Why is Perine being taken a round before Foreman?

[_yeti]

So because he didn't re-hash/summarize all the previous arguments his point is the only one he has and used exclusively to make a decision?
Might be best to assume new posts are additional information not the entirety of a decision process

So much wrong with this. Sometimes we are incorporating prior arguments and sometimes we are not. If everything said in this forum by default incorporated previous arguments, how cumulative and confusing would that be? There wouldn't even be different sides to a story, just one long statement incorporating other statements.

I think we all can differentiate between when that is and isn't the case. Is that statement the ONLY thing Clarion thinks about these players? Of course not. But he did say it with the intention of that single argument holding a significant amount of weight, and with specific players listed with authority to conclude that Foreman will have a hard transition as a result of what the "offensive system" has or has not produced in this handful of unsuccessful players. I found this to be very un-persuasive in this specific case.

I didn't even know who a lot of these guys were. Looking them up I quit after
2007 UDFA
2006 UDFA
2005 UDFA

So because some JAG UDFAs who played under some vague concept of a system busted, a guy who averaged 184 yards per game and led the FBS is destined for failure? How does that logic line up?

Could he bust? Could he have a tough transition? Sure. Would it be because of this reasoning? No way. All you have done is drag this out, and forced me to show my logic and those agreeing with me that it wasnt a fair critique of Foreman and that the way the argument was made it didn't silently incorporate some bigger statement that us dunces then left out. C'mon man

[clarion contrarion]

sometimes over analyzing is far worse than just seeing something at face value !
I have mentioned this before but will do it again ........ to wit ...... old doritos commercial
some super intelligent dude is trying to impress hot girl at an art museum by analyzing a painting .... some other dude walks up and says it looks like nachos .... hot girl leaves with dude that saw nachos .
Point being that foreman put up huge # and has great metrics .... but his tape looks like andre williams to me , just so ordinary ! My real crux with pointing out the past rb production is that offense shines up some rather dull prospects and guys that are practice squad talents rushed for 1000 1200 and sometimes more yardage so saying foreman is a great prospect based on his production is a red herring, basing it on his pro days # is another argument I won't delve into at this point .
jay finley and terrence ganaway had huge # in that type of offense and couldn't log a carry in the league so maybe foreman is a star but I would rather risk it with perine and take my chances that a back from bob stoops offense will pan out rather than one from a briles type offense ... the respective track record of the 2 systems to discern between two guys of similar stature and apparent ability makes perine an easy choice for me .

[_yeti]

sometimes over analyzing is far worse than just seeing something at face value !
I have mentioned this before but will do it again ........ to wit ...... old doritos commercial
some super intelligent dude is trying to impress hot girl at an art museum by analyzing a painting .... some other dude walks up and says it looks like nachos .... hot girl leaves with dude that saw nachos .
Point being that foreman put up huge # and has great metrics .... but his tape looks like andre williams to me , just so ordinary ! My real crux with pointing out the past rb production is that offense shines up some rather dull prospects and guys that are practice squad talents rushed for 1000 1200 and sometimes more yardage so saying foreman is a great prospect based on his production is a red herring, basing it on his pro days # is another argument I won't delve into at this point .
jay finley and terrence ganaway had huge # in that type of offense and couldn't log a carry in the league so maybe foreman is a star but I would rather risk it with perine and take my chances that a back from bob stoops offense will pan out rather than one from a briles type offense ... the respective track record of the 2 systems to discern between two guys of similar stature and apparent ability makes perine an easy choice for me .

See, this one I can get behind. But would some punctuation kill you?! (I know, I know, it's art). I don't disagree with your larger point. But I like both Perine and Foreman. I see guys who can be productive NFL backs (and not become irrelevant immediately *cough* Mack *cough*), I do not see a superstar in either.

I also incidentally have Perine higher than Foreman, but I am not buying Perine in the first round. Mayyyybe 1.11, 1.12.

Also, to an extent everyone in the NFL produced big in college. It's the nature of how you move to the next stage.

[Valhalla]

Point being that foreman put up huge # and has great metrics .... but his tape looks like andre williams to me , just so ordinary !

This is exactly where I am at

[DynastyFootballFan]

Foreman is the better athlete, he was drafted higher and he had a historic junior year in college. I agree with most here that Perine is being over-drafted as owners reach for early production vs. buying talent no matter the situation. My prediction model has Foreman as a low first, early second rookie draft prospect and the fact he's going late second in most drafts is a great opportunity to take if you can. Lamar Miller will not easily or quickly be displaced, but he's never proven to have elite vision or stamina to be a workhorse in this league.

Another issue with Foreman was fumbles in college, and that scares people off too. He did have a hand injury which is what he blames the fumbling on. This may be a valid excuse, but we won't really know until the pads are on, so there is a risk there.

Watching Perine's early work I was impressed with him, though his later seasons he pretty much took inside handoffs and bludgeoned defenses for 3-5 yards at a time. It will be interesting to see if what he showed early in college shows up in Washington's training camp or not. That said, I still wouldn't take him with a first round pick.

Foreman is very fast for a big man. he's got average agility but for his size he's got a little wiggle. Not Le'Veon Bell type wiggle, but good enough IMO. It will take a couple of years but I'm a believer in Foreman and will take him in every draft I can.

