Jordan Howard: Stock Up?

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Payton34
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Re: What are we waiting for on Jordan Howard?

Postby Payton34 » Sun Dec 04, 2016 5:20 pm

It IS too late... For the love of gawd I've seen turds like Christine Michael get more respect on these boards having never done jack than Howard...

This week we'll get to field questions about Lamar Miller asking if he's only worth maybe TWO 1st round picks now or something, while people try to convince others that Howard MIGHT be worth a middle 1st round pick!

Help me out here guys. The goal is to buy low and sell high, right? As hard as some of you try to find some fatal flaw, it'd be a miracle if you EVER made a good trade in fantasy....

/rant. I'll go find the Xanax. ;)

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12 teams, 6pts all TDs, 1/2 pt PPR. 1QB, 1RB, 2WR, 1TE, 1K, 1D, 2 FLEX RB/WR/TE

QBs - P Mahomes, Tua Tagovailoa
RBs - Bijan, J Jacobs, K Walker, B Hall,
WRs - AJ Brown, J Waddle, DJ Moore, T Higgins, D London, Smith-Njigba, J Downs, M Wilson, AT Perry
TEs - D Kincaid, Musgrave
Ks - Boswell, McPherson
Ds - Texans, Jets

2024 - 2 1st rounders... Picks 1.5, 1.7..

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Re: What are we waiting for on Jordan Howard?

Postby Jfever » Sun Dec 04, 2016 9:44 pm

Again, not to take too much away from a small sample size of any one particular game or even a half of a rookie season or so, but, all things considered with what we know today, Howard is legit and isn't going to be threatened by a day one or two pick of a rb from 2017 class. And, for me, as an owner, no way I'm selling him for a mid 2017 first. And, I'm buying for that all day. I love seeing guys that are forum darlings produce like ww fodder week in and week out, yet their perceived value by many is still in the multiple 1sts area, meanwhile people second guess Jordan Howard and his ceiling and whether or not he is worth a single 2017 1st.

Group think runs deep at times. As a guy who has gotten into multiple similar discussions about Melvin Gordon as well, it has been entertaining.
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Franky Four Fingers
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Re: What are we waiting for on Jordan Howard?

Postby Franky Four Fingers » Sun Dec 04, 2016 11:33 pm

As a lifelong Bears fan and avid dynasty player I've got to say that Howard is the real deal. Ill admit that I was one of the guys who was flying the Langford flag heading into the season. I felt that Langford (Flashed) some potential towards the end of last season. I did however make sure to draft or acquire Howard though as a precaution. Having watched literally every touch he's got this season here is my take.
PROS
1. The guy is a bull of a runner. Rarely if ever is he brought down by first contact, and on those rare occasions when he is he always seems to be falling forward.
2. He has exceptional vision. Unlike many young rbs Howard shows the patience and understanding of how to effectively use his blockers. This is quite possibly his best trait that he possesses. Unless the play is totally blown up in the backfield he does not run into the back of his OL.
3. Is a willing and capable blocker. Not only is his understanding of blitz pickups impressive for a rookie but his 230Lb frame allows him to stonewall defenders. As his understanding of NFL systems progresses he will become better in this area as well.
4. Has sure hands. Over his first 181 carries he only has one fumble.
5. Excellent at fighting for short yardage.
CONS
1. Does not have homerun speed. Has shown the ability to bust long runs but is usually caught from behind. (This seems to be the main knock his detractors have against him.)
2. Not the most natural of pass catchers. Although he could finish his rookie campaign with close to 30 catches he sometimes seems to fight the ball.
3. Not as much of an issue in the pros as college but his violent running style has tendency to get him nicked up.
CONCLUSION
Howard is an immensely talented player. Outside of Elliott he is the only rookie rb to show a three down skill set. As the Chicago offense improves around him in the coming years he should become a steady mid to low end rb1. If someone in your league is fool enough to ignore him than I would recommend acquiring him. To bring up a previous player who was mentioned in this thread, I would trade L. Miller for Howard and a 1st all day every day.

