What would prevent a rookie from..

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Swampdonkey17
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What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby Swampdonkey17 » Sun Mar 22, 2015 3:32 am

Having a side deal with a team before draft, and not even entering draft? Eagles want Mariota, and I'm sure it's mutual. What's preventing Mariota from saying he doesn't want to enter draft, then get a UDFA contract from Eagles for #2 pick money? Im sure there is something to protect against this, but what is it?
Journal of my first orphan rebuild. If you're in a rebuild and want to get ideas or give some, feel free.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=92442
QB: Andrew Luck,Andy Dalton, Brett Hundley, Trevor Siemian
RB: Lamar Miller, Eddie Lacy,Carlos Hyde,Dion Lewis, Mark Ingram, Thomas Rawls,Terrell Watson, Legarette Blount, Daniel Lasco, DJ Foster
WR: Deandre Hopkins,Alshon Jeffrey,Randall Cobb,Kelvin Benjamin,Jarvis Landry, Devante Parker, Tyrell Williams,
TE: Greg Olsen, Eric Ebron,Julius Thomas
D: Denver, Baltimore

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby JordanSchultz2332 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 6:47 pm

I'd be interested in knowing too.
16 teams, 25 Roster Spots-
1QB, 2RB, 2WR, 1 TE, 2 DL, 2 LB, 2 DB (adding IDPs with this rookie draft)
PPR, 3 points for 300 yard passing/100 Rushing-Recieving, 2 pts. for 40+ yard TD's otherwise standard scoring.
Potential keepers (10 this year, 15 every following year after expanding rosters and adding IDPs.)
QB - Tannehill
RB - A. Morris, D. Martin, R. Matthews, D. Freeman, S. Jax, J. Randle, K. WIlliams
WR - Dez, J. Gordon, Michael Floyd, John Brown, M. Lee, R. Streater
TE - M. Bennett, C. Clay
Valuable draft picks 1.01, 1.05, 1.15, 3.01, 3.13, 4.04, 5.02, 5.12, 5.13

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby bigroddy » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:06 pm

The CBA prevents it. Players are eligible in the regular draft or the supplemental draft if they haven't declared on time. They only become FA if they pass through either unclaimed.

Players can hold out, and/or go to another league/sport if they wish to try and hold a team hostage, but the team that picked them still retains their rights.

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby Swampdonkey17 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:26 pm

bigroddy wrote:The CBA prevents it. Players are eligible in the regular draft or the supplemental draft if they haven't declared on time. They only become FA if they pass through either unclaimed.

Players can hold out, and/or go to another league/sport if they wish to try and hold a team hostage, but the team that picked them still retains their rights.
What if they dont declare for either?
Journal of my first orphan rebuild. If you're in a rebuild and want to get ideas or give some, feel free.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=92442
QB: Andrew Luck,Andy Dalton, Brett Hundley, Trevor Siemian
RB: Lamar Miller, Eddie Lacy,Carlos Hyde,Dion Lewis, Mark Ingram, Thomas Rawls,Terrell Watson, Legarette Blount, Daniel Lasco, DJ Foster
WR: Deandre Hopkins,Alshon Jeffrey,Randall Cobb,Kelvin Benjamin,Jarvis Landry, Devante Parker, Tyrell Williams,
TE: Greg Olsen, Eric Ebron,Julius Thomas
D: Denver, Baltimore

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby rubber_duck » Sun Mar 29, 2015 6:45 am

My understanding is that any person whose high school graduation was at least 3 years ago is eligible to be drafted. In other words, a team could announce that they select one of us as their 5th round pick. :dance:

The NFL does prohibit its teams from selecting college players that have college eligibility remaining, unless those players announce and forfeit that eligibility ... aka: declare for the draft.

