Week VI Discussion Thread

General talk about Dynasty Leagues.
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Friction
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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Friction » Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:47 am

Man, Pack lost a win/gained a tie (literally,it was a game ending play) with a horrid call and now gained a continuation of a drive (far from a guaranteed win at that point) due to a bad call. These things tend to even themselves out for most teams over the course of a season. I think the NFL has terrible rules and my interest would be very minor without fantasy/gambling/profiting. I think at the end of a season most teams can point to many calls that went for or against them in crucial situations.
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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Valhalla » Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:55 am

Lotto4Life wrote: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:25 am
Valhalla wrote: Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:40 pm
Pullo Vision wrote: Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:57 pm Yes, exactly, DONT score, at least not immediately. Run up to the 1 yard line and run/jog parallel to the goaline. If the defense nearly gets you, take the short hop into the endzone. Bleed as much time off the clock, even if it's only 15 seconds.

If you want to be real aggressive, allow yourself to be tackled at the one and take the 4 downs to get the touchdown. KC had 2 timeouts if I remember right.
15 seconds off the clock running around the goal line? Is this TechmoBowl?
Well, it IS Tyreek Hill.
Fair point...
I wonder if Tyreek can just run around the entire field over and over again for an entire quarter and then trot in for the TD after the time expires...

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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Pullo Vision » Tue Oct 16, 2018 5:01 pm

Glad ppl saw the "tecmobowl" joke. Hint- that's sarcasm.

I can't blame a WR for not scoring a TD. He sees open space, he goes, as he's trained and practiced. I certainly wouldn't expect a person who's displayed the lack self control Hill has by striking another who pissed him off to evaluate his actions real time and realize scoring a TD that quickly is playing right into the enemy's hands.

I also wouldn't expect such a young QB coming from the college program he did to do anything but score as quickly as possible.

The real fault lies with Andy Reid for failing to prepare his team for an extended drive and bleed the clock. Bleed the clock, burn, run it the f down. A more aware coach would've realized he gave Brady the ball with three minutes and a tied game... and facepalmed.

Instead, he probably gloated to himself internally and was happy to see if Brady could drive them into scoring range, like some seem to here. With that defense, and that coach, that's like wondering if a samurai could slice through a piece of paper.

If it were the Rams or Jaguars defense (with all the questions they have right now) against Brady, I'd take that gamble. If it were the KC defense against Baltimore offense, I take that gamble. Instead, it was the worst possible combo- and Reid failed to foresee and plan for that.

Hill could've dropped at the 1 yard line and waited for a defender to down him. Yes, the idea that KC's offense could score a TD from the 1 yard line if given 4 chances against that defense is a gamble. But, I would much, much, much rather take that gamble than bank on my Swiss cheese stopping belicheck/brady for 3 minutes. Worst case scenario, turn over on downs, NE has the ball at the one. Now, whether you choose to blitz or bring pressure, versus playing two safeties deep would be an interesting discussion.

Flip side, NE is defending KC's TD drive to tie the game with 3:17 left. Defense goes single high safety to bring the pressure. Either they get home and force a long 2nd down or the offense exploits the weak downfield defense and scores a quick TD. As the Patriots, you're fine with the result- you create an apparent weakness, bait them to fall for your trap, then spring it. Just like that, NE has what they want- the ball against that bad defense with 3 minutes in a tied game with a bucket of time outs.

I'm surprised people don't understand you drain the clock as much as you can, however you can, even if that means running s l o w e r to the inevitable TD, or doing something stupid like, I don't know, running at an angle to the end zone, not directly. But, this is just a fantasy forum, not real football. Others seem to understand.

Reid failed to manage the end of the game well- coaching players, using timeouts, calling the right plays, all of it.

Mahomes, Hill and Hunt may be awesome for fantasy, but I question how far they'll go into the playoffs with that coach.
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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Jigga94 » Tue Oct 16, 2018 5:09 pm

You need help

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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Pullo Vision » Tue Oct 16, 2018 5:28 pm

Jigga94 wrote: Tue Oct 16, 2018 5:09 pm You need help
I'm looking to have a reasoned discussion about this. I've said what I think. I'm willing to listen to what you say and even consider I might be wrong (gasp!), but you need to do the same.

If you're not willing to truly listen and entertain the idea you're wrong, don't bother posting. You're of no use here.
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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Jigga94 » Tue Oct 16, 2018 5:45 pm

Nice edit... You suggest running at the endzone at a different angle would've made a difference. Its funny. Nothing was stopping TB with 3 mins left, 2 mins left, 1 min left. Hell he would be done it in 30 seconds with that Chiefs defense. They needed a TD and they got it. That's the offenses job. You cant seriously blame the fastest player on the field for scoring a TD and blame it on the fact that he got in an altercation in the past.

