Kerryon Johnson Value

[Jfever]

Never viewed KJ as an elite rb. I'm not heavily invested in him, but do own 2 shares. I do agree that he flashed and showed upside. I see him eventually falling into the lower end of dynasty rb1's. I saw the "it" factor in him too and I agree that he is an interesting young rb with potentially some nice upside. Simply put, He to me was / is more than a JAG. My issues or reservation on ranking him higher than a low end rb1 is his team, his division, his coaching staff, and how I think he will likely be used moving forward. Detroit does seem to insist on a rbbc approach for whatever reason. I wouldn't put a lot of stock into prorated numbers and I certainly don't use YPC to evaluate running backs. So, I guess that puts me somewhere in the middle. On one hand he is much better than a JAG and on the other, I don't think he is necessarily elite as far as overall rb skill set, and I don't think he'll be used in a manner that makes it easy for him to get the production that we equate to rb1 guys.

[UATahoe]

My main concern with Kerryon coming out of college was durability. He was constantly injured in college and was always dealing with some type of injury almost every season. I do think he is really talented but i also worry that he will deal with the injury issues quite a bit which makes me leery of valuing him too high.

[Ice]

He was in a time share with a journeyman power back that averaged less than 3 yards per carry. One can blame the coach or whatever but that's another issue of concern as to scheme. The Coach is from a specific coaching tree that uses RBBC. Obviously, the Lions saw something in practice that led to limited opportunities.

No way to really sugarcoat it. He flashes some but production was pretty limited compared to actual stud players.

This is not a strong argument.

We really have no idea how KJs usage would of been in the last half of the season. By using this same argument, you would of said that McCaff wasn't elite after his rookie season because he didn't get many touches, he had a trashbag powerback in Jstew taking all the attempts, and was in a coaching system that has traditionally leaned on a RBBC.

Similarly, if DJ had gotten hurt (hypothetical scenario) a few games after seizing the lead back role in his rookie season, this thought process would of confirmed he wasn't a stud either. Because obviously the coaches must of been seeing something in Chris Johnson that season, that led to DJs limited opportunities earlier in the year.

The same could of been said about Nick Chubb, the coaches must of seen something in practice that made them only give Chubb 2-3 touches per game in his first half of the season, and with only a plodder like Hyde in front of him....Chubb must not be that great. Again, imagine if Chubb was in KJs scenario and got hurt after only seizing the lead back role at mid season. Does that make Chubb less of a stud...no it doesn't.

I've said this before in this thread but I suppose it is worth repeating. In the 5 games that KJ seized the lead role (and in a JBC offense), he was on pace for 294.4 total touches. That is elite volume (would of been 7th this season), just because it's not 294.4 rush attempts, doesn't make it worth any less, if anything it's worth more now that more ppl play ppr leagues.

NTM it's highly probable that KJ gets more volume now that Bevell is in town, which should only help KJs numbers. And I think alot of ppl forget, or maybe don't know, that KJ did have the 2nd best YPC in the league last yr, the kid was doing something right.

Actually,

I had McCaffrey rated at the top of his draft. He displayed monster PPr ability.
I also had DJ as the 2nd best RB in his draft and moved way up in the draft to select him. (I had a top 5 grade on him)
I moved Chubb back in the 1st round which may have been a miss due to receiving ability. He is proving better in that department to go with excellent power.

I avoided KJ due to running style and durability concerns. Like his ability but didn't see a stud 3 down back or a stud ppr back. Not saying he won't be as we have all missed on players before but I like 4 RB's in this draft better than him and 3 WR's this draft better than him based on how I evaluate upside.

Simply don't have an early 1st round grade on him and am all but certain the Lion's will get a RB compliment to join the time share this season.

No issues if you don't agree, or don't like the argument, that's why we play the game.

[KingsKing]

Sony jag? Y'all are on one

I had him down in my rookie rankings, somewhere in the 1.10 range last year and 2nd last in the top rb rankings to only Freeman. I watch a lot of Patriots games and even though he found success this season is was mostly do to positive game script ,good blocking and lots of short yardage opportunity. I watched him drop or flat out miss several short dump off and screen passes even causing Brady to yell and show displeasure on at least 2-3 of those occasions. In additon to the lack of passing game chops he also isnt very fast or elusive and i cant remember him making too many people miss or gaining anything more than what was blocked for him. Burkhead and White are both much better pass catchers, both are also decent runners. For Sony to remain productive imo he needs the goaline touches and 15-20 carries a game.

[ninotoreS]

I'm posting from mobile so I'm not gonna do multi quotes and stuff, but one misconception I've seen in a reply thats easy enough to correct: Bevell has been given the keys to the offense, and he has never been hot for frequent RB rotation, folks.