So the practical way your scenario could play out would be more like:
- A good college player announces that he has no intention of playing in the NFL and will pursue other things in life.
- Most NFL teams would then have no interest in risking a draft pick on a player that they could not sign to a contract.
- A side deal with a team could be made before the draft, that team having "inside knowledge" that this player actually does want to play in the NFL.
- That team could then select the player later in the draft or sign him as a free agent.

The issue I see is the investigations that would follow, as this would undermine the entire method the NFL has to assign rookies to teams. Side note: one high profile rookie in 2014 alluded to intentionally under-performing at the combine so that he would slide in the draft to a team he wanted to play for.

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby austin10splayer » Fri Apr 03, 2015 3:09 am

rubber_duck wrote:My understanding is that any person whose high school graduation was at least 3 years ago is eligible to be drafted. In other words, a team could announce that they select one of us as their 5th round pick. :dance:

The NFL does prohibit its teams from selecting college players that have college eligibility remaining, unless those players announce and forfeit that eligibility ... aka: declare for the draft.

So the practical way your scenario could play out would be more like:
- A good college player announces that he has no intention of playing in the NFL and will pursue other things in life.
- Most NFL teams would then have no interest in risking a draft pick on a player that they could not sign to a contract.
- A side deal with a team could be made before the draft, that team having "inside knowledge" that this player actually does want to play in the NFL.
- That team could then select the player later in the draft or sign him as a free agent.

The issue I see is the investigations that would follow, as this would undermine the entire method the NFL has to assign rookies to teams. Side note: one high profile rookie in 2014 alluded to intentionally under-performing at the combine so that he would slide in the draft to a team he wanted to play for.
That last point would get that team fined a HUGE amount and probably see some of the biggest front office and coach suspensions we've ever seen. Buy hypothetically it definitely makes sense
Team 1

12 team .5 PPR; QB,2RB,3WR,1TE,1K,1DT,1DE,1LB,1CB,1S,2D-FLEX)

QB: Derek Carr, Sam Bradford, Geno Smith, Mark Sanchez
RB: Alfred Morris, Jonathan Stewart, LeGarette Blount, Matt Jones, Tevin Coleman, Bishop Sankey, Buck Allen, David Cobb, Jonas Gray, Benny Cunningham,
WR: Alshon Jeffery, TY Hilton, Odell Beckham, Jarvis Landry, Mike Wallace, Tavon Austin, Marquess WIlson, Willie Snead, JJ NElson
TE: Tyler Eifert, Eric Ebron, Maxx Williams
K: Chandler Catanzaro
DE: Calais Campbell, Muhammad WIlkerson
DT: Marcell Dareus, Clinton McDonald
LB: Anthony Barr, Mychal Kendricks, Telvin Smith, Malcolm Smith, Sio Moore, Bernadrick McKinney, Uani Unga
CB: Prince Amukamara, Kyle Fuller
S: Reshad Jones, Ha-Ha Clinton Dix, Tyrann Mathieu

Swampdonkey17
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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby Swampdonkey17 » Fri Apr 03, 2015 3:17 am

rubber_duck wrote:My understanding is that any person whose high school graduation was at least 3 years ago is eligible to be drafted. In other words, a team could announce that they select one of us as their 5th round pick. :dance:

The NFL does prohibit its teams from selecting college players that have college eligibility remaining, unless those players announce and forfeit that eligibility ... aka: declare for the draft.

So the practical way your scenario could play out would be more like:
- A good college player announces that he has no intention of playing in the NFL and will pursue other things in life.
- Most NFL teams would then have no interest in risking a draft pick on a player that they could not sign to a contract.
- A side deal with a team could be made before the draft, that team having "inside knowledge" that this player actually does want to play in the NFL.
- That team could then select the player later in the draft or sign him as a free agent.

The issue I see is the investigations that would follow, as this would undermine the entire method the NFL has to assign rookies to teams. Side note: one high profile rookie in 2014 alluded to intentionally under-performing at the combine so that he would slide in the draft to a team he wanted to play for.
This all makes sense, Texas Rangers own the rights to Russell Wilson.


