an inherent type of somewhat obsessed super-fan), we can help to influence the culture, if just a little bit, in not playing into vilifying these players for our entertainment and as a punching bag for our other gripes with society.

Some stats to consider:
http://www.utdallas.edu/news/2015/8/25- ... nterColumn


For every year between 2000 and 2013, the total arrest rate for the general population was significantly higher than the total arrest rate for NFL players. For example, the total arrest rate for the general population was 4,889 arrests per 100,000 people in 2013; the total arrest rate for NFL players was 3,740. For most years, the total arrest rate for the general population was one and a half to two times as high as the total rate for NFL players.

“The data show that the perception that NFL players are overly criminal compared to the U.S. population is false,” Piquero said. “In fact, when you look at the forest and not the trees, the trends over the 14-year period show that the general population has higher arrest rates than NFL players do.”

I think you made a very solid post. As a devils advocate the only thing I would like to note is that once players make it to the NFL they have more resources to ensure certain things never see the light of day. I am not trying to insinuate anything specific just that it wouldnt come as a surprise if the arrest rate was somewhat affected by that.

I personally do agree with the majority of your post but wanted to make note that the statistics could be affected by such a variable.

I don't disagree with the intent of the OP Yeti, but reading the specifics of the chart maybe I'm missing something. There aren't 100,000 players in the NFL, so you'd expect there to be more arrests/infractions in the general population. I'm not sure this chart takes into account the substantially larger "general population" pool versus the smaller "NFL Player" pool.

It the stats were adjusted so that there were the same number of subjects in each pool, or the ratio was adjusted to account for the disparity in numbers between the two groups would the graph still look the same?

Shoreline Steamers wrote:I don't disagree with the intent of the OP Yeti, but reading the specifics of the chart maybe I'm missing something. There aren't 100,000 players in the NFL, so you'd expect there to be more arrests/infractions in the general population. I'm not sure this chart takes into account the substantially larger "general population" pool versus the smaller "NFL Player" pool.

It the stats were adjusted so that there were the same number of subjects in each pool, or the ratio was adjusted to account for the disparity in numbers between the two groups would the graph still look the same?

Unless I read it wrong, this is per 100,000 for each set of data.

Social media makes these things a much larger issue than they actually are. Sensationalism is what drives the media, and the media influences its demographics. Like you stated, the crime rates in the NFL are relatively low, and similarly, the overall crime (and murder) rates are low in the U.S. But when somethings fits a narrative (be it left-wing or right-wing biased), it's going to sell ad space & clickbait and hashtags are created.

In short, Twitter allows us to demand immediate justice - or at least the justice we want to perceive, based on our inherent biases.

The only thing that can be asked of people is that they reserve their judgment until the court system plays out & hope that there was no tampering in the process. Otherwise, we'll just continue fueling our own fire.

It doesn't help that there's also a thinly veiled racist element to it, in most cases. White people don't have much trouble taking it on faith that a black athlete playing a violent sport could be a criminal.

Interesting discussion to be had on this subject, but it looks pretty "off topic."

dlf_jules wrote:Interesting discussion to be had on this subject, but it looks pretty "off topic."

I considered this and it may be stretching what is dynasty discussion, but is it really that different than incessantly hypothesizing on the "character red flags" of 20ish college kids and college aged young men? I know it doesnt address a specific person or situation but it is a tidbit to he considered as we run down whether a young man will be a tainted football player because he smoked marijuana once in college, was arrested, etc.

What I am getting at is the suspensions came from the public outcry and did not used to be so harsh. But now we treat them as a fact of life, and then it becomes normal to have whole discussions on single behavior incidents of single players. That is why I thought it was a bit on topic for dynasty discussion

Shoreline Steamers wrote:I don't disagree with the intent of the OP Yeti, but reading the specifics of the chart maybe I'm missing something. There aren't 100,000 players in the NFL, so you'd expect there to be more arrests/infractions in the general population. I'm not sure this chart takes into account the substantially larger "general population" pool versus the smaller "NFL Player" pool.

It the stats were adjusted so that there were the same number of subjects in each pool, or the ratio was adjusted to account for the disparity in numbers between the two groups would the graph still look the same?

The link to the study is above the chart. There are obviously not 100,000 players in the NFL, the NFL number is adjusted proportionally. It uses statistics to calculate an arrest rate per 100,000 people. They used the same methodology as the FBI uses to calculate Uniform Crime Reports.

While as a whole nfl players may be involved in less crimes then the general public. I think what's missing in the OP I a question (or notion) that are we wrong to hold sport stars (celebrities) to a higher standard? I watch them every week, our kids try to be like them, (and largely because WE watch them). I'm not certain about anyone's actions (other then myself) and I find that I'm more disapointed in MY choice to introduce my kids to this game, that has led me to answer questions I had hoped they wouldn't have asked so young

millworkguy wrote:While as a whole nfl players may be involved in less crimes then the general public. I think what's missing in the OP I a question (or notion) that are we wrong to hold sport stars (celebrities) to a higher standard? I watch them every week, our kids try to be like them, (and largely because WE watch them). I'm not certain about anyone's actions (other then myself) and I find that I'm more disapointed in MY choice to introduce my kids to this game, that has led me to answer questions I had hoped they wouldn't have asked so young

That is always the rationale why we should punish sports stars for off-field behavior. Here's the thing, when holding people to this higher standard, MLB and NHL are not scrutinized nor is any behavioral issue met with such outcry. Why do you think that is? Mere popularity of the sport? No. It is most certainly racial.

Secondly, the serious longterm brain injuries involved in football and your child wanting to emulate the sport is a much much much greater danger than him being likely to smoke pot because players had an unnamed drug violation. With all of the bad influences in society (and they are everywhere), player off field conduct is the last of my worries for when my son grows up. Him wanting to play the sport I played and I loved is a much bigger concern.

I'm not sure where you are, but being a Canadian, hockey (nhl) issues are all over the news when then happen, from a Canadian hockey player being charged with assult in switzerland, to patrick Kane in Buffalo etc etc.

While you feel that the nfl is targeted due to race, nba and mlb are both extremely diverse, what the nfl does have by far is the largest roster. 12 men in the nba, 25 for mlb and the nhl, 53 plus P.S. for the nfl. If each sport had the same percentage of troubled players, you would simply hear about it more as the nfl has at least twice, and 4 times larger (vrs nba) the player pool

I don't have to worry about my daughters being able to play this game yet, doesn't seem to be much opportunity yet for girls football.

There has been a growing trend to knock down celebrities around the world, from all circles (sports, music, arts). I find it to be a disgusting trend where we cant be happy of someones else's success. We knock them down, to show everyone has faults. Its now called news by some.

millworkguy wrote:I'm not sure where you are, but being a Canadian, hockey (nhl) issues are all over the news when then happen, from a Canadian hockey player being charged with assult in switzerland, to patrick Kane in Buffalo etc etc.

I can concur with that - the Patrick Kane incident was huge when it came out. I would note that there is some discussion about the PK Subban trade being racial (in the sense that if he had been white he wouldnt be being criticized for his outspoken personality and thus less likely to have been traded for Weber).

However that is a different topic than criminal charges - just noting the NFL is not alone in things like concussions, character issues & racial concerns.