Crowell

[Friction]

Sold him for Fournette in the off season. Well, #2 pick, but it was well known Davis was going first.

[Phaded]

I will be honest.
Never understood what people saw in him.

[moishetreats]

I've said it before but I think it's worth repeating. Crowell is a bum. Besides the fact that his "highlights" are nothing more than a few long runs through wide open holes in the defense, his numbers are straight garbage. Here are some stats for games over the last 2 seasons (not including 2017):

10 rushes 20 yards, 11r 32y, 8r 9y, 10r 14y, 6r -5y, 7r 7y, 9r 23y, 13r 22y, 9r 16y, 11r 29y, 6r 4y, 9r 23y, 8r 10y, 8r 28y, 16r 44y, 10r 38y.

Look at that, I pulled a 16-game sample of games out of the last 2 years for Crowell. Wow what a stud. I dare you to find me a worse looking 16-game set of stats from another RB in the league.

Awful argument. You can similarly find at least 13 games over the past 32 where Crowell was great. The belief in him was that he would have fewer duds. He has easily had enough fantastic games to prove that he CAN do it; consistency was always his issue.

Another reason this is a flawed argument.

PLAYER B: 10-18, 12-25, 12-12, 14-27, 12-40, 25-56, 11-20, 12-40, 15-58, 11-35, 16-60, 15-56, 6-6, 12-37, 18-58 (16 duds in the past 34 games)

PLAYER C: 17-41, 11-16, 18-68, 10-29, 16-58, 8-11, 5-33, 12-27, 5-10, 12-9, 14-21 (11/31)

PLAYER D: 14-51, 14-51, 12-38, 14-42, 7-29, 7-29, 18-54, 11-31, 15-37, 14-35, 15-41, 16-35, 19-36, 22-68, 3-5, 18-54, 9-13, 10-22 (18/31)

PLAYER E: 6-9, 12-45, 25-66, 9-19, 9-41, 21-48, 17-47, 19-51, 19-33, 13-50, 11-38, 14-38, 14-40, 19-40 (14/32 -- with 6 ADDITIONAL games with 20+ carries at 3.15 YPC or less -- including three under 3.00 YPC)

Need I find more? Or should we labeling as bums Devonta Freeman (Player B), LeSean McCoy (Player C), Melvin Gordon (Player D), and Todd Gurley (Player E)?

[Space Cowboy]

Lacks the big play burst. Nice hammer, but a drop Jeremy hill like. Rob Kelly esq too.

[sloth8u]

I was super excited about this year for Crowell. Going into a contract year and a top offensive line. While he hasn't gotten much of an opportunity he has also just looked like a plodder. He looked a lot more explosive last year. I signed him to a 3 year deal this year and thought I was getting a deal especially guys like Ajayi and Gordon went for double. What are all your thoughts? I usually like to sell high on players, but I am getting antsy. Should I wait, or try to get something for him now?

The outlook never was good long term. I would sell..and call it a win in your format

[ninotoreS]

Crow has good tools, but bad vision, frequently leaving yards on the field. It's why he's unlikely to ever be a true star. Cleveland's reluctance to extend his contract is testament to this.

Duke Johnson has been a slow train coming these past three seasons, but it's coming, and possibly very close now.

[cazzie33]

The Crow's season couldn't have gone any worse so far short of catastrophic injury. It has been a catastrophic failure. Seems to be slipping away from him. Running his mouth didn't help as Hue gave the goal line TD to Duke this week and Kizer the week(s) before. If Isaiah was Hue's guy you'd think he'd throw The Crow a bone.

Only hope now is for Cleveland to play a couple of close games to keep game script in Crowell's favor. Then he must produce early and consistently. Defense and Kizer have to both improve for that to happen. Maybe Myles can help with the one but Kizer was a poor college QB so I don't hold out much hope he's going to magically get better in the pro's really quickly.

Will admit I was wrong big time on the Brownies righting the ship this year. Thought they'd be good for 5-6 wins ... Not expecting them to win half of their games left in 2018. At least they'll get a good read on Kizer and decide if QB is the way to go with their early picks next year. I didn't think DK was a long term solution so maybe it was for the best that they found out now. Just about the worst thing for Isaiah though. No threat in the passing game and no answer in sight

[QuintorrisLopezJones]

Here is what I see as the issues:
He's not very good
His teams not good

Seemed pretty obvious going into the season too...Duke is the better RB to own there

[FiremanEd]

Pretty much what sug said. I know someone on UTH was pimping him pretty hard and last week he even doubled down saying he was still a buy lol. A lot of ppl were pimping his situation, which as you described was quite a reach. I was always wary but many people bought in.

That someone from UTH is pretty brutal overall and likely should be a red flag of what not to do. I have a difficult time understanding how he has any name recognition in the industry given his takes and evaluation ability.

Crowell always looked like an average guy. People got caught up in the OL improvements and likely the surprising pass catching volume he got last season. It certainly wasn't due to flash and athleticism. Some may even still be clinging to the Georgia Bulldog days. Fact is he had some name value for a UDFA so people were happy to jump on the train. That said, his end stats last season looked solid too, so people had some support to jump on the train and proclaim 'upside alert!'. Whether it be him, his line, or game script, he hasn't produced anything and is in for a market crash from the already too high stages he was at. I will note at the end of this that I also saw glimmers of optimism, though was never comfortable at the level other believers apparently were given where his stock went.

