Bishop Sankey in MIN

[Sterling Archer]

Great measurables just like... McKinnon.

Actually this is what I was thinking. I don't think sankey gets a shot without a McKinnon injury, but I think he's similar and can step right into that role if McKinnon gets injured. Not a bad guy for the Vikes to have on the practice squad
And yes, I think McKinnon has talent. Just a breathtakingly horrible line

I'm a McKinnon fan, too. I know the line was bad, but this season still gave me pause.

It's crazy how similar Sankey and McKinnon's measurables are, though. They are both ridiculously athletic. I never owned Sankey but I'll admit I was shocked at how poorly he's done.

[Valhalla]

Great measurables just like... McKinnon.

Actually this is what I was thinking. I don't think sankey gets a shot without a McKinnon injury, but I think he's similar and can step right into that role if McKinnon gets injured. Not a bad guy for the Vikes to have on the practice squad
And yes, I think McKinnon has talent. Just a breathtakingly horrible line

It's crazy how similar Sankey and McKinnon's measurables are, though. They are both ridiculously athletic. I never owned Sankey but I'll admit I was shocked at how poorly he's done.

Agreed. Very similar players, which is why I like Sankey on the Vikes practice squad. I think McKinnon is an important piece in the offense moving forward, and Sankey is a good guy to have that can simply step into the role and not make the offense change a ton.

[skip]

I guess I was the only one that read the Sankey/McKinnon comparison and future potential as sarcasm. Sankey was predictably bad when he came out of school just like McKinnon was predictably bad last year and I recall trying to talk just about everyone down last year from giving up 1st round picks for him. It sounds like you didn't learn your lesson so here it is in summary:

Unless the Vikings bring back AP at his huge salary, the starter in 2017 is not presently on the roster. McKinnon will go back to what he does best as nothing more than a backup. Sankey will either be grabbed from yet another team off of the Vikings practice squad or get cut outright again.

[Jfever]

Until I see how my Vikings are going to fix the o-line issue, I can't even bring myself to discuss their skilled position depth. I haven't yet gotten over this nightmare of a 2016 season. The 5-0 start was fun... Loved seeing the purple beat the Pack, the Giants, and the Panthers... Then, the wheels fell off. The injuries were like something out of a science fiction novel. I mean you couldn't even make it up how crazy it was. I'm 41 years old. Been an AVID vikings fan since I can remember and I think this year is the first I can recall with this much uncertainty with and dependence on depth. So many missed games, shuffled positions, . Heck, I have tatoos to prove it... I mean.... they got swept by the frickin Lions and somehow lost to the Bears. Thinking about that makes me sick. Just gross.

[flyersfan1981]

Until I see how my Vikings are going to fix the o-line issue, I can't even bring myself to discuss their skilled position depth. I haven't yet gotten over this nightmare of a 2016 season. The 5-0 start was fun... Loved seeing the purple beat the Pack, the Giants, and the Panthers... Then, the wheels fell off. The injuries were like something out of a science fiction novel. I mean you couldn't even make it up how crazy it was. I'm 41 years old. Been an AVID vikings fan since I can remember and I think this year is the first I can recall with this much uncertainty with and dependence on depth. So many missed games, shuffled positions, . Heck, I have tatoos to prove it... I mean.... they got swept by the frickin Lions and somehow lost to the Bears. Thinking about that makes me sick. Just gross.

Don't worry they ended up with a higher pick at least...


...oh wait...oops!

[Sterling Archer]

I guess I was the only one that read the Sankey/McKinnon comparison and future potential as sarcasm. Sankey was predictably bad when he came out of school just like McKinnon was predictably bad last year and I recall trying to talk just about everyone down last year from giving up 1st round picks for him. It sounds like you didn't learn your lesson so here it is in summary:

Unless the Vikings bring back AP at his huge salary, the starter in 2017 is not presently on the roster. McKinnon will go back to what he does best as nothing more than a backup. Sankey will either be grabbed from yet another team off of the Vikings practice squad or get cut outright again.

How was Sankey predictably bad? Seems like revisionist history. His measurables were elite. Like I said, I never owned any Sankey stock, but I'm not too proud to admit I was shocked at how poorly he did. And to say McKinnon was predictably bad last year is to completely ignore how bad the OL was. Nobody stood a chance to survive behind that line. And FWIW, I own zero McKinnon stock.

That being said, I agree the starter is probably not on the roster, but (1) if the OL doesn't improve and stay healthy it won't matter who is starting and (2) I wouldn't write McKinnon off just yet - he's probably not going to be the starter, but if he is, I still think he could be good. I'm not targeting him in trades, but if someone will throw him in, I'm all about it.

[James McGhee]

If McKinnon could get out of the backfield he'd be solid. The O-line is atrocious.

[skip]

How was Sankey predictably bad? Seems like revisionist history. His measurables were elite.

This is hardly "revisionist history" I can assure you that I tried to talk anyone and everyone away from investing in Sankey. I guess you are suggesting that any opinion differing from "group think" is not a valid one? I didn't care for his talent nor his situation. I don't even know what you mean by measurables. I surely hope you aren't referring to the combine.

[Sterling Archer]

How was Sankey predictably bad? Seems like revisionist history. His measurables were elite.

This is hardly "revisionist history" I can assure you that I tried to talk anyone and everyone away from investing in Sankey. I guess you are suggesting that any opinion differing from "group think" is not a valid one? I didn't care for his talent nor his situation. I don't even know what you mean by measurables. I surely hope you aren't referring to the combine.

Not at all. I'm saying any opinion that is rooted in nothing more than one person's eyeball test is not a valid one. But if you had more to contribute than that, then sure, it would've been good info. I just don't see anything legitimate when looking backwards to say "Oh yeah, there were red flags all over the place on this guy."

First of all, it's dumb to ignore the combine for RBs. Statistics have shown there IS a correlation between certain combine stats and NFL success (particularly agility score in which he ranked in the 97th percentile). So hell yeah his combine numbers are included in what I refer to as "measurables." But they also include his share (%) of his college team's offensive yards, his college ypc, and his college target share. No one number is enough to say a guy will be good or bad, but when ALL the numbers are favorable only the ignorant would ignore them because there absolutely is a correlation between those numbers and NFL success.

But again, I was lucky to never have any shares of Sankey. I am only trying to be fair to those who did. I don't think anyone had enough legitimate info to say they could definitively predict his failure. If anyone did, they were right just like a broken clock is right twice a day. You blindly say enough people will fail and you'll be right sometimes because it's a game of odds. Even players with a lot of favorable predictors probably only have a slightly better than 50% chance of succeeding in the NFL. As a mid-to-late 2nd round pick the odds were probably less than 50% for Sankey, but those odds were still better than a lot of other RBs.

[Valhalla]

Chances for Sankey getting anything of significance for carries on the field are quite slim, but they aren't zero. If he gets that chance, I think he can do fine with it. This is a very old argument now, but I'll reiterate it for those new to dynasty that may take a flier on him in deep leagues.

He has done fine in the past when given the chance, but something about him was just not to the liking of the (brilliant) Titans coaching staff. They wanted a RB that would run straight up the gut on each carry, and Sankey is built more like (and runs more like) LeSean McCoy. He's a lateral mover and relies on that agility, and they wanted a straight up the gut man, making his agility (his best tool) a minimally used tool. They pushed for him to add bulk and change his running style to fit their scheme. He did so, and honestly I thought it made him look worse than he did before adding the bulk. That said, he ran up the gut for them, as the scheme dictated. Andrews (a very slow, non-agile, non-explosive RB that can ONLY run up the gut) also ran up the gut for them. Sankey ran for a higher YPC than Andrews, with Sankey running a style that wasn't to his athletic strengths. He out-performed Andrews at his own game in the simplest of statistics we can look at for comparing performance at a glimpse (ypc), yet the coaches went with Andrews and VERY quickly phased out the RB that was (statistically) performing better in their system.
Most people will look at that and come to the relatively straight-forward conclusion that he was failing the coaches at something else, with his blocking, practice habits, something. The coaches know best and he obviously wasn't as good as Andrews if he couldn't see the field. This might be right, but I don't think it's a definitive conclusion.
What I remember seeing in beat-writer talk back then (before Andrews got significant time at RB) is a lot of talk about how much the coaches loved his attitude on special teams. He was willing to play multiple positions for them and was energetic with special teams play. The coaches just loved that attitude. I'm purely speculating here (like those that speculate Andrews must have been clearly better in practice), but I'd bet the coaches had bias/preference toward favoring attitude over talent. It wasn't talent, but attitude that bought Andrews his chance.
If I'm right...is that GOOD for Sankey that he lost out due to not having the right attitude toward the team philosophy? Hell no, it's certainly not a good sign at all. Yet it also means that he may not have been benched due to a lack of ability.
Is there a chance that a new opportunity after failure would bring out a different attitude/approach to the job? Absolutely. Will he get that chance? Probably not...but it could happen.

Before people jump all over me about my "it could happen" comment...I can already see the replies of how "there are too many other backs for a team to ever use a guy like this"
...so...
Michael carried some nice value just this past year after being cut by multiple teams. Hightower won teams championships after being passed up on the depth chart, cut, and sitting unsigned for quite some time. Blount goes from sitting in free agency and being questionable as a future NFL contributor to being a top performing back for a stretch, and has done that a couple times now. Spencer Ware was elevated from the practice squad as an emergency fill-in after injury struck. Jacquizz bounced around doing little in the league until he had a chance opportunity arise this season. Terrance West was hurdled on the depth chart, traded for nothing, waived, signed to another practice squad, and then elevated to starter, giving a nice little run for fantasy owners. Dion Lewis was a practice squad guy. Forsett was waived, signed, waived by multiple teams, occupying multiple practice squads before getting a real shot. Ronnie Hillman is another guy floating around out there right now that has fantasy value when he gets his shots. He did well not so long ago, in 2015. This is not a history of NFL backs that go from practice squad to starter. This list is just guys from the last two years.
Does this history support Sankey ever becoming a lasting, valuable asset? No, quite the opposite. It suggests that if he gets a shot, he could give owners a nice spurt of games and production. If that happens, based on this history, I'd sell. That doesn't mean he's currently a worthless asset, but more of an end of roster stash in deeper leagues.

[DecafMaverick]

Chances for Sankey getting anything of significance for carries on the field are quite slim, but they aren't zero. If he gets that chance, I think he can do fine with it. This is a very old argument now, but I'll reiterate it for those new to dynasty that may take a flier on him in deep leagues.

He has done fine in the past when given the chance, but something about him was just not to the liking of the (brilliant) Titans coaching staff. They wanted a RB that would run straight up the gut on each carry, and Sankey is built more like (and runs more like) LeSean McCoy. He's a lateral mover and relies on that agility, and they wanted a straight up the gut man, making his agility (his best tool) a minimally used tool. They pushed for him to add bulk and change his running style to fit their scheme. He did so, and honestly I thought it made him look worse than he did before adding the bulk. That said, he ran up the gut for them, as the scheme dictated. Andrews (a very slow, non-agile, non-explosive RB that can ONLY run up the gut) also ran up the gut for them. Sankey ran for a higher YPC than Andrews, with Sankey running a style that wasn't to his athletic strengths. He out-performed Andrews at his own game in the simplest of statistics we can look at for comparing performance at a glimpse (ypc), yet the coaches went with Andrews and VERY quickly phased out the RB that was (statistically) performing better in their system.
Most people will look at that and come to the relatively straight-forward conclusion that he was failing the coaches at something else, with his blocking, practice habits, something. The coaches know best and he obviously wasn't as good as Andrews if he couldn't see the field. This might be right, but I don't think it's a definitive conclusion.
What I remember seeing in beat-writer talk back then (before Andrews got significant time at RB) is a lot of talk about how much the coaches loved his attitude on special teams. He was willing to play multiple positions for them and was energetic with special teams play. The coaches just loved that attitude. I'm purely speculating here (like those that speculate Andrews must have been clearly better in practice), but I'd bet the coaches had bias/preference toward favoring attitude over talent. It wasn't talent, but attitude that bought Andrews his chance.
If I'm right...is that GOOD for Sankey that he lost out due to not having the right attitude toward the team philosophy? Hell no, it's certainly not a good sign at all. Yet it also means that he may not have been benched due to a lack of ability.
Is there a chance that a new opportunity after failure would bring out a different attitude/approach to the job? Absolutely. Will he get that chance? Probably not...but it could happen.