Wonder if MFL would add me to their free agent pool if I requested it...I would spend a 3rd on me to be on a fantasy roster. And then I would start a thread on DLF about me, pumping me up serious hype, and flip me for a 2nd.
Journal of my first orphan rebuild. If you're in a rebuild and want to get ideas or give some, feel free.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=92442
QB: Andrew Luck,Andy Dalton, Brett Hundley, Trevor Siemian
RB: Lamar Miller, Eddie Lacy,Carlos Hyde,Dion Lewis, Mark Ingram, Thomas Rawls,Terrell Watson, Legarette Blount, Daniel Lasco, DJ Foster
WR: Deandre Hopkins,Alshon Jeffrey,Randall Cobb,Kelvin Benjamin,Jarvis Landry, Devante Parker, Tyrell Williams,
TE: Greg Olsen, Eric Ebron,Julius Thomas
D: Denver, Baltimore

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby bigroddy » Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:18 am

Swampdonkey17 wrote:
bigroddy wrote:The CBA prevents it. Players are eligible in the regular draft or the supplemental draft if they haven't declared on time. They only become FA if they pass through either unclaimed.

Players can hold out, and/or go to another league/sport if they wish to try and hold a team hostage, but the team that picked them still retains their rights.
What if they dont declare for either?
If they've completed their NCAA eligibility, they're eligible to be drafted in the NFL Rookie Draft. Only have to declare if they're underclassmen.

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby clarion contrarion » Sat Apr 04, 2015 1:10 pm

why would any prospect do that you eliminating 31 potential employers and giving the team 100% of the negotiating power , no agent would ever set still for that type of arrangement for sure . Plus the league would drop the hammer on any franchise attempting that gambit.
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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby Swampdonkey17 » Sat Apr 04, 2015 8:16 pm

clarion contrarion wrote:why would any prospect do that you eliminating 31 potential employers and giving the team 100% of the negotiating power , no agent would ever set still for that type of arrangement for sure . Plus the league would drop the hammer on any franchise attempting that gambit.
DIdn't ask why would a player do it. I asked what's preventing it from happening
Journal of my first orphan rebuild. If you're in a rebuild and want to get ideas or give some, feel free.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=92442
QB: Andrew Luck,Andy Dalton, Brett Hundley, Trevor Siemian
RB: Lamar Miller, Eddie Lacy,Carlos Hyde,Dion Lewis, Mark Ingram, Thomas Rawls,Terrell Watson, Legarette Blount, Daniel Lasco, DJ Foster
WR: Deandre Hopkins,Alshon Jeffrey,Randall Cobb,Kelvin Benjamin,Jarvis Landry, Devante Parker, Tyrell Williams,
TE: Greg Olsen, Eric Ebron,Julius Thomas
D: Denver, Baltimore

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby DonBrazi » Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:05 am

Not sure, but I think money is a big factor. I feel like UDFA's have a much lower (limited) salary ceiling than drafted players. Would be interested to know whether my memory is correct.
Dredgers of Deliverance 10Team 34man 1QB, 3RB, 5WR, 2TE, 1Flex, 1Superflex: PPR
Luck, Mariota, Flacco, Bridgewater, Kelly
Ajayi, McCaffrey, Kamara, McKinnon, Javorius, Connor, Collins, Dixon, Damien Williams
Watkins, ARob, Cooper, Keenan, Pryor, White, Treadwell, Kupp, Lee, Gordon, Chad Williams, Switzer, Floyd
Hooper, Fiedorowicz, Maxx, Swoope, Allen
2018 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th

