2016 NCAA Discussion/Observations

[DynoScout]

I'd have to agree that the appeal of the 2017 class has a little less shine these days. Even if some of the guys have looked 'solid', it isn't what it was hyped to be at points. That said, the levels were never really achievable. You can still look at the positional groups relatively though;

QB - Watson underperforming, but this class still projects better than 2016.

RB - still has top end talent despite the underwhelming. Is also deeper than normal.

WR - was never THAT exciting. Dupre was all projection anyway. Juju is the big disappointment, but he always was and will be a USC WR. There are still guys though.

TE - Engram is playing better than expected. Butt the same. OJ still has the potential. This isn't the offense for him. Solid class.

People should still have hope, but it is nice to see the price of the picks come back to reality slightly.

The bold here is the most interesting twist so far in my view. Usually future picks have a predictable trajectory, a nice steady rise in value that continues all the way until the pick is made (or at least the NFL draft). With 2017 the market got so white hot over the summer that the implied trajectory was never sustainable. The market seems to be correcting.

[Cameron Giles]

I'd have to agree that the appeal of the 2017 class has a little less shine these days. Even if some of the guys have looked 'solid', it isn't what it was hyped to be at points. That said, the levels were never really achievable. You can still look at the positional groups relatively though;

QB - Watson underperforming, but this class still projects better than 2016.

RB - still has top end talent despite the underwhelming. Is also deeper than normal.

WR - was never THAT exciting. Dupre was all projection anyway. Juju is the big disappointment, but he always was and will be a USC WR. There are still guys though.

TE - Engram is playing better than expected. Butt the same. OJ still has the potential. This isn't the offense for him. Solid class.

People should still have hope, but it is nice to see the price of the picks come back to reality slightly.

The bold here is the most interesting twist so far in my view. Usually future picks have a predictable trajectory, a nice steady rise in value that continues all the way until the pick is made (or at least the NFL draft). With 2017 the market got so white hot over the summer that the implied trajectory was never sustainable. The market seems to be correcting.

Good posts by both of you. That's always been my stance on 2017. Many were valuing those picks on a perfect projection and it's just not realistic. Could the class still be better than 2016? Absolutely, but I don't see the 2014 class repeating itself here. And if we're being honest, so far the WR's don't look better than 2016 (from a college standpoint).

Engram is definitely separating himself from Butt and Howard. Howard is in a losing battle though because Lane Kiffin has never and will never use him correctly. 6'6 athletic freak at TE who's stuck blocking for four years.

[FiremanEd]

Engram is definitely separating himself from Butt and Howard. Howard is in a losing battle though because Lane Kiffin has never and will never use him correctly. 6'6 athletic freak at TE who's stuck blocking for four years.

I think we'd agree that the lower OJ's value the better. He's still a very good TE prospect in my books, regardless what happens this year. It just means a better bargain. The Playoff breakout was good/bad because was nice to see he could do it, but bad that he was a well known commodity with peak hype at just the wrong time to get a deal. I'd happily take him TE3 in this draft if it plays out that way.

[Cameron Giles]

Engram is definitely separating himself from Butt and Howard. Howard is in a losing battle though because Lane Kiffin has never and will never use him correctly. 6'6 athletic freak at TE who's stuck blocking for four years.

I think we'd agree that the lower OJ's value the better. He's still a very good TE prospect in my books, regardless what happens this year. It just means a better bargain. The Playoff breakout was good/bad because was nice to see he could do it, but bad that he was a well known commodity with peak hype at just the wrong time to get a deal. I'd happily take him TE3 in this draft if it plays out that way.

I agree. College production is important for me but having the knowledge of why Howard hasn't been productive makes it easier to take him. I think even the coaching staff has admitted multiple times before that they haven't done well securing a consistent role for Howard.

[Friction]

James Washington, Oklahoma State has a line of 9/296/2... So far. Against Pitt too, so it's not like it's against North Dakota State or something.

yeah if it was against NDSU his # would likely be far less. ... ask iowa !

I was hoping somebody caught my analogy. What a win for the Bison. I know a lot of people from there so it was big news around these parts.

[Coogan Football]

Holy Stanford/UCLA...

[Cameron Giles]

Here's my first stab at the Top 12 after four weeks:

1. Leonard Fournette, RB - LSU
2. Mike Williams, WR - Clemson
3. Dalvin Cook, RB - Florida State
4. Christian McCaffery, RB - Stanford
5. Nick Chubb, RB - Georgia
6. Isaiah Ford, WR - Virginia Tech
7. Corey Davis, WR - Western Michigan
8. Courtland Sutton, WR - SMU
9. JuJu Smith-Schuster, WR - USC
10. Royce Freeman, RB - Oregon
11. Evan Engram, TE - Ole Miss
12. Samaje Perine, RB - Oklahoma

Overall I'd say this class hasn't lived up to the insane amount of hype it received all summer. But it's still got some good talent.

[lukkynumber13]

McCaffrey looks like Shady out there. McCoy, not Slim.

[Wheelhouse]

Here's my first stab at the Top 12 after four weeks:

1. Leonard Fournette, RB - LSU
2. Mike Williams, WR - Clemson
3. Dalvin Cook, RB - Florida State
4. Christian McCaffery, RB - Stanford
5. Nick Chubb, RB - Georgia
6. Isaiah Ford, WR - Virginia Tech
7. Corey Davis, WR - Western Michigan
8. Courtland Sutton, WR - SMU
9. JuJu Smith-Schuster, WR - USC
10. Royce Freeman, RB - Oregon
11. Evan Engram, TE - Ole Miss
12. Samaje Perine, RB - Oklahoma

Overall I'd say this class hasn't lived up to the insane amount of hype it received all summer. But it's still got some good talent.

