James Conner

[Cameron Giles]

Anderson, Hill, Spiller, Lacy, Martin, Richardson were all league winners if you remember their best seasons in context.

I feel like you're trying to convince yourself that Conner is much more talented than the rest of those guys and he's "different." Some of those players went 1st round. CJ Spiller at one point was a first round startup pick. I've been wrong on Conner before, so maybe. But, I don't see a player that I'd pay Kareem Hunt prices to acquire. He's playing well, but I'm inclined to believe this season is more of a perfect storm than the next elite RB.

[Jigga94]

I was a hater and I still think he wont make it long term. Right now hes just in my top 20 though with the likes of Howard, D. Freeman, Kerryon and LF all right ahead. I can still easily name 18 that I'd rather have.

Gurley, Barkley, Kamara, Zeke
Bell, MG3, Hunt, CMC
DJ, Mixon, Sony, Kerryon, LF
Guice, Cook, Chubb, D. Freeman, Howard
Conner, Ingram, Lindsay, Cohen...

[jenkins.math]

Anderson, Hill, Spiller, Lacy, Martin, Richardson were all league winners if you remember their best seasons in context.

I feel like you're trying to convince yourself that Conner is much more talented than the rest of those guys and he's "different." Some of those players went 1st round. CJ Spiller at one point was a first round startup pick. I've been wrong on Conner before, so maybe. But, I don't see a player that I'd pay Kareem Hunt prices to acquire. He's playing well, but I'm inclined to believe this season is more of a perfect storm than the next elite RB.

Trent Richarson's best year was his rookie year where he had 950 yards and 11 TDs. That doesnt singlehandedly win you a league. Especially considering where he was drafted in real life and fantasy. Spiller also had one nice year, but again he wasn't a super late pick. The CJ Spiller hype train lasted forever. Anderson was an undrafted FA too. You can't have faith in those guys long term. That's super rare.

I'll again ask you show me a guy who has looked like this in half a season, was an early draft pick (day 1 or 2), in a high powered offense that churns out RB1s every single year, regardless of the name that just fell off the planet barring injury. You can't, because that player doesn't exist. So if you want to think Conner will be the first of that group that's your right to stand on that side of the line.

Now if your argument is "I'm not paying the price he costs right now" that's fine. I agree that you never buy guys at their peak. But to act like he isnt a legit RB1 (at least through his rookie deal), or doesn't belong with Kareem Hunt (who again is almost identical to James Conner in virtually everything you care about fantasy wise) is you being hard headed and stubborn about it.

I feel like we had this exact same conversation about Kareem Hunt this time last year and at the beginning of this season when he wasn't going nuts. Now everyone is happy.

[jenkins.math]

I was a hater and I still think he wont make it long term. Right now hes just in my top 20 though with the likes of Howard, D. Freeman, Kerryon and LF all right ahead. I can still easily name 18 that I'd rather have.

Gurley, Barkley, Kamara, Zeke
Bell, MG3, Hunt, CMC
DJ, Mixon, Sony, Kerryon, LF
Guice, Cook, Chubb, D. Freeman, Howard
Conner, Ingram, Lindsay, Cohen...

What's the difference between Conner and Hunt? Youve seen Hunt do it for an entire year?

[Cameron Giles]

Again, I just gave you a large group of players who won leagues in their best season or two and did nothing of note afterwards. Trent Richardson had over 1300 total yards as a rookie and 12 touchdowns, and you're arguing he didn't win leagues? CJ Anderson was a 2nd round startup pick for a reason. Your argument has essentially been: "Well, no this is different this time."

James Conner is not in a situation that we've never seen before in the NFL. Whether you were a backup or a starter there have been a number of RBs in the leagues most expendable position who've produced at a high level for a year or two and fizzled out afterwards. If you play dynasty long enough you know that and you avoid valuing those players highly. Time will tell if Conner suffers the same fate, but there's nothing overly talented about him.

Yes, he's an RB1 for this season.

[jenkins.math]

Again, I just gave you a large group of players who won leagues in their best season or two and did nothing of note afterwards. Trent Richardson had over 1300 total yards as a rookie and 12 touchdowns, and you're arguing he didn't win leagues? CJ Anderson was a 2nd round startup pick for a reason.

James Conner is not in a situation that we've never seen before in the NFL.

Nobody is arguing that James Conner is in some sort of unique situation. Or that he is special even. But to act like its unfathomable for him to be a RB1 through his rookie deal with all his surroundings is crazy to me.

Honestly watching James Conner do what he has done makes me apprehensive about Lev Bell going forward. I think Bell is talented, but its becoming more and more evident this is a great system for a RB.

[Jigga94]

I was a hater and I still think he wont make it long term. Right now hes just in my top 20 though with the likes of Howard, D. Freeman, Kerryon and LF all right ahead. I can still easily name 18 that I'd rather have.

Gurley, Barkley, Kamara, Zeke
Bell, MG3, Hunt, CMC
DJ, Mixon, Sony, Kerryon, LF
Guice, Cook, Chubb, D. Freeman, Howard
Conner, Ingram, Lindsay, Cohen...

What's the difference between Conner and Hunt? Youve seen Hunt do it for an entire year?

Yea pretty much and he was always going to be the guy and will be the guy there for years...