Sure in a perfect world (maybe Madden or Tecmo for that bunch) you go down and score with 0:00. What happens when its 4th and 5 with one play remaining and you dont get it? Tyreek would be criticized endlessly. His job is to score TD. The defenses job is to... stop the offense... gasp. Someone give me a head coaching job since Reid is so bad apparently.

I dont know why I'm bothering here. This argument is pointless and we obviously dont agree. Go play your video games

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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Lotto4Life » Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:22 pm

Jigga94 wrote: Tue Oct 16, 2018 5:45 pm Sure in a perfect world (maybe Madden or Tecmo for that bunch) you go down and score with 0:00. What happens when its 4th and 5 with one play remaining and you dont get it? Tyreek would be criticized endlessly. His job is to score TD. The defenses job is to... stop the offense... gasp. Someone give me a head coaching job since Reid is so bad apparently.
This is basically my question. At what point do you decide to score? Does it require you getting to 4th down?

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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Pullo Vision » Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:38 pm

Yeah, toned it down to see if you could either effectively respond to my position, or put your position forward effectively. Nope and nope. You countered minor points I said, but not the core argument. He knocked some leaves around, but the tree stands. Random guy at a bar did a better job. No issue if you don't care and think it's pointless.

Yeah, if you pass on the easy TD to drain the clock and fail to score, the player and coach will be blasted all week. If you're the coach, you take all the flak when meeting the press and tell the player privately it wasn't his fault but yours. It all comes down to intestinal fortitude.

Belicheck executed it perfectly, but Reid didn't. Given their careers, not a surprise. With the Patriots having 3 timeouts and the 2 minute warning, 1 minute left would've been more feasible.

Given the two teams, I'd rather put my better unit on the field, exposing their worse unit, rather than the reverse and falling for an easily avoidable trap.
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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Pullo Vision » Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:42 pm

Lotto4Life wrote: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:22 pm
Jigga94 wrote: Tue Oct 16, 2018 5:45 pm Sure in a perfect world (maybe Madden or Tecmo for that bunch) you go down and score with 0:00. What happens when its 4th and 5 with one play remaining and you dont get it? Tyreek would be criticized endlessly. His job is to score TD. The defenses job is to... stop the offense... gasp. Someone give me a head coaching job since Reid is so bad apparently.
This is basically my question. At what point do you decide to score? Does it require you getting to 4th down?
Yes, that's a fun mental exercise. What plays do you call, how do they defend, all interesting aspects. If KC eeks the clock, when does NE start using their timeouts to save time.

If NE gets the ball with, say 1 timeout and 1:30 on the clock at their 25, how do they try to move into field goal range?
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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Jigga94 » Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:50 pm

Its all good. You're in your own little world buddy. Good luck in your next coaching gig. Don't confuse the 7 year olds too much

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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Pullo Vision » Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:02 pm

No problems. You've been right sometimes, but the other times you've disagreed with me. You're position isn't hard to understand, but it's the checkers version of what happens in the NFL.

Valhalla just saw your joke about Hill running around all over the place. He'd just have to remember not to run backwards, cause that'd make time go in reverse.
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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby FantasyFreak » Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:47 pm

Not a fan of Burfict, but Roethlisberger is a clown. Talks trash about a guy on his own team in a contract dispute, and then when A MLB hits AB coming across the middle a points to JuJu and says "you're next", Ben whines to the media about it and says it's uncalled for. He really likes using the media these days, and not in a way that will gain respect from anyone. Leave it on the field, Juju laid out Burfict last year, of course he's going to say stuff like that in the midst of a bitter AFC North divisional game. Hope this guy retires soon, he's become such a joke off the field......uh well, I guess he always was, but now he's turning into a whiner.
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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby kmbryant09 » Thu Oct 18, 2018 7:43 am

Pullo Vision wrote: Tue Oct 16, 2018 5:01 pm Glad ppl saw the "tecmobowl" joke. Hint- that's sarcasm.

I can't blame a WR for not scoring a TD. He sees open space, he goes, as he's trained and practiced. I certainly wouldn't expect a person who's displayed the lack self control Hill has by striking another who pissed him off to evaluate his actions real time and realize scoring a TD that quickly is playing right into the enemy's hands.

I also wouldn't expect such a young QB coming from the college program he did to do anything but score as quickly as possible.

The real fault lies with Andy Reid for failing to prepare his team for an extended drive and bleed the clock. Bleed the clock, burn, run it the f down. A more aware coach would've realized he gave Brady the ball with three minutes and a tied game... and facepalmed.

Instead, he probably gloated to himself internally and was happy to see if Brady could drive them into scoring range, like some seem to here. With that defense, and that coach, that's like wondering if a samurai could slice through a piece of paper.

If it were the Rams or Jaguars defense (with all the questions they have right now) against Brady, I'd take that gamble. If it were the KC defense against Baltimore offense, I take that gamble. Instead, it was the worst possible combo- and Reid failed to foresee and plan for that.