Still Thinking 12Team 24man: 1QB, 1RB, 1WR, 1TE, 4Flex, 1Superflex: .5/1/1.5 Tiered-PPR, 1-Round Devy league
ARod, Brees, Dalton, Teddy
Hyde, D.Murray, Rawls, McKinnon, Lynch, Powell, Gillislee, White, Javorius
Watkins, Hopkins, ODB, Jeffrey, White, Treadwell, Doctson, Pryor, Lee, DJackson
Kelce, Julius, Leggett
TS: St. Brown, Joe Williams, Switzer
2018 1st, 2nd, 2nd 3rd, 3rd, Devy

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby Swampdonkey17 » Sun Apr 05, 2015 2:42 am

DonBrazi wrote:Not sure, but I think money is a big factor. I feel like UDFA's have a much lower (limited) salary ceiling than drafted players. Would be interested to know whether my memory is correct.

This is an answer I was looking for I guess. Can a UDFA get a contract similar to say the 5th overall pick? Something in the CBA?

Look I know this story is far-fetched, it was a random mantown thought and question.
Journal of my first orphan rebuild. If you're in a rebuild and want to get ideas or give some, feel free.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=92442
QB: Andrew Luck,Andy Dalton, Brett Hundley, Trevor Siemian
RB: Lamar Miller, Eddie Lacy,Carlos Hyde,Dion Lewis, Mark Ingram, Thomas Rawls,Terrell Watson, Legarette Blount, Daniel Lasco, DJ Foster
WR: Deandre Hopkins,Alshon Jeffrey,Randall Cobb,Kelvin Benjamin,Jarvis Landry, Devante Parker, Tyrell Williams,
TE: Greg Olsen, Eric Ebron,Julius Thomas
D: Denver, Baltimore

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DonBrazi
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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby DonBrazi » Sun Apr 05, 2015 3:12 am

Sort of implied here: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... -new-deal/

Obviously, I don't know the details (like whether someone who doesn't declare for the draft counts as an UDFA), but it sure seems like there's a cap on guys who don't go through the motions.

Reminds me of Eli Manning's situation. He clearly didn't want to go to San Diego. Instead of opting out of the draft, he cried like a baby and threatened to not play for em. If he could have gone to any team he wanted AND made the same amount of money, I don't think he'd have gone through all the trouble to tarnish his [family's] image.
Dredgers of Deliverance 10Team 34man 1QB, 3RB, 5WR, 2TE, 1Flex, 1Superflex: PPR
Luck, Mariota, Flacco, Bridgewater, Kelly
Ajayi, McCaffrey, Kamara, McKinnon, Javorius, Connor, Collins, Dixon, Damien Williams
Watkins, ARob, Cooper, Keenan, Pryor, White, Treadwell, Kupp, Lee, Gordon, Chad Williams, Switzer, Floyd
Hooper, Fiedorowicz, Maxx, Swoope, Allen
2018 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th

Still Thinking 12Team 24man: 1QB, 1RB, 1WR, 1TE, 4Flex, 1Superflex: .5/1/1.5 Tiered-PPR, 1-Round Devy league
ARod, Brees, Dalton, Teddy
Hyde, D.Murray, Rawls, McKinnon, Lynch, Powell, Gillislee, White, Javorius
Watkins, Hopkins, ODB, Jeffrey, White, Treadwell, Doctson, Pryor, Lee, DJackson
Kelce, Julius, Leggett
TS: St. Brown, Joe Williams, Switzer
2018 1st, 2nd, 2nd 3rd, 3rd, Devy

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby dlf_jules » Mon Apr 06, 2015 1:43 pm

This article contains a couple stories about players (Bernie Kosar and Brian Bosworth) using the supplemental draft to circumvent the regular draft process.

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Re: What would prevent a rookie from..

Postby JasonNorin » Tue Apr 07, 2015 12:53 am

bigroddy wrote:The CBA prevents it. Players are eligible in the regular draft or the supplemental draft if they haven't declared on time. They only become FA if they pass through either unclaimed.

Players can hold out, and/or go to another league/sport if they wish to try and hold a team hostage, but the team that picked them still retains their rights.
I second this.. collective bargaining agreement will do the trick.


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