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Re: Why isnt Jordan Howard a consensus 1st round pick?

Postby Ryantacular » Mon Dec 05, 2016 4:46 am

#BuyingLowSellingHighPaysOff

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Re: Why isnt Jordan Howard a consensus 1st round pick?

Postby pokerface40 » Mon Dec 05, 2016 6:44 am

I took Perkins and Keith Marshall over him at 2.07 and 2.08, doh.

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Re: What are we waiting for on Jordan Howard?

Postby Payton34 » Mon Dec 05, 2016 6:56 am

I have L Miller and would trade him straight up for Howard at this point... (keeping in mind that in any negotiations I wouldn't let on that I would, but...)

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12 teams, 6pts all TDs, 1/2 pt PPR. 1QB, 1RB, 2WR, 1TE, 1K, 1D, 2 FLEX RB/WR/TE

QBs - P Mahomes, Tua Tagovailoa
RBs - Bijan, J Jacobs, K Walker, B Hall,
WRs - AJ Brown, J Waddle, DJ Moore, T Higgins, D London, Smith-Njigba, J Downs, M Wilson, AT Perry
TEs - D Kincaid, Musgrave
Ks - Boswell, McPherson
Ds - Texans, Jets

2024 - 2 1st rounders... Picks 1.5, 1.7..

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Re: What are we waiting for on Jordan Howard?

Postby Concept Coop » Mon Dec 05, 2016 7:15 am

Payton34 wrote:I have L Miller and would trade him straight up for Howard at this point... (keeping in mind that in any negotiations I wouldn't let on that I would, but...)

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Same here.

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Re: Why isnt Jordan Howard a consensus 1st round pick?

Postby alphaxray » Mon Dec 05, 2016 7:19 am

pokerface40 wrote:I took Perkins and Keith Marshall over him at 2.07 and 2.08, doh.
Which allowed me to draft him @ 2.10!

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Re: What are we waiting for on Jordan Howard?

Postby maxhyde » Mon Dec 05, 2016 9:43 am

Concept Coop wrote:
Payton34 wrote:I have L Miller and would trade him straight up for Howard at this point... (keeping in mind that in any negotiations I wouldn't let on that I would, but...)

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Same here.
...but would anyone take Miller for Howard at this point?
What scenario do you see any Howard owner thinking twice about Miller? A competitor can't risk giving up the production and a rebuilder wouldn't deal for an older back.
DLF HOF League 16 team PPR
QB: Brees, Bradford, Lock(3.07)
RB: David Johnson, Penny, Sanders(1.07), Montgomery(1.06), Love(2.07) Bernard, MLynch, Morris, TJLogan, Joe Williams, Shaun Wilson
WR: Jeffery,Cooper, Josh Gordon, Dede Westbrook, Cam Meredith, Brice Butler, Chester Rogers, Lockett, Switzer, Malone, Cain (IR)
TE: Gronk, Swaim, Maxx Williams

Payton34
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Re: What are we waiting for on Jordan Howard?

Postby Payton34 » Mon Dec 05, 2016 10:15 am

maxhyde wrote:
Concept Coop wrote:
Payton34 wrote:I have L Miller and would trade him straight up for Howard at this point... (keeping in mind that in any negotiations I wouldn't let on that I would, but...)

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Same here.
...but would anyone take Miller for Howard at this point?
What scenario do you see any Howard owner thinking twice about Miller? A competitor can't risk giving up the production and a rebuilder wouldn't deal for an older back.
Thanks, buzz kill. ;)

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12 teams, 6pts all TDs, 1/2 pt PPR. 1QB, 1RB, 2WR, 1TE, 1K, 1D, 2 FLEX RB/WR/TE

QBs - P Mahomes, Tua Tagovailoa
RBs - Bijan, J Jacobs, K Walker, B Hall,
WRs - AJ Brown, J Waddle, DJ Moore, T Higgins, D London, Smith-Njigba, J Downs, M Wilson, AT Perry
TEs - D Kincaid, Musgrave
Ks - Boswell, McPherson
Ds - Texans, Jets

2024 - 2 1st rounders... Picks 1.5, 1.7..

