Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Given the increase in popularity for SF and 2QB leagues, this forum is intended for topics relating to these formats.
UrbanYeti
Combine Attendee
Combine Attendee
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2018 10:51 am

Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby UrbanYeti » Fri Jul 06, 2018 5:54 am

Hello all! Usual lurker, first time forum poster.

I'm relatively new to SF (& Dynasty in general) and I had a startup begin earlier this week. I was hoping to get some veteran viewpoints on how this is playing out. I know you have to read and react to the draft, but it felt like most of the guys were treating it like a redraft league and the QB's kept falling. Most of the guys that I would consider drafting at, or near, ADP were gone in most of the rounds. So I just kept trading back and getting '19 1sts. At some point, I thought the value was too good not to start taking a QB. Then another... and another. Basically I ended up with with Luck, Jimmy G, Mariota, and Jameis in rounds 4 & 5. Currently through the 7th round, my only skill guys are Dalvin Cook & Ronald Jones. This led to a group discussion in our league chat on drafting philosophies and I'm either way off or the other owners are. Through 7 rounds, there are multiple teams without a QB & are looking at hoping guys like Josh McCown keep the job for a significant portion of the season. I never try to draft with the purpose of trading, but I think I'll have plenty of offers for any one of my QBs where I can recoup some of that lack of RB/WR depth I guess I'm just looking for general thoughts on hoarding more QB's than necessary in a SF if everyone else waits, or does this hurt your RB/WR groups too much, given that all the other teams loaded up at those positions while I was grabbing the QBs?

Thanks!

User avatar
BucFanJKE
Captain
Captain
Posts: 821
Joined: Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:52 pm

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby BucFanJKE » Fri Jul 06, 2018 7:49 am

If it's an active league, I wouldn't worry about not having the skill guys, because you can trade a QB for a guy drafted way ahead of him in the startup when people realize how bad their qbs are. My opinions on startup drafts are draft the guys that hold the most value and worry about positions later. That is why trading exists. But don't just take bad qbs over good skill guys because you want to horde.

Hopefully that helps.
Team 1-
SF .5 PPR TE Prem (1Q, 1SF, 2R, 2W, 1T, 3WRT)
QB- Watson, Dak, Richardson, Bennett, Zappe
RB- Javonte Williams, JHill, Dobbins, Achane, Gibson, Bigsby, Spears, Gainwell, Fournette, CPatt
WR- Chase, Lamb, London, Pittman, MT, QJ, Bateman, Jamo, OBJ, Skyy
TE- Freiermuth, Kincaid, Chig, Fant, Musgrave, Woods, Bellinger
2024: 1st, 2nd, 4th

Team 2-
.5 PPR TE Prem (1Q, 2 R, 3W, 1 T, 3 WRT)
QB: J. Allen, Kyler, Stroud
RB: CMC, Bijan, Gibbs, JT, Breece Hall, Kamara, Gibson, 4nette
WR: Diggs, Hill, AJB, Aiyuk, London, JSN, Hollywood, M.Mims, Meyers, Shaheed
TE: Kelce, Kyle Pitts, Dulcich, Logan Thomas
2024: 2 1st (one top 3), 4th

Team 3- (Adopted Dumpster Orphan)
.5 PPR TE Prem (1Q, 2 R, 3W, 1 T, 3 WRT)
QB: J. Allen, Dak, Young
RB: Gibbs, Hall, J. Cook, Warren, Bigsby, K. Mitchell, Dobbins, D. Cook,
WR: Lamb, Wilson, Olave, Higgins, London, JSN, Bateman, Wan'Dale, Z. Jones, Hyatt
TE: Kittle, Kincaid, Woods, Likely
2024: 2 1st (one top 2), 3rd, 4th

User avatar
WhatWouldDitkaDo
GOAT
GOAT
Posts: 14721
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2014 11:02 am

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby WhatWouldDitkaDo » Fri Jul 06, 2018 7:56 am

It might take a season for the owners not familiar with superflex to understand how valuable QBs are. I'd just hold your QB depth until owners get desperate and start paying what they're worth.
Kittles Pox | Championships: 2015, 2017
12-Team PPR | QB, 2RB, 2WR, TE, W/R/T, K, DST
QB: Kyler Murray, Aaron Rodgers
RB: Christian McCaffrey, Melvin Gordon, James Conner, Phillip Lindsay, Tevin Coleman, Boston Scott, Benny Snell Jr.
WR: Tyreek Hill, Mike Evans, Cooper Kupp, Michael Gallup, Christian Kirk
TE: George Kittle, Travis Kelce | K: Younghoe Koo | DST: SF
PS: Mecole Hardman, Tony Pollard | 2020 Picks: 1.09, 2.10, 3.03 | 2021 Picks: 1st, 2nd

User avatar
Servo
All Pro
All Pro
Posts: 1934
Joined: Tue Sep 29, 2015 4:17 pm

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby Servo » Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:32 am

You cannot overstate the value of QBs in these leagues, let's just put it into perspective.