Hill could've dropped at the 1 yard line and waited for a defender to down him. Yes, the idea that KC's offense could score a TD from the 1 yard line if given 4 chances against that defense is a gamble. But, I would much, much, much rather take that gamble than bank on my Swiss cheese stopping belicheck/brady for 3 minutes. Worst case scenario, turn over on downs, NE has the ball at the one. Now, whether you choose to blitz or bring pressure, versus playing two safeties deep would be an interesting discussion.

Flip side, NE is defending KC's TD drive to tie the game with 3:17 left. Defense goes single high safety to bring the pressure. Either they get home and force a long 2nd down or the offense exploits the weak downfield defense and scores a quick TD. As the Patriots, you're fine with the result- you create an apparent weakness, bait them to fall for your trap, then spring it. Just like that, NE has what they want- the ball against that bad defense with 3 minutes in a tied game with a bucket of time outs.

I'm surprised people don't understand you drain the clock as much as you can, however you can, even if that means running s l o w e r to the inevitable TD, or doing something stupid like, I don't know, running at an angle to the end zone, not directly. But, this is just a fantasy forum, not real football. Others seem to understand.

Reid failed to manage the end of the game well- coaching players, using timeouts, calling the right plays, all of it.

Mahomes, Hill and Hunt may be awesome for fantasy, but I question how far they'll go into the playoffs with that coach.
The Touchdown came with more than 3:00 minutes left on the clock. Even if Hill took a knee at the 1. Even if they ran 4 more plays. Even if they scored on 4th down to tie the game. THEY STILL WOULD HAVE GIVEN BRADY / PATS THE BALL WITH 1:50 remaining!

Considering the Patriots' game winning drive put them in field goal position in 2:20 time of possession - including 2 running plays - what makes you think the Chiefs would have stopped them?

I get the argument if you can totally prevent giving the ball back to New England. But considering the major risk of NOT SCORING after asking Hill to take a knee at the 1 - it's not worth it just to give the ball to Brady with 1:50 instead of 3:00 remaining.
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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Gtdano_14 » Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:19 am

^ Yeah, not scoring there is a ridiculous idea with that much time left.
The next night, the Packers went 10 plays 81 yards in 1:07 (zero timeouts I believe) to win the game with no time left.
If anything, it's good Hill scored right away to maybe give the Chiefs one more shot if the Patriots scored quick enough.
Baseless argument.
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Re: Week VI Discussion Thread

Postby Pullo Vision » Fri Oct 19, 2018 3:48 pm

kmbryant09 wrote: Thu Oct 18, 2018 7:43 am
Pullo Vision wrote: Tue Oct 16, 2018 5:01 pm Hill could've dropped at the 1 yard line and waited for a defender to down him. Yes, the idea that KC's offense could score a TD from the 1 yard line if given 4 chances against that defense is a gamble. But, I would much, much, much rather take that gamble than bank on my Swiss cheese stopping belicheck/brady for 3 minutes. Worst case scenario, turn over on downs, NE has the ball at the one. Now, whether you choose to blitz or bring pressure, versus playing two safeties deep would be an interesting discussion.
The Touchdown came with more than 3:00 minutes left on the clock. Even if Hill took a knee at the 1. Even if they ran 4 more plays. Even if they scored on 4th down to tie the game. THEY STILL WOULD HAVE GIVEN BRADY / PATS THE BALL WITH 1:50 remaining!

Considering the Patriots' game winning drive put them in field goal position in 2:20 time of possession - including 2 running plays - what makes you think the Chiefs would have stopped them?

I get the argument if you can totally prevent giving the ball back to New England. But considering the major risk of NOT SCORING after asking Hill to take a knee at the 1 - it's not worth it just to give the ball to Brady with 1:50 instead of 3:00 remaining.
This is a better argument. With NE holding their full complement of TOs and the 2 minute warning, the Chiefs wouldn't have been able to shave much time off the clock. Even if it were 1:50 left when NE got the ball, that still would've been preferable than 303.

Yes, sitting at the 1 might be unconventional, ballsy, and could blow up in your face. I'd rather make a risky attack and fail rather than fall victim to completely foreseeable events- NE gets the ball, mixing in runs and passes to drive into field goal range and giving KC little/no time to score.

Let's rewind this and look at it at the beginning of the drive- 3:17 left in the fourth, KC has the ball on their own 25 down by 7 with 1 TO. NE has three. Do you march downfield methodically, burning clocking and forcing NE to use timeouts in the hope there's time left for them to get downfield? Or, do you strike quick and hope your low-ranked defense can stop a HOFer?

Andy Reid failed to execute properly at the end, giving Tom f*n Brady the ball with too much time. But, poor end-game execution and burning too many TOs has been normal for him.
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