Good list. The class still looks like the best in years to me, there has been far too much over-reaction around here to a few weeks worth of data IMO. Maybe it's because people only started following some of these guys this past offseason and this is the first they are seeing of them, so assume they are over-rated if they start slow? You have to remember that these guys, particularly the RB's, are the stars of their teams and get all the attention of the defence, it's hard work to find breathing room with 8 in the box every down (see Saquon Barkley, an amazing talent). Even look at juju, he's got no real help around him to the point the QB has been benched. The guy was dominant his first two years, nothing has changed in year 3 at this point, need to see the full year before jumping to conclusions.

[jaykay22]

Maybe nobody will take a chance on him and he goes undrafted, but Syracuse's Amba Etta Tawo is putting up video game numbers and has been cool to follow so far.

12/270/1 today, putting him at 40/706/5 so far for the season...after 4 games. He's already put up career high numbers and is a graduate student senior, so lots of questions might rise, but the man is balling out.

In a conference that boasted one 1,000-yard receiver in 2015, Etta-Tawo has 706 yards in just four games. He leads the next-closest wideout (Virginia Tech’s Isaiah Ford) by more than 300 yards already.

[clarion contrarion]

Engram is definitely separating himself from Butt and Howard. Howard is in a losing battle though because Lane Kiffin has never and will never use him correctly. 6'6 athletic freak at TE who's stuck blocking for four years.

I think we'd agree that the lower OJ's value the better. He's still a very good TE prospect in my books, regardless what happens this year. It just means a better bargain. The Playoff breakout was good/bad because was nice to see he could do it, but bad that he was a well known commodity with peak hype at just the wrong time to get a deal. I'd happily take him TE3 in this draft if it plays out that way.

exactly ^ reminds me a bit of keith jackson who had only 65 catches in 4 years at oklahoma went on to be 3 time all pro and a 5time pro bowler . He has big time skills even if kiffin isn't using him correctly in some people's eyes. I really like engram but howard looked like a future NFL star more or less from the very start of his career at bama and getting him at a discount because some scoff at his college # is dynasty gravy.

[People Mover]

The 2017 class looks just fine IMO. Just fine. Can we talk about how Elliot is not performing the way we thought he would? Wasn't he the third best running back in the league before taking a carry behind the greatest o line in football? The amazingly underrated 2016 class hasn't exactly set the world on fire... Treadwell is still learning page one of the playbook but he was supposed to be better than anyone in the 2017 class. Sorry. No. Fuller and Sheppard are the only bright spots and that is due to playing alongside two great receivers. Next year is going to be a drafter's buffet compared to this year. Prepare to eat.

[Cameron Giles]

Here's my first stab at the Top 12 after four weeks:

1. Leonard Fournette, RB - LSU
2. Mike Williams, WR - Clemson
3. Dalvin Cook, RB - Florida State
4. Christian McCaffery, RB - Stanford
5. Nick Chubb, RB - Georgia
6. Isaiah Ford, WR - Virginia Tech
7. Corey Davis, WR - Western Michigan
8. Courtland Sutton, WR - SMU
9. JuJu Smith-Schuster, WR - USC
10. Royce Freeman, RB - Oregon
11. Evan Engram, TE - Ole Miss
12. Samaje Perine, RB - Oklahoma

Overall I'd say this class hasn't lived up to the insane amount of hype it received all summer. But it's still got some good talent.

Good list. The class still looks like the best in years to me, there has been far too much over-reaction around here to a few weeks worth of data IMO. Maybe it's because people only started following some of these guys this past offseason and this is the first they are seeing of them, so assume they are over-rated if they start slow?.

Nope. I watch a lot of college football, so most of these players aren't unfamiliar to me. Of course, I"ll have to go back and watch tape when it's posted, but overall I'd say that this class hasn't been as stout as people were hyping. I think it's good that most of the headliners have delivered though. 33% of the season is already over, so the small sample size angle is approaching it's end.

[Cameron Giles]

The 2017 class looks just fine IMO. Just fine. Can we talk about how Elliot is not performing the way we thought he would? Wasn't he the third best running back in the league before taking a carry behind the greatest o line in football? The amazingly underrated 2016 class hasn't exactly set the world on fire... Treadwell is still learning page one of the playbook but he was supposed to be better than anyone in the 2017 class. Sorry. No. Fuller and Sheppard are the only bright spots and that is due to playing alongside two great receivers. Next year is going to be a drafter's buffet compared to this year. Prepare to eat.

It really depends on what your bar is. Most rookies WR's are never fantasy relevant, but I think Coleman, Fuller, Shepard, Sharpe and Thomas have looked good to start. There's still plenty of time for Treadwell and Doctson to get on the field consistently as well.

[TB3falcons]

Here's my first stab at the Top 12 after four weeks:

1. Leonard Fournette, RB - LSU
2. Mike Williams, WR - Clemson
3. Dalvin Cook, RB - Florida State
4. Christian McCaffery, RB - Stanford
5. Nick Chubb, RB - Georgia
6. Isaiah Ford, WR - Virginia Tech
7. Corey Davis, WR - Western Michigan
8. Courtland Sutton, WR - SMU
9. JuJu Smith-Schuster, WR - USC
10. Royce Freeman, RB - Oregon
11. Evan Engram, TE - Ole Miss
12. Samaje Perine, RB - Oklahoma

Overall I'd say this class hasn't lived up to the insane amount of hype it received all summer. But it's still got some good talent.

I like the list, but I'd put Joe Mixon over Perine at this point. Mixon has looked like a complete back in that offense. Maybe Perine can turn it around, but I really like Mixon more right now.