Over the years in our league, you see people scouring the waiver wire for QBs all the time...and rarely do they actually work out to be a long-term solution. Granted, some guys turn out to be solid for a season or two: McCown, Hoyer, Fitzpatrick, Tyrod but how many bums do you come across that you roster and hope they perform?

- Ryan Mallett
- Blaine Gabbert
- Matt Moore
- Derek Anderson
- Mike Glennon
- Matt Barkley
- Siemian
etc. etc.

I swear, Case Keenum was owned by probably every owner in our league at least once and sure 2017 paid major dividends and he could possibly have a bright future in the league but that kinda stuff just doesn't happen often. What am I getting at? If you don't have stability at the position, you're going to find yourself trading the farm for one or plugging-in and playing a lot of crappy QBs to fill a void....when the guy with Rodgers and Stafford are probably competitors on an annual basis.

UrbanYeti
Combine Attendee
Combine Attendee
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2018 10:51 am

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby UrbanYeti » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:05 am

Thanks for all of the responses! Definitely made me feel better about my decisions. I'm glad the research (articles/podcasts/& these forums) I've done allowed me to see others mistakes. Like I said, I'm not very experienced in SF or dynasty, but I was able to trade back enough that I'm stocked on '19 firsts that should give me enough ammo to go get the RB/WR's that I wanted. Appreciate all of the feedback!

tom14cat14
Captain
Captain
Posts: 874
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:46 am

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby tom14cat14 » Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:55 pm

In regards to your 19 picks and taking QB's. It might really work out in your favor to hold those. As others have said they might not pay full price until later in the season and you might be out of it for this year. But if you are able to sell some for top assets at other position plus have all the picks to use/sell next off season you could end up with a team that everyone on here asks, "Why cant I be in a league like that?"

Good job on researching, I can tell you my first SF I did as co-owners with a buddy and we grossly underestimated the importance of QB's. We have our fingers crossed that Mitch becomes a good QB this year.

User avatar
moishetreats
Legend
Legend
Posts: 6521
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:37 pm
Contact:

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby moishetreats » Sun Jul 08, 2018 4:35 am

In general, if the value is there in the startup, take the player.

And the value is almost always there with the QB. I did the same thing in my inaugural draft for Team 1 in sig. By mid-season, I was trading QB2s for WR1s and 2QBs for Rodgers just because of supply and demand. And I still had the depth to have three starters all the way through.
10 tms 27 plrs PPR
Start: 2QB 2RB 3WR 2TE 2Flex / best ball

QB: Herbert, Love, Rodgers, G Smith, Stidham, T Taylor, Hall
RB: McCaffrey, Mixon, Pacheco, Montgomery, Z White, Allgeier, Dillon
WR: Hill, St. Brown, Kupp, Allen, Lockett, B Johnson
TE: Kelce, Kmet, Kraft, Okonkwo, Dulcich, Tremble

2024: 2.09, 3.07, 3.08, 3.10, 4.08
2025: 2nd (x2), 4th, 5th (x2)
2026: 1st, 2nd (x2), 3rd, 4th, 5th



12 tms 22 active plyrs. Salary Cap $300 PPR
Start: 1QB 2RB 3WR 1TE 1SF 1Flex / best ball

QB: Lawrence (contract through 2026), Love ('24), Rodgers ('24), Stidham ('25), Lock ('25)
RB: Bijan Robinson ('25), Pollard ('27), Dillon ('24), Rodriguez ('24), Spiller ('24)
WR: G Wilson ('26), AJ Brown ('26), DJ Montgomery ('25)
TE: --
2024 Cap Spent: $186

IR: --
TAXI SQUAD (4 max): --

User avatar
skip
GOAT
GOAT
Posts: 18732
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 1:35 pm

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby skip » Sun Jul 08, 2018 9:57 am

Your strategy is very sound and it seems the rest of your league is catching on to the problem they now face. You're going to end up in a much better position with more valuable assets to be able to trade into a better roster than just drafting toward a starting lineup. It's a commonplace mistake, not just in superflex leagues.
If you can't leave at least a 20% tip, you can't afford to eat out.