Whether you sell or hold i am not sure. Depends what you can get. I assume a 2nd is a cap and IMO is probably worth taking depending where you project it. He has a chance looking forward, but don't think he walks into a clear job as top dog next season. He really needs a Duke injury to happen, which to be frank, is not out of the realm of possibility.

[MarcoPolo25]

Also I think if he does have a big game I'd sell ... bet CLE drafts a RB next year ..

x2 so many top tier options in 2018 NFL draft.

[MarcoPolo25]

Also I think if he does have a big game I'd sell ... bet CLE drafts a RB next year ..

x2 so many top tier options in 2018 NFL draft.

[nathanq42]

Also I think if he does have a big game I'd sell ... bet CLE drafts a RB next year ..

x2 so many top tier options in 2018 NFL draft.

Doubtful, the browns have more pressing issues with basically their whole team minus their O-line (Theoritcally) and D-line.

I doubt they spend any significant draft capital on a good-great level RB because of the short shelf life.

But it's the browns so who knows.

[QuintorrisLopezJones]

I've said it before but I think it's worth repeating. Crowell is a bum. Besides the fact that his "highlights" are nothing more than a few long runs through wide open holes in the defense, his numbers are straight garbage. Here are some stats for games over the last 2 seasons (not including 2017):

10 rushes 20 yards, 11r 32y, 8r 9y, 10r 14y, 6r -5y, 7r 7y, 9r 23y, 13r 22y, 9r 16y, 11r 29y, 6r 4y, 9r 23y, 8r 10y, 8r 28y, 16r 44y, 10r 38y.

Look at that, I pulled a 16-game sample of games out of the last 2 years for Crowell. Wow what a stud. I dare you to find me a worse looking 16-game set of stats from another RB in the league.

Awful argument. You can similarly find at least 13 games over the past 32 where Crowell was great. The belief in him was that he would have fewer duds. He has easily had enough fantastic games to prove that he CAN do it; consistency was always his issue.

Another reason this is a flawed argument.

PLAYER B: 10-18, 12-25, 12-12, 14-27, 12-40, 25-56, 11-20, 12-40, 15-58, 11-35, 16-60, 15-56, 6-6, 12-37, 18-58 (16 duds in the past 34 games)

PLAYER C: 17-41, 11-16, 18-68, 10-29, 16-58, 8-11, 5-33, 12-27, 5-10, 12-9, 14-21 (11/31)

PLAYER D: 14-51, 14-51, 12-38, 14-42, 7-29, 7-29, 18-54, 11-31, 15-37, 14-35, 15-41, 16-35, 19-36, 22-68, 3-5, 18-54, 9-13, 10-22 (18/31)

PLAYER E: 6-9, 12-45, 25-66, 9-19, 9-41, 21-48, 17-47, 19-51, 19-33, 13-50, 11-38, 14-38, 14-40, 19-40 (14/32 -- with 6 ADDITIONAL games with 20+ carries at 3.15 YPC or less -- including three under 3.00 YPC)

Need I find more? Or should we labeling as bums Devonta Freeman (Player B), LeSean McCoy (Player C), Melvin Gordon (Player D), and Todd Gurley (Player E)?

I really doubt you can find 13 games over the course of his career that he has been "great" or "fantastic" rushing the ball... I doubt he's broken 70 yards rushing in more than 10 games in his entire 3.25 year career. which considering he was never going to be their receiving back, is what he needs to be good at (i didn't look up stats, just confident in how bad and inconsistent he's always been with the exception of a few games)

[IR1]

If he had been similar or a touch better than last year, I'd be happy happy with that out of my bye week rb. Have a couple shares that were ww pick up or a throw in. Only mistake I may have made was not taking a 2018 2nd offer for him this last off season.

[moishetreats]

Awful argument. You can similarly find at least 13 games over the past 32 where Crowell was great.

I really doubt you can find 13 games over the course of his career that he has been "great" or "fantastic" rushing the ball... I doubt he's broken 70 yards rushing in more than 10 games in his entire 3.25 year career. which considering he was never going to be their receiving back, is what he needs to be good at (i didn't look up stats, just confident in how bad and inconsistent he's always been with the exception of a few games)

Challenge accepted!

15-72, 12-63, 11-62, 20-145, 16-88, 12-62, 18-133, 15-79, 16-120, 12-63, 10-113, 19-152
DAMNIT! That's 12, not 13. You win.

On the other had, that's also 7 games with 70+ yards rushing in the last 2.25 seasons. I win.
Call it a push?

I've been thinking a lot about Crowell since this thread has started, and I have a new viewpoint. Players like Riddick and Blount and Gillislee are dependent on game flow. Elite RBs can transcend game flow, offensive lines, etc. and put up numbers. I thought that Crowell would start becoming less dependent on those external factors than he has been. Unlike the Blounts and Gillislees, though, when the game flows his way, he can put up some legit yardage games -- and he can catch, too.

So, it seems like Crowell has not yet gotten past game flow. But, when the game goes according to plan, then he puts up huge numbers. He hasn't become the player who can overcome the other factors, like I had anticipated. But, he's still a back-end #1 when the game goes his way.

Being on Cleveland, however...