Week XV Discussion

[Shcritters]

I need another year on him, like I stated earlier we have seen this 1000 times before, flash in the pan young Qbs. Im gonna wait, until then im sticking with what I see and that's a guy who makes some dumb decisions and at the NFL level they will come back to haunt him some day. Not gonna anoint him the greatest of all time.

Could you please list out those 1000 times we’ve seen this before? Thanks!

[Patsfan86]

I don't think KC's system taught Mahomes how to make no-look passes.

Dumb plays like that are begging to be picked off at the NFL level. That’s my whole point. So many want to love this guy for plays like that but it was a dumb play, it worked but at the NFL level that’s a stupid decision. He makes some dumb decisions but they have been working out so no one wants to criticize. Eventually they will stop working out, he will throw 4 picks in a game and regress. Idk why I’m on an island here, in this forum I am but when talking to actual people I’m not. I think it’s the fact this is a fantasy forum and that’s obviously all people are focusing on, and for fantasy he has been great and I can’t argue that. But in real life he will implode, prob in the NFL playoffs but no one on here will care since it won’t effect their dynasty teams.

Sounds like someone is having trouble coping with the end of the Brady/Belicheat era. You guys should have a smooth transition to the Tyrod/McDaniels era, while Mahomes plays Darnold in the AFC championship game 11 of the next 12 years.

What does me being a Pats fan have anything to do with any of this? Man people are obsessed with them, it’s funny. First of all I easily could have lied and said I’m not a pats fan just to avoid this. This is what we get from all the losers out there any time we identify ourselves as a Pats fan. It’s easier sometimes to lie about it. What is your obsession with them? Please let me know?

[Patsfan86]

I need another year on him, like I stated earlier we have seen this 1000 times before, flash in the pan young Qbs. Im gonna wait, until then im sticking with what I see and that's a guy who makes some dumb decisions and at the NFL level they will come back to haunt him some day. Not gonna anoint him the greatest of all time.

Could you please list out those 1000 times we’ve seen this before? Thanks!

Nice job taking this quote literally, you know what I meant, we have seen QBs play very well their first year or a year and then disentegrate. RG3 and Derek Carr come to mind. You can say RG3 was all about injuries but he has had plenty of times to come back and hasn’t been able to. I’ll throw Kaep In as well, he has been blackballed now but he fell off well before being blackballed after a great year leading his team to a super bowl. Other names too over the entire history of the NFL. Let’s not act like a one year wonder QB doesn’t exist. And also let’s not act like my argument is totally insane. It’s much more rational to say “ i don’t tbink this guy is that good let’s give him some time before we anoint him” than it is to say “let’s get this guy in the hall of fame already after not playing a full season” I honestly haven’t seen an actual argument against mine, all it’s been is throwing in meaningless jabs at the Pats, or even more meaningless comments like this. I understand I’m looking at things rationally in the very irrational landscape of dynasty fantasy football. It seems many of you don’t understand the rational piece I know some do though.

[Patsfan86]

And I’ll just throw In that this NFL season has been a statistical anomaly throughout for many teams. Stats are thru the roof for everyone. That’s another reason I really do not want to go by this one season to anoint him. Also add in this system and these players made Alex Smith look great. I just don’t think Mahomes is all that great and is really overhyped. We will see.

[problemsolver]

The delusion in this thread is strong.

As a fellow Pats fan who has spent far too much of his life trying to debunk the argument that Tom Brady is a creation of The Patented Belichick System, please stop insinuating that Pat Mahomes is somehow less of a QB because he is the creation of The Patented But Largely Less Effective Andy Reid System. Coaches try to put players in position to succeed AKA a "system" , and players try to execute that "system". On every single team.

Mahomes arm talent is undeniable. He can do things that only a handful of people ever have been able to do. Whether he continues with his early career success really doesn't have as much to do with his physical talent or who his coach is as it does with how he deals with being a superstar. What makes Tom Brady Tom F'ing Brady is his ability to block out the distractions of being Tom Brady and singularly focus on football, even after almost 20 years. Trying to predict whether Mahomes will be able to do that is an exercise in futility. Growing up the son of a MLB pitcher makes me think he will, but you never know. I mean as a Pats fan, I hope he doesnt. But I'm not holding my breath.

[Patsfan86]

But what also makes Brady great is usuallly not making the wrong decision even when he was young. From what I’ve seen with Mahomes is he has made mistakes and gotten away with them. And 9 times out of 10 you can’t sustain getting away with mistakes. To me a no look pass in the NFL is trickery and a mistake, way too risky. I saw a lot of things happen that could have easily gone the other way for him Thursday night and they didn’t win in the end. Could this guy be the next Aaron Rodgers like seemingly everyone here and around the league wants him to be? Yes he can. Is he now? Hell no.