Patricia is a jumped up DC. The only thing he's imposing on the offense is ball-control (bc it complements D), which is why he gave Cooter the boot to hire an OC that's all about ball control.

Patricia is not married to RBBC. That's a notion rooted entirely in false correlate thinking, nothing else. You think as the Pats DC he ordered McDaniels to committee? Please. Such decisions on that side of the ball he had nothing to do with.

Why did he bring Blount with him? Obviously bc the Detroit run game had been pitiful for years, so he brought an old hard running and cheap vet to help instill a new culture in the RB room.

Truth is, Cooter was the guy in Detroit most in favor of committee. He's gone now.

Mark me: it'll be an upset if KJ doesn't average 20 touches a week with Bevell. Health permitting.

[ninotoreS]

One more thing.

Those who claim to have studied the tape to support an offered opinion but actually haven't are usually obvious to those of us that actually have.

[ninotoreS]

https://www.al.com//sports/2019/02/new- ... hnson.html

“The running-back position, I’d say, has become so specified in the NFL, from first and second down to third down,” Detroit coach Matt Patricia said. “Often times those running backs have become different types of players from that standpoint. … Certainly for us, based on what we’re looking to get at running back, we want to see if that guy can play on all three downs. That’s going to be the most advantageous for us. Kerryon is someone we really targeted last year in the draft and really liked, and he came through for us in a big way in a lot of different areas. He was someone we thought could play on early downs and third downs."

[thebeast]

Technically, and I could be recalling this incorrectly, but I believe Marshawn Lynch did not truly become elite until after he was traded to the Seahawks in mid-season 2010 and not until that fateful playoff game in Jan 2011 where he broke off the 67 yard run.

So an argument can be made that Bevel helped propel Lynch as much as Lynch helped Bevel & the Seahawks

Here are some historical threads on Lynch

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=11780&p=77307

viewtopic.php?f=81&t=12395&p=86387

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=13666&p=105133

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=15984&p=125164

I think you are wrong.

[Pullo Vision]

Stumbled across this video from mid 2018 season comparing Kerryon Johnson to Alvin Kamara- https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bMA_Uk-z5Zs#searching

Edit bad link paste job.

[FantasyFreakGuru]

Stumbled across this video from mid 2018 season comparing Kerryon Johnson to Alvin Kamara- https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9P_-eC76lk

Ban this spammer ^

[Pullo Vision]

Stumbled across this video from mid 2018 season comparing Kerryon Johnson to Alvin Kamara- https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9P_-eC76lk

Ban this spammer ^

I don't agree with the comparison, even though he makes some interesting points. Are you saying you don't either agree with the premise, either?

[ninotoreS]

Technically, and I could be recalling this incorrectly, but I believe Marshawn Lynch did not truly become elite until after he was traded to the Seahawks

I think you are wrong.

It's established Lynch did better in Seattle with Bevell than he did with the team that drafted him, Buffalo. He went from a mild disappointment to the Bills, to a SB winning corner-stone with the "Beast Mode" appellation for the Hawks.

Stumbled across this video from mid 2018 season comparing Kerryon Johnson to Alvin Kamara- https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9P_-eC76lk

Ban this spammer ^

You had better be tongue-in-cheek. I've even seen Mike Tagliere make the Kamara comparison.

Edit: Oh. The linked video isn't what's claimed. Pullo, are you (weirdly) trolling, or did you copy-paste the wrong url?

[kadun2]

Technically, and I could be recalling this incorrectly, but I believe Marshawn Lynch did not truly become elite until after he was traded to the Seahawks

I think you are wrong.

It's established Lynch did better in Seattle with Bevell than he did with the team that drafted him, Buffalo. He went from a mild disappointment to the Bills, to a SB winning corner-stone with the "Beast Mode" appellation for the Hawks.

Stumbled across this video from mid 2018 season comparing Kerryon Johnson to Alvin Kamara- https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9P_-eC76lk

Ban this spammer ^

You had better be tongue-in-cheek. I've even seen Mike Tagliere make the Kamara comparison.

Edit: Oh. The linked video isn't what's claimed. Pullo, are you (weirdly) trolling, or did you copy-paste the wrong url?

Yeah, that was weird clicking on that link.

[kadun2]

I think the Kamara/Kerryon comparison is right on. I think a little more strength work from Kerryon will get him closer. The skill sets, instincts, and vision are very similar .

[Pullo Vision]

Edit: Oh. The linked video isn't what's claimed. Pullo, are you (weirdly) trolling, or did you copy-paste the wrong url?

That was DEFINITELY NOT the link I was trying to put- https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bMA_Uk-z5Zs#searching