At this point, Thielen or Diggs?

[albedo1986]

It's been highly debated lately and it's obviously entirely dependent on age because the reality is Thielen has proven to be the better receiver but he's also had the time to fully develop whereas Diggs has not. The one thing that gives me pause on Diggs is not talent but the soft tissue injuries and how he NEVER seems to be able to play through them. Diggs made comments about it before the season, and how things were gonna be different this year but they've stayed the same...this isn't something you can ignore. People are wanting to call him the second coming of AB secondary to his extremely crisp routes and speed, and how he plays bigger than he actually is - but the huge separator for me is his injury issues.

[dblj1199]

This season Thielen with the season he is having, long term Diggs. The only thing that worries me about Diggs is he is always tweaked, but if he can stay healthy, get a consistent qb then he could take off.

[CharlieKelly]

Win now is Theilen.

For the future is Diggs.

Diggs is still the guy seeing top CB coverage on a weekly basis and he's an elite talent. Theilen's production can't be ignored and he's been phenomenal this year, but I still prefer Diggs simply from a talent perspective.

[Jaguars8907]

If I was trading for one I'd go with Thielen because I imagine he'd be cheaper.

[Never Veto1]

Honestly I don't like Diggs... but I think he's worth more on the market than Thielen. Diggs seems to miss a decent chunk of time every year. But we have no idea how Thielen will do once Teddy comes back.

Diggs seems to always be injured, even when he is playing and banged up you don't want to start him cause he'll lose you games.

[albedo1986]

Win now is Theilen.

For the future is Diggs.

Diggs is still the guy seeing top CB coverage on a weekly basis and he's an elite talent. Theilen's production can't be ignored and he's been phenomenal this year, but I still prefer Diggs simply from a talent perspective.

Just out of curiosity - where are you getting your CB coverage data?

[dazza]

Thielen is in the mold of Baldwin. Not physically, but in fantasy owners' perceptions.

This amused me a bit. I'm not saying it's wrong, but in every way other than fantasy perception (and there's some of that too) Diggs is a great Baldwin comp. In fact, if Diggs played more in the slot, they'd be hard to tell apart. And being a 5th round pick himself, it's not like Diggs has some great 'draft pedigree' advantage in fantasy perception

This year has set up almost perfectly for Thielen. From Diggs injuries to those of Bradford, Bridgewater, and even Cook it's really all conspired to make him a target vacuum working from the slot with a QB who doesn't really have the arm to push the ball downfield or to the outside. Thielen is a talented guy, but I don't think you can use this year as predictive for future seasons.

Diggs injuries scare me, but I think he's still the more talented receiver and the one to own if you're looking at more than just this year.

[boobam13]

If diggs is the more talented WR - won't he always see the top CB?

[albedo1986]

Thielen is in the mold of Baldwin. Not physically, but in fantasy owners' perceptions.

This amused me a bit. I'm not saying it's wrong, but in every way other than fantasy perception (and there's some of that too) Diggs is a great Baldwin comp. In fact, if Diggs played more in the slot, they'd be hard to tell apart. And being a 5th round pick himself, it's not like Diggs has some great 'draft pedigree' advantage in fantasy perception

This year has set up almost perfectly for Thielen. From Diggs injuries to those of Bradford, Bridgewater, and even Cook it's really all conspired to make him a target vacuum working from the slot with a QB who doesn't really have the arm to push the ball downfield or to the outside. Thielen is a talented guy, but I don't think you can use this year as predictive for future seasons.

Diggs injuries scare me, but I think he's still the more talented receiver and the one to own if you're looking at more than just this year.

If you do not think that the fantasy perception of Diggs is leagues ahead of Thielen you done lost your mind. Draft pedigree aside. And how in the world does Bradford and Bridgewater injuries somehow line up Thielen to be a target hog? Haha. Both Diggs and Thielen are fantastic talents and both share many similarities - it's why they've been able to swap roles from the slot to outside, back and forth. Both gain solid separation and have great QBRs when being targeted, it's a huge part of why this offense is flowing so well, mixed with a solid O line.

Thielen just signed a 4 year 19mil contract - he's not going anywhere for quite some time barring some radical change. The thing that worries me about Thielen isn't even his age, it's actually Bridgewater. Teddy is a fun QB but he's not a gunslinger - and it makes me worried that the offense may get more conservative with him under center instead of Keenum who's throwing money throws all over the place.

[lukkynumber13]

Honestly I would still for sure rather have Diggs, but that's not at ALL a slight against Thielen. I think they're both ballers. But I do believe Diggs has more sheer talent, and he's 3 years younger. I'm no age-ist, but that's enough to solidify an opinion on a player. But again, I am not knocking Thielen one bit. I've been one of his biggest fanboys on here. This is like comparing Amari Cooper to TY Hilton.

[lukkynumber13]

Thielen is in the mold of Baldwin. Not physically, but in fantasy owners' perceptions.

This amused me a bit. I'm not saying it's wrong, but in every way other than fantasy perception (and there's some of that too) Diggs is a great Baldwin comp. In fact, if Diggs played more in the slot, they'd be hard to tell apart. And being a 5th round pick himself, it's not like Diggs has some great 'draft pedigree' advantage in fantasy perception

This year has set up almost perfectly for Thielen. From Diggs injuries to those of Bradford, Bridgewater, and even Cook it's really all conspired to make him a target vacuum working from the slot with a QB who doesn't really have the arm to push the ball downfield or to the outside. Thielen is a talented guy, but I don't think you can use this year as predictive for future seasons.

Diggs injuries scare me, but I think he's still the more talented receiver and the one to own if you're looking at more than just this year.