[DLF3000]

Here's another reason: weed and guns.

[seahawks506]

Here's another reason: weed and guns.

for the lengths people go to defend these kids... sometimes they're just dumbasses

[_yeti]

Here's another reason: weed and guns.

for the lengths people go to defend these kids... sometimes they're just dumbasses

The dumbest. Just the dumbest.
1) The weed. Just drink like a normal person and enjoy your boatload of cash. Orrrr would you rather be broke like a normal person and smoke weed. Idiot.
2) Why couldn't he just purchase a legal firearm and get a permit like a normal person. It's Texas, I thought they just handed legal guns out like candy there.

What an idiot!

[_yeti]

...With that being said, in my (IDP) league:
Perine went 1.6
Foreman (to me, traded back in for Foreman) at 3.8

Two round disparity! Couldn't believe Foreman went that late.

He dropped to the third round because my league apparently sees the future

[StableOfRBs]

Here's another reason: weed and guns.

for the lengths people go to defend these kids... sometimes they're just dumbasses

The dumbest. Just the dumbest.
1) The weed. Just drink like a normal person and enjoy your boatload of cash. Orrrr would you rather be broke like a normal person and smoke weed. Idiot.
2) Why couldn't he just purchase a legal firearm and get a permit like a normal person. It's Texas, I thought they just handed legal guns out like candy there.

What an idiot!

Well to be fair according to Ian Rappaport, Foreman's lawyer said the gun was legally purchased, registered in Foreman's name, and was properly secured inside his vehicle according to Texas law and he alerted the officer who searched his vehicle it was there beforehand, also the weed was not his but belonged to one of his passengers

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/886668631383396352

No idea what cause they had to search his vehicle but either way I think this will just make him more of a value in drafts until it gets resolved, and as long as what was reported is correct I doubt it will have any impact on his performance on the field

[_yeti]

for the lengths people go to defend these kids... sometimes they're just dumbasses

The dumbest. Just the dumbest.
1) The weed. Just drink like a normal person and enjoy your boatload of cash. Orrrr would you rather be broke like a normal person and smoke weed. Idiot.
2) Why couldn't he just purchase a legal firearm and get a permit like a normal person. It's Texas, I thought they just handed legal guns out like candy there.

What an idiot!

Well to be fair according to Ian Rappaport, Foreman's lawyer said the gun was legally purchased, registered in Foreman's name, and was properly secured inside his vehicle according to Texas law and he alerted the officer who searched his vehicle it was there beforehand, also the weed was not his but belonged to one of his passengers

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/886668631383396352

No idea what cause they had to search his vehicle but either way I think this will just make him more of a value in drafts until it gets resolved, and as long as what was reported is correct I doubt it will have any impact on his performance on the field

Well... that's a little better. But still.... what a dummy.

[Dynasty DeLorean]

The dumbest. Just the dumbest.
1) The weed. Just drink like a normal person and enjoy your boatload of cash. Orrrr would you rather be broke like a normal person and smoke weed. Idiot.
2) Why couldn't he just purchase a legal firearm and get a permit like a normal person. It's Texas, I thought they just handed legal guns out like candy there.

What an idiot!

I mean, he says it was a legally owned firearm and the weed wasn't his and he hasn't been smoking. We'll find out the truth in a couple of weeks i'm sure.

[StableOfRBs]

The dumbest. Just the dumbest.
1) The weed. Just drink like a normal person and enjoy your boatload of cash. Orrrr would you rather be broke like a normal person and smoke weed. Idiot.
2) Why couldn't he just purchase a legal firearm and get a permit like a normal person. It's Texas, I thought they just handed legal guns out like candy there.

What an idiot!

Well to be fair according to Ian Rappaport, Foreman's lawyer said the gun was legally purchased, registered in Foreman's name, and was properly secured inside his vehicle according to Texas law and he alerted the officer who searched his vehicle it was there beforehand, also the weed was not his but belonged to one of his passengers

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/886668631383396352

No idea what cause they had to search his vehicle but either way I think this will just make him more of a value in drafts until it gets resolved, and as long as what was reported is correct I doubt it will have any impact on his performance on the field

Well... that's a little better. But still.... what a dummy.

I do agree it's pretty stupid for a guy in his position to associate himself with people smoking weed when the ink on his contract is still fresh but it does seem like there's more to this situation and I'm pretty curious to see what turns up in the next week or two especially with training camp starting

As it is, I'd put a hold on trading him away unless I got decent value for him or was desperate and someone offered me a decent vet RB for him but I'd rather wait and see what he can do on the field before tanking him as a dynasty prospect

[Knox Steel Curtain]

Bump Foreman to third at best lol. Sub Conner in with Perine for big backs with some upside. All it takes is one more mess up from Bell or an injury. Also, Bell still not signed beyond this year. Never understood how people were taking Foreman over Conner who was still recovering from cancer and getting stronger as season went on last year.

[berserkers]

Here's another reason: weed and guns.

for the lengths people go to defend these kids... sometimes they're just dumbasses

Ha ha. All seems silly now. Once again Foreman went mid 2nd for the third time this summer in one of my drafts. Not sure he'll drop much more than that. Maybe there's a good chance he beats these charges, but playing in his hometown isn't going to help him when his posse is just a phone call away.