Penny vs Guice (WHY?)

This is the spot for player-to-player comparisons.

Penny or Guice?

Penny
45
41%
Guice
64
59%
 
Total votes: 109

sammyz
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Re: Penny vs Guice (WHY?)

Postby sammyz » Tue May 29, 2018 10:54 am

FantasyFreak wrote: Mon May 21, 2018 8:23 pm
kumetis93 wrote: Sun May 20, 2018 2:17 pm
gameaholica wrote: Mon May 14, 2018 12:41 pm

Who did you end up drafting?
Sorry for the extremely late reply on this. I went with Penny, and the rest of the league laughed at me for it (which I couldn't care less about). I do think that due to him being a first rd pick and a position of need in SEA, he will get significant usage. I could see Guice being a beast as well, but I think Penny will catch plenty of passes out of the backfield, and make plays in the open field.

The fact that NE and CLE both were interested in Penny and attempted trading for him following his selection by SEA was the turning point in my decision. We won't know for 2-3 seasons if I made the right decision though.
Why? Taking the more productive RB with better draft capital and a path to 3 down playing time is laughable because...... :shock: . People can still weave just as strong a narrative for taking Guice, but neither selection is laughable.
Is there something I'm completely missing on how likely Penny is to become a true 3 down back? he had 19 receptions for like 135 yards last year. Is it just because the coaches SAID they want him to be a 3 down back? We think Thompson will completely eliminate the potential for Guice in the receiving game though? Coaches do what is best for their teams, if Guice proves a better receiver and better threat to have on the field for all 3 downs, then he's going to earn more of that work. I wouldn't be surprised if you see Guice with more catches than Penny in a year or two.
QBs: Dak Prescott, Teddy Bridgewater, Taysom Hill, Jameis Winston, Jalen Hurts, Andy Dalton
RBS: CMC, Miles Sanders, Gurley, JK Dobbins, AJ Dillon, Lamical Perine, Ito Smith
WRS: Godwin, DJ Moore, Juju, Keenan Allen, Diggs, McLaurin, Dionte Johnson, Jalen Reagor, Bryan Edwards, Brandon Aiyuk, Tim Patrick
TEs: Mark Andrews, TJ Hockenson, Irv Smith
DEF:Miami

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Re: Penny vs Guice (WHY?)

Postby FantasyFreak » Tue May 29, 2018 10:07 pm

sammyz wrote: Tue May 29, 2018 10:54 am
FantasyFreak wrote: Mon May 21, 2018 8:23 pm
kumetis93 wrote: Sun May 20, 2018 2:17 pm

Sorry for the extremely late reply on this. I went with Penny, and the rest of the league laughed at me for it (which I couldn't care less about). I do think that due to him being a first rd pick and a position of need in SEA, he will get significant usage. I could see Guice being a beast as well, but I think Penny will catch plenty of passes out of the backfield, and make plays in the open field.

The fact that NE and CLE both were interested in Penny and attempted trading for him following his selection by SEA was the turning point in my decision. We won't know for 2-3 seasons if I made the right decision though.
Why? Taking the more productive RB with better draft capital and a path to 3 down playing time is laughable because...... :shock: . People can still weave just as strong a narrative for taking Guice, but neither selection is laughable.
Is there something I'm completely missing on how likely Penny is to become a true 3 down back? he had 19 receptions for like 135 yards last year. Is it just because the coaches SAID they want him to be a 3 down back? We think Thompson will completely eliminate the potential for Guice in the receiving game though? Coaches do what is best for their teams, if Guice proves a better receiver and better threat to have on the field for all 3 downs, then he's going to earn more of that work. I wouldn't be surprised if you see Guice with more catches than Penny in a year or two.
I would. Penny catches the ball really well. They didn't use him out of the backfield much, but he's got hands. Watch his pro day and combine he's just got natural hands out of the backfield. Here's a few 3rd down plays

https://youtu.be/O3wq49sasGk?t=3m1s

https://youtu.be/O3wq49sasGk?t=3m29s Any questions about his hands should be cleared up right here.

https://youtu.be/73RLuFRZuMM?t=1m16s 3rd down with a QB scramble at Senior Bowl (could we see this type of thing with RW?)
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Re: Penny vs Guice (WHY?)