[captain howdy]

You are arguing a straw man, weknownothing.

Nobody is comparing mahomes body of work to Brady's...or saying Mahomes is a GOAT. NO ONE.

Yet here you are basically attacking that premise.

What is posited, is that Mahomes stats this year are incredible, and that he has a high ceiling due to his offensive system, offensive personnel, age and projected growth, and clear leadership intangibles.

Do you disagree with those things?

To "prove" your point that he isn't that great, you posit that he isn't perfect; that he "makes mistakes and gets away with them". No one said he was perfect, but in the NFL, very very few starting QBs are without an issue or even several issues.

Compared to the field, he stands out. Against the backdrop of this statistically anomolous season..he STILL stands out. So that argument does not hold water either...does it?

[Patsfan86]

Someone made a Brett Favre comparison and that’s far more accurate of what he is. Favre was obviously a first ballot HOFer easily but he would make some throws where you thought “WTF?” That’s what I envision Mahomes peak at with more athleticism but again we will see. Until then I’m not buying the hype and I don’t get why everyone is so vehemently opposed to what I’m saying. My pats fandom somehow got brought into this and it all got derailed from there.

[Patsfan86]

You are arguing a straw man, weknownothing.

Nobody is comparing mahomes body of work to Brady's...or saying Mahomes is a GOAT. NO ONE.

Yet here you are basically attacking that premise.

What is posited, is that Mahomes stats this year are incredible, and that he has a high ceiling due to his offensive system, offensive personnel, age and projected growth, and clear leadership intangibles.

Do you disagree with those things?

To "prove" your point that he isn't that great, you posit that he isn't perfect; that he "makes mistakes and gets away with them". No one said he was perfect, but in the NFL, very very few starting QBs are without an issue or even several issues.

Compared to the field, he stands out. Against the backdrop of this statistically anomolous season..he STILL stands out. So that argument does not hold water either...does it?

The problem I’m having is I’m making this argument in a fantasy football forum where stats are all that matters. The other problem I had was the way I made my statement saying I can’t wait until he implodes, that was venomous so I get the reaction. Anyway Intangibles like decision making don’t count towards fantasy star sheets, if you are going to just point to stats than of course you win the argument. But I’m talking about real life Qbing which is ton more than just stats, and I believe I started out saying I’m talking about real life. I made the mistake of bringing up Brady and that turned somehow into a ridiculous jealousy jab and blah blah.I understand no one is comparing them at all. But people are overhyping Mahomes and choosing to just look at Stat sheets and not what they see on the field. And again from what I see on the field I see a guy who is much more of a gunslinger than people seem to be pointing out. And one day that will bite him.

[Valhalla]

I don't think KC's system taught Mahomes how to make no-look passes.

Dumb plays like that are begging to be picked off at the NFL level. That’s my whole point. So many want to love this guy for plays like that but it was a dumb play, it worked but at the NFL level that’s a stupid decision. He makes some dumb decisions but they have been working out so no one wants to criticize. Eventually they will stop working out, he will throw 4 picks in a game and regress. Idk why I’m on an island here, in this forum I am but when talking to actual people I’m not. I think it’s the fact this is a fantasy forum and that’s obviously all people are focusing on, and for fantasy he has been great and I can’t argue that. But in real life he will implode, prob in the NFL playoffs but no one on here will care since it won’t effect their dynasty teams.

Sounds like someone is having trouble coping with the end of the Brady/Belicheat era. You guys should have a smooth transition to the Tyrod/McDaniels era, while Mahomes plays Darnold in the AFC championship game 11 of the next 12 years.

Possibly...if Darnold is backing up Mayfield. Even I don’t think he’ll lose his job THAT quickly, though...

[Pullo Vision]

Weknow, should read this- viewtopic.php?f=5&t=169653

[problemsolver]

LOL at Rich Eisen comparing Mike Irving to Lou Holtz for hyping up the Cowboys future opponents.

[Patsfan86]

Time for me to admit it. This has all been a troll job, i am Turcorox other account

[pokerface40]

Can we get things back on track?! I need a monster game from Nuk here to make up for Keenan Allen's big zero.

[Rosenbluu]

Can we get things back on track?! I need a monster game from Nuk here to make up for Keenan Allen's big zero.

I would say he is delivering so far, I need it to continue into the 2nd half as well