Victory Points and bad outcomes

[Cult of Dionysus]

So in DLF Premium League we use Victory Points to determine playoff participants. And a 10-3 team with 37 VPs and with 1422 starter points lost out on the 2nd Wildcard spot to an 8-5 team with 38 VPs and with 1402 starter points.

I was willing to give VPs a try, but this is just untenable.

League Link: http://www57.myfantasyleague.com/2017/home/15795#0

[sloth8u]

This happens sometimes. The guy scoring 38 bps obviously performed better from week to week. They made up significant ground based off of weekly scoring

[Tsunami]

All 5 losses for the 8-5 team came to teams that finished 10-3. Meanwhile, the 10-3 team had a loss in week 2 to a team that finished 2-11. That is probably a large part of the explanation. Considering the 10-3 team beat the 8-5 team directly in a head-to-head matchup I don't think this method makes much sense, but I'm guessing that is how it works.

[sloth8u]

He took the two zero's, that's what cost him. The other guy had none. The team who made it was better from week to week. Racking up mostly 2 pts while our unfortunate owner was mixing in 1 & 2 pts...but the zero's killed him.

[BigBawseRoss]

wtf is a victory point

[FiremanEd]

It isn’t necessarily a ‘bad outcome’, it’s just a different outcome. VP scoring is intended to reward teams that perform stronger over the course of the entire season, not just win against bottom scoring teams with the 2nd bottom scoring, and provide some performance reward to teams that lose with the 2nd highest score to the top scoring team, and similar scenarios. I’m sure if you dive into how the outcome came up it would make more sense.

I don’t use VP in any of my leagues, but flaws can be found in those setups too, such as the scenarios I stated above. That said, maybe VP isn’t for you and you move on. Won’t remove all ‘bad outcomes’ in your fantasy football lifetime though.

[sloth8u]

wtf is a victory point

if you play at mfl, you can track this in your league. reports>>standings>>victory point summary.

its another way to track standings that incorporates how each franchise scores on a week to week basis amongst all leaguemates rather than just who wins or loses each matchup. how did you fair amongst the entire league when it comes to weekly scoring. a certain number of points are awarded for getting the w, and then it typically divides into 1/3's on rewarding for scoring. top receives 2, middle third receives 1, bottom third 0.

you can scrore a win 3,2, or 1. if you want a win to mean more...score it as 3, if you want weekly scoring to matter more, score wins as 1. then 2 is the middle ground. .

ive had this happen to me a few times and saw it a few other times. it happens cult, but you have to realize how much ground he made up on a week to week basis to overcome the 2 losses. the yearly total really isnt suprising. its really close through this many games. my guess is.....the unlucky owner held all tie breaks. the guy receiving the playoff birth overcame a major deficit (imo) in wins, scored highly on a week to week basis and deserves the spot just aswell.

i would not sour on the format based off this instance. would you feel the same if it were only 1 win difference instead of 2? likely not. he is just as deserving based off your standings.

i see a guy win scoring 80 all the time, while im scoring 150 and losing......arguing that he had a better week is where these standings come in to play.

[heyfeefellskee]

The whole purpose of victory points was to reduce randomness and volatility. VP's are awarded for wins as well as having a top % total each week. Obviously, the 10-3 team has more wins, but the 8-5 team has had more weeks with higher scoring. If we were trying to determine the stronger team, VPs would be a much better indicator than overall record. For this reason, the team with the higher VP's makes the playoffs. Sucks for everyone used to overall record but that's what we agreed to 3 years ago.

[Needalife]

I moved away from VP system a while ago for All Play Record. We break ties by overall record, then All Play Record, then overall points and it has really worked well. It rewards consistent play over the course of a season and every week matters.

[Rasorin]

No scoring system is perfect. That said I much prefer VP system. This year we have a team that is 8-5 but has the 3 lowest points scored. In a typical scoring system he would be in second place ready to make the playoffs but in a VP system he is in 4th place and a much more deserving team is in.

[mratlanta]

I think things like victory points make leagues overly complex and cause this type of argument. Either go straight H2H and deal with the fact that the "best" teams may not always finish on top due to bad matchups or have a points league where it's all about total stats.

[Cult of Dionysus]

Just a little hard for me to swallow a two win swing in a 13 week regular season.

[Generic Username]

Joined a 14-team league this past off season that uses VP as main standings tiebreaker, my first experience with this method. Under normal Overall Record settings, my team would've finished 10th. With the VP system, it's 13th.

I still prefer classic Overall Record as a means to determine rankings, but I now think this VP stuff is a better secondary tiebreaker for wildcard spots than Total Points or H2H

[grooner]

This is literally the point of VP's, to not make the W-L record all that matters. This gives teams who score high on a weekly basis but still lose, the chance to make the playoffs.

I personally don't like VP's, and like the randomness of head to head. I know many don't because their team was "the better" team and didn't make the playoffs., but that is what makes fantasy football fun for me.

I don't really get complaining about this, when this is what VP's are intended to do.

[ajmyk]

Like I said in our discussions and like other said here, the fact than a 8-5 team managed to end with more VP's than a 10-3 team, even though that half the VP are based on W-L, means that's the 8-5 team was way better and was much less lucky with the schedule this season.

The Win Loss record in league where you only play one game a week is a very bad indicator of how the team is performing, and schedule play a big random role.

But on the other hand winning and losing weekly matchups is what make this game fun and that's why we like this system.

All-Play records or Total Points would be way more fair, but those are only a long term competition, if you play that way you will never enter MNF needing one player to outscore another one by X points and watching the game on the edge. It's not fun at all.

VP's are meant to be in-between, on one hand matchup matter, on the other the random volatility is tremendously reduced.