Wrong. Thielen plays from the slot a ton, but just like Doug Baldwin, he is a downfield receiver MUCH of the time. This isn't a Jack Doyle situation, where an inexperienced QB is just constantly checking down to a big body, and giving that big body 6 catches for 40 yards. Thielen is a fairly-big, fast, crisp route-runner with great hands. I said it before, he reminds me of a taller Jeremy Maclin in Maclin's prime (And for the new kids around here, that's a complement).

[dazza]

If you do not think that the fantasy perception of Diggs is leagues ahead of Thielen you done lost your mind. Draft pedigree aside. And how in the world does Bradford and Bridgewater injuries somehow line up Thielen to be a target hog? Haha. Both Diggs and Thielen are fantastic talents and both share many similarities - it's why they've been able to swap roles from the slot to outside, back and forth. Both gain solid separation and have great QBRs when being targeted, it's a huge part of why this offense is flowing so well, mixed with a solid O line.

Thielen just signed a 4 year 19mil contract - he's not going anywhere for quite some time barring some radical change. The thing that worries me about Thielen isn't even his age, it's actually Bridgewater. Teddy is a fun QB but he's not a gunslinger - and it makes me worried that the offense may get more conservative with him under center instead of Keenum who's throwing money throws all over the place.

The reason the injuries affect targets is that Thielen has been playing a ton in the slot, and Keenum's lack of arm strength means he's always going to prefer those routes to throwing outside or down the field. If you don't think Bradford going out affected the performance of these two, then you, sir (ma'am?), done lost your mind. Bridgewater is more of an unknown, but since he was playing with Peterson behind some pretty bad offensive lines throwing to washed up Jennings and Rookie Diggs (leading WRs in 14 and 15) I'd say it's rather unfair to compare his play then to Keenum's now.

Some 2017 numbers from player profile:

..................Th.......Di
Slot% ........48.6 ...9.3
Air y/c.........6.6 ...7.7
Targets/g.....9.6 ... 6.6
QBR to WR...106.1...130.4
Catch Rate....64.6 ...66.0
Contested CR 58.8....90.9
Catchable tar % 79....66
Fantasy pts/tar 1.78...2.22

None of this is a knock on Thielen's talent, as he obviously has enough to produce at a high level. But he's more heavily targeted, been targeted on shorter passes, has a higher quality of targets, and is less efficient with those targets than Diggs is with his. If not for the entire offense, including the QB position, being decimated by injuries, Thielen may well not be getting the target share or putting up the numbers he is.

As for fantasy perception, it would appear from this thread that Diggs is not 'leagues ahead' at all, but rather there seems to be a fairly even split.

[onetwothree]

Wasn't Diggs putting up similar numbers as the primary slot guy last season to what Thielen is doing this year?

The Vikes moved Diggs to the outside so they could increase their big play opportunities. That was the buzz all preseason. How a team lines up their players says a good deal about how they view them.

Saying you prefer one over the other is not a dismissal of the other. 1 and 1A is a nice problem to have.

[albedo1986]

If you do not think that the fantasy perception of Diggs is leagues ahead of Thielen you done lost your mind. Draft pedigree aside. And how in the world does Bradford and Bridgewater injuries somehow line up Thielen to be a target hog? Haha. Both Diggs and Thielen are fantastic talents and both share many similarities - it's why they've been able to swap roles from the slot to outside, back and forth. Both gain solid separation and have great QBRs when being targeted, it's a huge part of why this offense is flowing so well, mixed with a solid O line.

Thielen just signed a 4 year 19mil contract - he's not going anywhere for quite some time barring some radical change. The thing that worries me about Thielen isn't even his age, it's actually Bridgewater. Teddy is a fun QB but he's not a gunslinger - and it makes me worried that the offense may get more conservative with him under center instead of Keenum who's throwing money throws all over the place.

The reason the injuries affect targets is that Thielen has been playing a ton in the slot, and Keenum's lack of arm strength means he's always going to prefer those routes to throwing outside or down the field. If you don't think Bradford going out affected the performance of these two, then you, sir (ma'am?), done lost your mind. Bridgewater is more of an unknown, but since he was playing with Peterson behind some pretty bad offensive lines throwing to washed up Jennings and Rookie Diggs (leading WRs in 14 and 15) I'd say it's rather unfair to compare his play then to Keenum's now.

Some 2017 numbers from player profile:

..................Th.......Di
Slot% ........48.6 ...9.3
Air y/c.........6.6 ...7.7
Targets/g.....9.6 ... 6.6
QBR to WR...106.1...130.4
Catch Rate....64.6 ...66.0
Contested CR 58.8....90.9
Catchable tar % 79....66
Fantasy pts/tar 1.78...2.22

None of this is a knock on Thielen's talent, as he obviously has enough to produce at a high level. But he's more heavily targeted, been targeted on shorter passes, has a higher quality of targets, and is less efficient with those targets than Diggs is with his. If not for the entire offense, including the QB position, being decimated by injuries, Thielen may well not be getting the target share or putting up the numbers he is.

As for fantasy perception, it would appear from this thread that Diggs is not 'leagues ahead' at all, but rather there seems to be a fairly even split.

Are you trying to say that Case Keenum is not a gunslinger? I love Bradford, and he was showing flashes of this but Case has been doing it non stop. He's almost DGAFing and somehow leading them to the playoffs. Where the hell are you getting your throw velocity data?

Go make an offer of Adam for Diggs and tell me what happens.

[Dusticlez1]

Thelin for now in a playoff push. Diggs in all other scenarios. Diggs is the younger, more talented WR. Thelin and Keenum are just clicking at the moment tho.