So if I had Conner and you had Hunt, youd feel confident in a straight up trade? Your argument would say yes here but I highly doubt youd do it in real life. I believe Conner is a fad and therefore has more risk. Maybe I'm wrong, but I am with the camp that says that this is his peak and he will never duplicate this production

[Cameron Giles]

Again, I just gave you a large group of players who won leagues in their best season or two and did nothing of note afterwards. Trent Richardson had over 1300 total yards as a rookie and 12 touchdowns, and you're arguing he didn't win leagues? CJ Anderson was a 2nd round startup pick for a reason.

James Conner is not in a situation that we've never seen before in the NFL.

Nobody is arguing that James Conner is in some sort of unique situation. Or that he is special even. But to act like its unfathomable for him to be a RB1 through his rookie deal with all his surroundings is crazy to me.

Honestly watching James Conner do what he has done makes me apprehensive about Lev Bell going forward. I think Bell is talented, but its becoming more and more evident this is a great system for a RB.

How is it unfathomable if he's not a special talent? You said it yourself.

I think you're buying into it way too much. Sure, Pittsburgh's offense is friendly for RBs and their line has always at least blocked respectably, but that offense doesn't turn just anything into long-term, HOF caliber RBs. Bell is a great talent in a great offense. Conner is an average talent in a great offense. Both can produce big results in a given season.

[jenkins.math]

I was a hater and I still think he wont make it long term. Right now hes just in my top 20 though with the likes of Howard, D. Freeman, Kerryon and LF all right ahead. I can still easily name 18 that I'd rather have.

Gurley, Barkley, Kamara, Zeke
Bell, MG3, Hunt, CMC
DJ, Mixon, Sony, Kerryon, LF
Guice, Cook, Chubb, D. Freeman, Howard
Conner, Ingram, Lindsay, Cohen...

What's the difference between Conner and Hunt? Youve seen Hunt do it for an entire year?

Yea pretty much and he was always going to be the guy and will be the guy there for years...

So if I had Conner and you had Hunt, youd feel confident in a straight up trade? Your argument would say yes here but I highly doubt youd do it in real life. I believe Conner is a fad and therefore has more risk. Maybe I'm wrong, but I am with the camp that says that this is his peak and he will never duplicate this production

I wouldn't make that trade because I think it's a lateral move at best. There is no reason to make a lateral move unless you are getting younger. Now I would ship out Lev Bell for Conner straight up because I get younger and I see maybe 2 teams Lev Bell could legit sign with that have as good a situation as Pitt in Philly and Minny.

Now in your tier 3, other than Mixon, Sony, and maybe Kerryon, I would trade DJ, LF straight up for Conner. And there isnt anybody in tier 4 that I would trade straight up for Conner.

I wouldn't be shocked if this is the best we see of Conner. Which is why I stated earlier I wouldn't buy him at this price. But, I think he is an RB1 on his rookie deal in Pitt. So for the next 2 years you have a top 10 RB. That's nothing to sneeze at and that is a nice dynasty asset. Not to mention you invested very little to draft Conner. So he is most likely your 2nd or 3rd RB on your roster. If you have 2 or 3 RB1s on your roster, you probably win a title at some point in that span.

[jenkins.math]

Again, I just gave you a large group of players who won leagues in their best season or two and did nothing of note afterwards. Trent Richardson had over 1300 total yards as a rookie and 12 touchdowns, and you're arguing he didn't win leagues? CJ Anderson was a 2nd round startup pick for a reason.

James Conner is not in a situation that we've never seen before in the NFL.

Nobody is arguing that James Conner is in some sort of unique situation. Or that he is special even. But to act like its unfathomable for him to be a RB1 through his rookie deal with all his surroundings is crazy to me.

Honestly watching James Conner do what he has done makes me apprehensive about Lev Bell going forward. I think Bell is talented, but its becoming more and more evident this is a great system for a RB.

How is it unfathomable if he's not a special talent? You said it yourself.

I think you're buying into it way too much. Sure, Pittsburgh's offense is friendly for RBs and their line has always at least blocked respectably, but that offense doesn't turn just anything into long-term, HOF caliber RBs. Bell is a great talent in a great offense. Conner is an average talent in a great offense. Both can produce big results in a given season.

Who is arguing he is a HOF caliber RB? Nobody. Again, you're starting an argument with yourself and then defending the argument that nobody else has said but you. As I said earlier, you're moving the goalposts.

So you dont think Conner is an RB1 on the remainder of his rookie deal in Pitt? That's all anybody has said on here and you have stretched that idea to "he isnt a HOFer".

[Cameron Giles]

I think his value is questionable next year and long-term, so I'd be hesitant to value him like Kareem Hunt or anyone in that tier. He's not a special or high-level talent to me and that's typically the type of RB that holds onto that type of production/role for many years. The rest go through the RB carousel.

[joeya2001]

Well what has he done to prove he's no a RB1?

until further notice he's a RB1 in my eyes.

[Cameron Giles]

He's absolutely an RB1 right now.

[jenkins.math]

I think his value is questionable next year and long-term, so I'd be hesitant to value him like Kareem Hunt or anyone in that tier. He's not a special or high-level talent to me and that's typically the type of RB that holds onto that type of production/role for many years. The rest go through the RB carousel.

Which is fair. But where did you have Kareem Hunt this time last year?

[Cameron Giles]

I think his value is questionable next year and long-term, so I'd be hesitant to value him like Kareem Hunt or anyone in that tier. He's not a special or high-level talent to me and that's typically the type of RB that holds onto that type of production/role for many years. The rest go through the RB carousel.

Which is fair. But where did you have Kareem Hunt this time last year?

I thought Hunt was due for some regression (and it happened). KC's offensive line was blocking at a historically good rate to start last season. However, I liked him more long-term than Conner.