Postby sammyz » Wed May 30, 2018 9:48 am

FantasyFreak wrote: Tue May 29, 2018 10:07 pm

I would. Penny catches the ball really well. They didn't use him out of the backfield much, but he's got hands. Watch his pro day and combine he's just got natural hands out of the backfield. Here's a few 3rd down plays

https://youtu.be/O3wq49sasGk?t=3m1s

https://youtu.be/O3wq49sasGk?t=3m29s Any questions about his hands should be cleared up right here.

https://youtu.be/73RLuFRZuMM?t=1m16s 3rd down with a QB scramble at Senior Bowl (could we see this type of thing with RW?)
I mean, that is literally the same case with Guice though. Dude played slot in the army bowl coming out of high school and was named MVP with two gigantic TD catches, he spent his entire pro day catching the ball (and looked pretty natural at it to me). His coaches said themselves that they see him as a "very good" if not quite "great" receiver, that they just didn't use the backs much as receivers.

I see him as a better natural receiver than Fournette, who had the same knock on him coming out of LSU and wound up catching 36 balls last year. If Guice can catch 36 I'd be pretty darn pleased.

I'm just not seeing anything in Penny that suggests to me that he'll actually be BETTER at catching the football than Guice except the coaches comments, and we know what those are worth come mid season.
QBs: Dak Prescott, Teddy Bridgewater, Taysom Hill, Jameis Winston, Jalen Hurts, Andy Dalton
RBS: CMC, Miles Sanders, Gurley, JK Dobbins, AJ Dillon, Lamical Perine, Ito Smith
WRS: Godwin, DJ Moore, Juju, Keenan Allen, Diggs, McLaurin, Dionte Johnson, Jalen Reagor, Bryan Edwards, Brandon Aiyuk, Tim Patrick
TEs: Mark Andrews, TJ Hockenson, Irv Smith
DEF:Miami

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Re: Penny vs Guice (WHY?)

Postby Dynasty DeLorean » Wed May 30, 2018 6:54 pm

From what I've seen on their college tape and what I've heard from the NFL teams, I think Penny is a bit more suited to actually line up as a WR and go downfield a bit if needed, or, scheming him open in the passing game with wheel routes etc. Guice to me is more of a dumpoff type of guy. Nothing wrong with either, but I think there is more upside to Penny's receiving game. Neither put up gaudy receiving stats in college but Penny's target share was well above average whereas Guice's was below average.

One thing I'll note is that Penny's pass-blocking was bad, but you know which other RB was horrible at pass pro? Melvin Gordon, and he has received 33, 41 and 58 receptions in the NFL. And it's my belief that Penny is a better overall player than Gordon.

As for which to take, I like them both equally. I'm sure it will look obvious a year from now. But without hindsight, I think Penny might be a better choice for contenders and Guice a better choice in a startup/re-build. Guice's age will provide him that extra insulated value, while Penny should have a larger workload year 1.

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Re: Penny vs Guice (WHY?)

Postby sammyz » Fri Jun 01, 2018 7:51 am

Dynasty DeLorean wrote: Wed May 30, 2018 6:54 pm
As for which to take, I like them both equally. I'm sure it will look obvious a year from now. But without hindsight, I think Penny might be a better choice for contenders and Guice a better choice in a startup/re-build. Guice's age will provide him that extra insulated value, while Penny should have a larger workload year 1.
This is my thinking. I don't particularly need a huge output from either THIS season so I"m going to swing for the fences and bet that Guice has a bigger (and longer) career.
QBs: Dak Prescott, Teddy Bridgewater, Taysom Hill, Jameis Winston, Jalen Hurts, Andy Dalton
RBS: CMC, Miles Sanders, Gurley, JK Dobbins, AJ Dillon, Lamical Perine, Ito Smith
WRS: Godwin, DJ Moore, Juju, Keenan Allen, Diggs, McLaurin, Dionte Johnson, Jalen Reagor, Bryan Edwards, Brandon Aiyuk, Tim Patrick
TEs: Mark Andrews, TJ Hockenson, Irv Smith
DEF:Miami

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Re: Penny vs Guice (WHY?)

Postby FantasyFreak » Sun Aug 09, 2020 5:41 am

BUMP. :boohoo: :roll:

This is not how I thought this debate was going to go.
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Re: Penny vs Guice (WHY?)

Postby Gator Sens » Sun Aug 09, 2020 8:27 am

Certainly Penny at this point. Guice has been a monster monster bust.

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Re: Penny vs Guice (WHY?)

Postby Servo » Thu Aug 13, 2020 9:52 am

Barkley :dance:
Penny :think:
Michel :problem:
Chubb :thumbup:
Rojo :(
Kerryon :wall:
Guice :sick:

What a landmine of an RB crop that draft has become.


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