dhanks91
Pro Bowler
Pro Bowler
Posts: 1041
Joined: Thu Mar 12, 2015 5:08 pm

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby dhanks91 » Mon Jul 09, 2018 5:58 pm

I like the luck pick. If he plays well I figure he will regain his pre injury value. Just started my SF start up and I’m going to load up on qbs aswell, went Wilson at 1.03

ImaRounder
Pro Bowler
Pro Bowler
Posts: 1296
Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2016 11:52 pm

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby ImaRounder » Tue Jul 17, 2018 5:57 am

I feel like im going to be in this exact situation in an ongoing draft. Took Gurley at 1.01 then at the 2.12 3.01 turn, russell wilson and carson wentz were there.

User avatar
Tsunami
All Pro
All Pro
Posts: 1721
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 12:46 am

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby Tsunami » Mon Jul 23, 2018 6:51 pm

I did something like this in a startup a couple years ago. Everybody was laughing at me and they were conspiring not to trade with me. I wanted to compete so I sold too early for the value of my picks rather than waiting for the QB value to go up to where I thought it would. If I had held a bit longer it would have gone better I think.

sloth8u
Degenerate
Degenerate
Posts: 8586
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2012 1:18 pm

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby sloth8u » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:02 pm

This ultimately comes down to how your leaguemates want to value your qbs. Your only starting 2. Its not like you get a bonus for having 7.

I've seen this work, and I've also seen a few owners bitch year after year because noone will trade for their qbs. I'd think it helps that you have the future picks.... But you can certainly miss on draft picks. I'd likely try to buy proven players with those picks when the time is right.

Miah35
Captain
Captain
Posts: 881
Joined: Wed Jan 29, 2014 8:37 am

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby Miah35 » Tue Jul 24, 2018 8:53 am

I punt QB in all formats. I'll gladly ride into the season with Eli and Brees and be stacked at RB and WR. It's a lot easier to trade for a QB or pick one up off of waivers during the season.
Entering my 10th Year of Dynasty.

I believe Every Player has Two Values:

1. The Price it would take for you to SELL a Player
2. The Price you would PAY to acquire a Player

YOU create your own market

User avatar
skip
GOAT
GOAT
Posts: 18732
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 1:35 pm

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby skip » Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:45 am

sloth8u wrote: Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:02 pm I've also seen a few owners bitch year after year because noone will trade for their qbs.
With the reverse being true...the owners without them complaining they are unable to get them because the owners want "too much". The mentality being that the other owner has the depth to make the move, so somehow they should be willing to sell them off. Owners struggling to get 2 startable QBs in a SF or 2QB format are the bottom feeders of the leagues year after year. It is the most difficult position to acquire after the draft.
If you can't leave at least a 20% tip, you can't afford to eat out.

sloth8u
Degenerate
Degenerate
Posts: 8586
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2012 1:18 pm

Re: Startup Draft QB Hoarding

Postby sloth8u » Wed Jul 25, 2018 7:07 am

skip wrote: Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:45 am
sloth8u wrote: Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:02 pm I've also seen a few owners bitch year after year because noone will trade for their qbs.
With the reverse being true...the owners without them complaining they are unable to get them because the owners want "too much". The mentality being that the other owner has the depth to make the move, so somehow they should be willing to sell them off. Owners struggling to get 2 startable QBs in a SF or 2QB format are the bottom feeders of the leagues year after year. It is the most difficult position to acquire after the draft.
im not disagreeing about the importance of qb. just wanted to bring up that its very possible that you can own a boatload of them and if your leaguemates dont put a premium on them (and you do)....they are sitting on your bench. ive seen it work both ways is all im getting at.

from my personal experience, the start up/1st year goes a long ways here. if they dont value it from the start....i wouldnt expect them to in the next few years. maybe its just my leagues? but most of the time....guys are either balls to the wall right off the get go, or the league as a whole tends to go with the "be patient and see what happens" approach for the first few years. my guess is, that our op is going to see something similar. he's either going to get "strong" offers for his qb's or his leaguemates will take the wait and see approach.

as mentioned in a previous post, he's going to have to make some decisions on where he values his guys. fortunately for him here.... he has presumably 4 franchise guys right now. i dont know that 4 constitutes hoarding though....id think that if he were to keep going with qb's...we'd have a hoarding situation....which brings us back to the point i was trying to bring up about how his leaguemates view the position. for example, maybe instead of trading for big ben or brady....they are drafting rudolph and etling....you get the idea.


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests