How to Take Down the Powerhouse?

[Novacane]

Become the powerhouse. It is literally that simple.

[Paul Crewe]

Beat him to punch and trade with teams he is usually trading with before he can trade with them in the first place. If it's really that easy for him to fleece those teams, it shouldn't be hard for you to do it.

Agree with this. Had the same issue in my league with an owner (the commissioner) that kept getting sweetheart deals from less experienced owners that didn't know any better. It wasn't collusion, but it was incredibly frustrating for the other competitive owners because it essentially felt like he had his own farm team.

Eventually, I just learned from watching him and became more active and savvy in my negotiations. After pulling off a few similar deals with those same owners and winning a few deals directly with him, I was able to close the gap.

I also spent a lot of additional time upping my player evaluation skills so I could maximize the draft and free agency (Rotoviz has been an especially great resource in that effort.) Build up your depth, especially at WR, then flip them in trades for better players. Use the freed up roster spots to acquire more talent, then rinse and repeat.

The other thing is you can't get comfortable. You have to keep floating offers, reading up on players, working the waiver wire, etc. If you take it easy, owners like the one you describe will make the deal you could have made.

[James McGhee]

Become the powerhouse. It is literally that simple.

And Adam ruled, for he was the King. Until the day his will to be King deserted him. Then he died, food for a stronger. And the strongest was always the King, not by strength alone, but King by cunning and luck and strength together. Among the rats.

[onetwothree]

Even if you don't trade with that team, there's 8+ other teams that might. Obviously if you make some sort of agreement amongst the other owners to not trade then we're dealing with collusion.

Agree with the points others have made. Beat him to the punch. Hustle harder. Don't just wait for the offers to come to you. Continually look at other rosters and find deals you can profit with either to make your roster better or to pick up a piece that you can turn into something better. And of course it takes a good amount of luck which is something completely out of your control but you can be minimized. Focus on what you can do for your team instead of trying to counter something he does.

[BuckeyeNation]

The problem with the league powerhouse usually isn't the powerhouse himself, it's the uninformed/unskilled cellar dweller owners that continually feed assets to the top team. Sure, they'll feed a little bit to most anyone in the league, but there's usually 1-2 owners that exploit this to the maximum. This is the biggest problem with most random leagues, you'll have 1-2 owners who just aren't on the level of the other owners or just don't take the game seriously. If you want to take down the powerhouse, in most cases replacing the worst owners in the league is step one.

Obviously there's skill involved in the game, and even a slight skill advantage will magnify itself over the course of several years. That said, if all the owners in the league are at least competent, powerhouse teams will run their course. They may contend for championships year in and year out, but their roster won't look like a juggernaut for more than a couple years at a time. There's ebb in flow in this game, but since this is a game that continues indefinitely and can be slow in it's progression, it can make it seem like a daunting task to overcome these players. Just remember that the best team on paper doesn't always win (as evident by the long running threads on this forum in DEC that are full of owners venting about how their great team somehow didn't win it all). All you can do is worry about your own squad. I would neither target nor avoid the powerhouse owner, I'd approach them the same as any other owner.

In short, a "Powerhouse" team can sometimes signify the downfall of a league, but it's the bottom feeder owners that are most likely responsible for the situation. Worry about one roster and one roster only, yours. If you're a skilled and knowledgeable owner you'll be just fine.

[Coogan Football]

I trust me, it's him I don't trust!

I mean, he seems to "win" every trade, so I really don't want to risk contributing to that at all - while risking damaging my own team at the same time. Looks like lose-lose to me.

so in other words he is better than everyone else ?

That's kind of how I read it.

Me too lol

[_yeti]

If you trust yourself, why not make a trade with the BEAST?

I trust me, it's him I don't trust!

I mean, he seems to "win" every trade, so I really don't want to risk contributing to that at all - while risking damaging my own team at the same time. Looks like lose-lose to me.

so in other words he is better than everyone else ?

I'll be the third person to quote this. It seems mildly passive-aggressive to suggest he "fleeces" other GMs as if he is pulling a fast one, while seeming to acknowledge he might just be really good at dynasty and seems to win trades in retrospect.

Not to be overly confident but at least at the moment I hold a somewhat similar spot with my team in my sig. From the perspective of someone who has had quite a few things go my way I will say this, I always try to offer trades that work for both teams. I start from a reasonable offer and don't lowball. I'm also willing to sometimes pay an overpay based on current market value for something I believe in. It's not all about the immediate "win."

If you can't beat em, Join Em! Even if not trading directly with that owner you can always try to offer better deals to the owners he "fleeces." More than enough talent to go around, another strategy might be to aim for a slightly different time window than his team is in.

[Pac_Eddy]

This may be a case of the commissioner (& powerhouse team) knows other owners better than you. Those other owners might be less experienced, care less, put in less time at fantasy football, or whatever. I've been there. Seems like he can get deals done with owners that won't even reply to your offers. I was an outsider compared to a large core of other friends.

If this is the case for you & you can't fix it, I'd make this a back burner league, but continue to fight. Make offers, even small losing ones, just to open the lines of communication with difficult owners.

[meineymoe]

This may be a case of the commissioner (& powerhouse team) knows other owners better than you. Those other owners might be less experienced, care less, put in less time at fantasy football, or whatever. I've been there. Seems like he can get deals done with owners that won't even reply to your offers. I was an outsider compared to a large core of other friends.

If this is the case for you & you can't fix it, I'd make this a back burner league, but continue to fight. Make offers, even small losing ones, just to open the lines of communication with difficult owners.

Great advice. I'm usually The Beast in most of my leagues - not that I fleece other owners, but I make good deals that benefit me and I'm a perennial contender. But one league I'm in, the commish has a few of his old high school buddies in it who only deal with him, they are totally lame owners, and he totally rips them off. Constantly. So all I and the other owners can do is call them out, get on their cases... and one by one, those owners have left the league, and it is much more equitable now.

-oo-

[sloth8u]

ive seen this aswell eddy....there really isnt much you can do but keep plugging along. the bad part is that the commish is the guy recruiting new owners as needed. you can only hope that he brings in quality owners.

ive played in 2 leagues where an owner has 3 peated...at no point did i ever think anything "abnormal" was going on. i thought the chips fell and these dudes just won 3 in a row..DAMN!!!! ive also played in a few leagues in which 1 owner owned all the best of everything, and the picks to go with it every year....and havent seen that guy win. its really hard to comment on your situation without knowing the details.

[skip]

i dont care what the other team looks like, if i can make a trade that improves my team in some way, im making it

I completely agree with this.

As much as many owners want to control other league mates by employing vetoes or get rid of "bad" owners because they don't like the moves they make, etc. - it's not any of your business how another team operates unless there are clear rule violations.

The only thing you CAN control is what you do with your team. The trades you make, the waiver moves you make, who you draft, etc. If there is a trade with the "powerhouse" team that benefits you and you DON'T make it then you are contributing to the problem. Always worry about your own team first. Ultimately you will build a winner and you can take down the powerhouse on the "field".

[moishetreats]

1) I agree that this owner is likely better.

2) I see a LOT of powerhouse teams make these kinds of trades: giving up two players each worth, say, 7 cents for one player worth a dime. Or giving up three players/picks each worth 10 cents for a quarter. For the team receiving the two or three players, it makes sense. That's the only really way to re-build: hope that those players but appreciate in value in the future or that at least one of those players becomes the next quarter player in 2-3 years when the guy that you traded away is now fading. For the best, his team just got stronger: he traded away two players that would never start for him for, say, an RB1 or three players who would never start for him for, say, a WR2. And then he has an extra roster spot to find the next player to stash and trade.

Bottom line: there are some leagues the "beast" is "fleecing". But, in my experience, the beast is just damn good and knows how to create a roster where players on his team have real trade value for other teams. As one comment above noted, rather than blacklisting him for your trades (that only hurts you -- most "beasts" often create win-win trades so that people will keep trading with them), I'd let go of the ego a little and learn from him.

[Weeman]

In order to take down a powerhouse you have to study their roster construction, tendencies & percieved weaknesses. All why understanding groupthink weekly & sometimes in a moment.

Trading a young WR1 for an aging TE1. Trading a likely late 2018 rookie pick for a WR1/2 range from a contender.

There are ways to manipulate rosters, but if you are winning trades, scouting correctly in drafts & on the wire. You should be the powerhouse!!

Forget that Bobby steals from Johnny & won a chip last year. Focus on the window of your team. If you need to rebuild- do it.... find a solid rb2 - be relentless in your pursuits!

This last part is going to throw some of you off. But offer advice to the less informed owners. Hey pick up this guy. Sometimes even through a small bone their way in a trade. You may have bench players that could be starting on this turds team & allowing him to beat a playoff team. Or better yet knock one out of the playoffs.

& for the troll toll segment.... If you have owners who trade away valuable rookie picks & have no clue or care. Hose them. Hose them.... Make them feel like losing out on Mixon, Mccafrey is the dumbest move they'll ever make. Send trade calculators showing rape, send group texts laughing at their expense, expert rankings links asking how they evaluate players. Create team names that ridicule & mock their decisions. Become the ultimate troll because these owners will ruin your league if this continues. Send them dumb trades for their rookie pick next year till they hit decline everytime, even when it's a good offer. If you can't educate them irritate them so they never want to trade with you or anyone. I'd rather a hermit trader then a guy that gives 1.01 for Pennies to a rapey contender. Trade Resentment in fantasy football is real, I've met the people who stopped playing because of the deal that went south.

[Death_From_Above]

The problem with the league powerhouse usually isn't the powerhouse himself, it's the uninformed/unskilled cellar dweller owners that continually feed assets to the top team. Sure, they'll feed a little bit to most anyone in the league, but there's usually 1-2 owners that exploit this to the maximum. This is the biggest problem with most random leagues, you'll have 1-2 owners who just aren't on the level of the other owners or just don't take the game seriously. If you want to take down the powerhouse, in most cases replacing the worst owners in the league is step one.

Obviously there's skill involved in the game, and even a slight skill advantage will magnify itself over the course of several years. That said, if all the owners in the league are at least competent, powerhouse teams will run their course. They may contend for championships year in and year out, but their roster won't look like a juggernaut for more than a couple years at a time. There's ebb in flow in this game, but since this is a game that continues indefinitely and can be slow in it's progression, it can make it seem like a daunting task to overcome these players. Just remember that the best team on paper doesn't always win (as evident by the long running threads on this forum in DEC that are full of owners venting about how their great team somehow didn't win it all). All you can do is worry about your own squad. I would neither target nor avoid the powerhouse owner, I'd approach them the same as any other owner.

In short, a "Powerhouse" team can sometimes signify the downfall of a league, but it's the bottom feeder owners that are most likely responsible for the situation. Worry about one roster and one roster only, yours. If you're a skilled and knowledgeable owner you'll be just fine.

100% this

[maxhyde]

so in other words he is better than everyone else ?

That's kind of how I read it.

Me too lol

Are these the guys?

I mean I play in leagues like that and it is frustrating but what can you do. Guys underselling good or elite talent for a bunch of hype/buzz and draft picks. Just continue to do your thing and make sure you make the playoffs...anything can happen there.
I refuse to fleece other owners because it just makes it no fun for anyone but it is gambling and some need to win more than they like competing