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maxhyde
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Re: What are we waiting for on Jordan Howard?

Postby maxhyde » Mon Dec 05, 2016 10:26 am

Sorry man...just that I don't even like him like some of you and I wouldn't do that without some sugar on top.
I mean in order of disappointing seasons from RB this year I would imagine Miller is sitting there at #2 after Gurley but that is just a guess...Charles or AP could figure in there but they basically haven't even played
DLF HOF League 16 team PPR
QB: Brees, Bradford, Lock(3.07)
RB: David Johnson, Penny, Sanders(1.07), Montgomery(1.06), Love(2.07) Bernard, MLynch, Morris, TJLogan, Joe Williams, Shaun Wilson
WR: Jeffery,Cooper, Josh Gordon, Dede Westbrook, Cam Meredith, Brice Butler, Chester Rogers, Lockett, Switzer, Malone, Cain (IR)
TE: Gronk, Swaim, Maxx Williams

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Re: Why isnt Jordan Howard a consensus 1st round pick?

Postby Coogan Football » Mon Dec 05, 2016 10:38 am

alphaxray wrote:
pokerface40 wrote:I took Perkins and Keith Marshall over him at 2.07 and 2.08, doh.
Which allowed me to draft him @ 2.10!
If he fell all the way to 2.10 than Pokerface wasn't the only one that whiffed on Howard.

I took him at 2.02 and was thrilled that he fell to me there at the time. I unsuccessfully tried trading up to 1.10 to snag him, luckily it all worked out for me.
12 team 6pts all TDs/.5ppr/SFlex/ balanced IDP, scoring est. 2008
Start QB,SF,2RB,3WR,TE,2Flex,3DL,3LB,3DB,2DFlex
3x Champion 2015, 2016, 2017
QB: Brees, Luck, Prescott, McCarron, C.Kelly, Peterman
RB: Elliott, Gurley, Hunt, Kamara, Gordon, Howard, McCaffrey, J.Williams,
WR: Julio, Hopkins, M.Thomas, TY, Watkins, Kupp, C.Davis, Thomas (LA), Carroo, Switzer, Tr. Taylor
TE: Olsen, Engram, Howard, Fleener, Swoope
DL: Watt, Mack, C.Jordan, Bosa, D.Hunter, Clowney, Armstead
LB: Kuechly, Ogletree, Mosley, McKinney, R.Foster, Bucannon, Z.Cunningham, Anzalone, ShaqT,
, Goodson, Pullard,
DB: H.Smith, Vaccaro, B.Jones, Neal, Adoree, K.Joseph, Geathers, M.Maye, J.Jones, D Thompson

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Re: Why isnt Jordan Howard a consensus 1st round pick?

Postby alphaxray » Mon Dec 05, 2016 11:18 am

Coogan Football wrote:
alphaxray wrote:
pokerface40 wrote:I took Perkins and Keith Marshall over him at 2.07 and 2.08, doh.
Which allowed me to draft him @ 2.10!
If he fell all the way to 2.10 than Pokerface wasn't the only one that whiffed on Howard.

I took him at 2.02 and was thrilled that he fell to me there at the time. I unsuccessfully tried trading up to 1.10 to snag him, luckily it all worked out for me.
It's a Superflex league so the QBs pushed him down a bit.

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Re: What are we waiting for on Jordan Howard?

Postby Jfever » Mon Dec 05, 2016 11:23 am

Lacy? CJA? J.Hill? L.Murray? C.Hyde, Ryan Matthews? Heck, it's a long list of rb disappointment. I'd go so far as to say it is the norm.

I guess the real point here is that some readers of this forum were late to the party. Some, haven't got to the party yet. Some were at the door of the party but didn't go in cuz they had second thoughts.