Before people jump all over me about my "it could happen" comment...I can already see the replies of how "there are too many other backs for a team to ever use a guy like this"
...so...
Michael carried some nice value just this past year after being cut by multiple teams. Hightower won teams championships after being passed up on the depth chart, cut, and sitting unsigned for quite some time. Blount goes from sitting in free agency and being questionable as a future NFL contributor to being a top performing back for a stretch, and has done that a couple times now. Spencer Ware was elevated from the practice squad as an emergency fill-in after injury struck. Jacquizz bounced around doing little in the league until he had a chance opportunity arise this season. Terrance West was hurdled on the depth chart, traded for nothing, waived, signed to another practice squad, and then elevated to starter, giving a nice little run for fantasy owners. Dion Lewis was a practice squad guy. Forsett was waived, signed, waived by multiple teams, occupying multiple practice squads before getting a real shot. Ronnie Hillman is another guy floating around out there right now that has fantasy value when he gets his shots. He did well not so long ago, in 2015. This is not a history of NFL backs that go from practice squad to starter. This list is just guys from the last two years.
Does this history support Sankey ever becoming a lasting, valuable asset? No, quite the opposite. It suggests that if he gets a shot, he could give owners a nice spurt of games and production. If that happens, based on this history, I'd sell. That doesn't mean he's currently a worthless asset, but more of an end of roster stash in deeper leagues.

Thank you.

[Valhalla]

Thank you.
[/quote]

Don't invest anything of significance in him based on my comments. I'm probably wrong. I suck at predicting the NFL (and therefore fantasy outcomes)...and so does almost everyone else. Anyone out there who claims they are awesome at predicting NFL statistics because they dominate their fantasy leagues...it's not because they don't suck at predicting outcomes. It's just that they don't suck as much as their league-mates do.

[Friction]

Until I see how my Vikings are going to fix the o-line issue, I can't even bring myself to discuss their skilled position depth. I haven't yet gotten over this nightmare of a 2016 season. The 5-0 start was fun... Loved seeing the purple beat the Pack, the Giants, and the Panthers... Then, the wheels fell off. The injuries were like something out of a science fiction novel. I mean you couldn't even make it up how crazy it was. I'm 41 years old. Been an AVID vikings fan since I can remember and I think this year is the first I can recall with this much uncertainty with and dependence on depth. So many missed games, shuffled positions, . Heck, I have tatoos to prove it... I mean.... they got swept by the frickin Lions and somehow lost to the Bears. Thinking about that makes me sick. Just gross.

Don't worry they ended up with a higher pick at least...


...oh wait...oops!

I still chuckle every time I hear this. I m guessing it was the mass majority of the fan base puffing their chests out and declaring a Super Bowl victory five weeks into the season. Or maybe it was the blaming the refs after every loss, but humble pie was served here to those who needed it (obviously not all as there are plenty of sane, knowledgable fans too).

[ArrylT]

Torn ACL for Sankey. Guess he joins Christine Michael in the "what if this was an alternate reality and he was a stud rb" group. Not that many people were still stashing him ...

[ArrylT]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2535 ... for-season