Anyway, The out look on him was positive early on and his situation was better than most thought. We are not talking about a UDFA here. Langford wasn't what some wanted him to be. Howard's running style was viewed as a strength and it was said he was one of the two most natural runners in his draft class along with Zeke. And, after being drafted, he was said to be the best runner on his team. Yet, many missed completely. And, even after 6 plus games played, some still doubted. Some frequent posters here, even after Howard had multiple games of production under hi belt, were still ranking TWO Atlanta rb in front of him, to go along with L.Miller, J.Ajayi, C.Hyde, J.Hill. I mean what in the world are we basing our rankings on? To each their own. But, wowzers! Sure, Some of it is stumbling on luck during our rookie drafts, some of it is preparation, scouting, draft style and philosophy, and foresight.
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* Reality (as defined by Webster's dictionary) - A word for things as they actually exist, as opposed to an idealistic or notional ideal of them.

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Re: What are we waiting for on Jordan Howard?

Postby maxhyde » Mon Dec 05, 2016 12:44 pm

JFever wrote:Lacy? CJA? J.Hill? L.Murray? C.Hyde, Ryan Matthews? Heck, it's a long list of rb disappointment. I'd go so far as to say it is the norm.

I guess the real point here is that some readers of this forum were late to the party. Some, haven't got to the party yet. Some were at the door of the party but didn't go in cuz they had second thoughts.

Anyway, The out look on him was positive early on and his situation was better than most thought. We are not talking about a UDFA here. Langford wasn't what some wanted him to be. Howard's running style was viewed as a strength and it was said he was one of the two most natural runners in his draft class along with Zeke. And, after being drafted, he was said to be the best runner on his team. Yet, many missed completely. And, even after 6 plus games played, some still doubted. Some frequent posters here, even after Howard had multiple games of production under hi belt, were still ranking TWO Atlanta rb in front of him, to go along with L.Miller, J.Ajayi, C.Hyde, J.Hill. I mean what in the world are we basing our rankings on? To each their own. But, wowzers! Sure, Some of it is stumbling on luck during our rookie drafts, some of it is preparation, scouting, draft style and philosophy, and foresight.
Murray has been somewhat surprisingly good I think for most. Hyde has actually been good and the rest of that list hasn't disappointed me at all but we all have our favorites. Hill's past couple weeks have been disappointing with Gio on IR
However as an exercise go ahead and feel free to compare/contrast Jeremy Hill's rookie season to Howard's.
Then explain again to me why exercising caution on Howard's value rocketing into premium pick range is a bad idea after you basically said Hill is not good 2X above? Jeremy Hill was drafted roughly the same place (early-late 2nd) in my leagues as Howard for the most part.

Rankings? Who spends time worrying about player rankings as the playoffs begin? Rankings are a fun past-time for the off-season as are maybe a good general overview on value for new dynasty owners I think. I sometimes look when I am referred to them in some "can't refuse offer" by an owner that points out the "rankings"/ADP. Good owners take advantage of poor rankings to swindle less informed owners and that is about all they are good for in my experience.
I play for my entertainment not to follow a crowd.

Anyway I am not trying to be an bleep about it just seems like there is a slight over-exuberance concerning Howard imo. I liked him about 4-6th best in this class and still not much has changed but he has outproduced all but Elliott...opportunity is still king which is news to no one for RB's
DLF HOF League 16 team PPR
QB: Brees, Bradford, Lock(3.07)
RB: David Johnson, Penny, Sanders(1.07), Montgomery(1.06), Love(2.07) Bernard, MLynch, Morris, TJLogan, Joe Williams, Shaun Wilson
WR: Jeffery,Cooper, Josh Gordon, Dede Westbrook, Cam Meredith, Brice Butler, Chester Rogers, Lockett, Switzer, Malone, Cain (IR)
TE: Gronk, Swaim, Maxx Williams


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