2nd tier of rookie WR

[Butt Liqueur]

I'd like to ask Lee haters 2 questions:

1. Is it solely due to his poor final season? Cause, you know, injuries. Keenan Allen says hi.
2. If the answer is no, does this mean you were also a Lee hater last year when he was the #1 WR prospect?

I have no horse in this race, just curious.

I am, by no means, a Lee hater, but he left a lot on the table in his final season. I've gone into this more times than I'd care to discuss, but he had a very hard time catching last season. He wasn't anywhere close to being the same player he was the year before and I just wasn't that impressed with what I saw from him. Keenan Allen and Marqise Lee are completely different types of players (obviously), but even when he was on the field last season, Lee didn't look too special

Not sure if you saw the bowl game but LEE is special. He is going go be a very good NFL player. I hope the guys in my league let him fall to me at 1.9 as I will be ecstatic. Lee > Allen.

I watched tape from multiple games last year. Lee dropped a lot of passes and made every catch look difficult. In terms of production, Allen missed games in his final year, but never really disappeared in the games he did play. The same can't be said for Lee. On the other side, Lee had much bigger "big" games than Allen. Some people love Lee, some people hate him, and some people are in the middle. I'm in the third group. Time will tell who is right on him, but right now, there are 5 guys at WR I'd rather have

[zounder]

but even when he was on the field last season, Lee didn't look too special

Allen missed games in his final year, but never really disappeared in the games he did play. The same can't be said for Lee.

Is it possible Lee was just playing through an injury whereas Allen was more healthy for the games he did play?

Basically, what do you think is more likely: That Lee's talent suddenly vanished or that he was playing through an injury? Unless you claim he was still bad on film his first two years.

[BwK]

but even when he was on the field last season, Lee didn't look too special

Allen missed games in his final year, but never really disappeared in the games he did play. The same can't be said for Lee.

Is it possible Lee was just playing through an injury whereas Allen was more healthy for the games he did play?

Basically, what do you think is more likely: That Lee's talent suddenly vanished or that he was playing through an injury? Unless you claim he was still bad on film his first two years.

I remember LEE got dinged up early in the LV Bowl. I think it was his ankle. Later in the game he torched the secondary for a TD and you can see him limping afterward. He is a tough kid and played through injuries. Lee had two coaches,two QBs and a defense schemed to stop him every week. He still had a decent season. He is still the second best WR in this class in my opinion no matter what he put on tape last season.

[Butt Liqueur]

but even when he was on the field last season, Lee didn't look too special

Allen missed games in his final year, but never really disappeared in the games he did play. The same can't be said for Lee.

Is it possible Lee was just playing through an injury whereas Allen was more healthy for the games he did play?

Basically, what do you think is more likely: That Lee's talent suddenly vanished or that he was playing through an injury? Unless you claim he was still bad on film his first two years.

I remember LEE got dinged up early in the LV Bowl. I think it was his ankle. Later in the game he torched the secondary for a TD and you can see him limping afterward. He is a tough kid and played through injuries. Lee had two coaches,two QBs and a defense schemed to stop him every week. He still had a decent season. He is still the second best WR in this class in my opinion no matter what he put on tape last season.

Exactly my point. In my opinion, there are 5 or 6 guys I like more than him. I don't think either of us is wrong, we just have differing opinions on the guy

Could Lee have been playing through injury? Sure. But that doesn't mean I have to be in love with him

[heydangle]

"OBJ- I want to find reasons to move him down my list. I like the bigger, stronger, faster mold of a WR but when I research the rest of the field and I come back to OBJ I think hes the better prospect. To me he clearly is an open field play maker. He finds the highest pt of the ball and goes and gets it. He appears to be a great route runner. I wish he was taller but if he lands in a good spot he most likely stays here for me.
My ideal landing spot: KC or Miami"

I have similar feelings. I want to like Matthews or Allen Robinson more, but I just haven't been able to yet.

[KingsKing]

"OBJ- I want to find reasons to move him down my list. I like the bigger, stronger, faster mold of a WR but when I research the rest of the field and I come back to OBJ I think hes the better prospect. To me he clearly is an open field play maker. He finds the highest pt of the ball and goes and gets it. He appears to be a great route runner. I wish he was taller but if he lands in a good spot he most likely stays here for me.
My ideal landing spot: KC or Miami"

I have similar feelings. I want to like Matthews or Allen Robinson more, but I just haven't been able to yet.

I lik OBJ too but I think KC and Miami are terrible landing spots for him, in KC noodle arm Smith doesn't take chances with the ball and wont throw more than 5 yards down the field unless they are behind late in a game, in Miami Tannehill showed last year he can't throw the deep ball, Missed Wallace wide open down the field all season, plus he would have to contend with Hartline,Wallace,Clay etc

[BwK]

"OBJ- I want to find reasons to move him down my list. I like the bigger, stronger, faster mold of a WR but when I research the rest of the field and I come back to OBJ I think hes the better prospect. To me he clearly is an open field play maker. He finds the highest pt of the ball and goes and gets it. He appears to be a great route runner. I wish he was taller but if he lands in a good spot he most likely stays here for me.
My ideal landing spot: KC or Miami"

I have similar feelings. I want to like Matthews or Allen Robinson more, but I just haven't been able to yet.

I lik OBJ too but I think KC and Miami are terrible landing spots for him, in KC noodle arm Smith doesn't take chances with the ball and wont throw more than 5 yards down the field unless they are behind late in a game, in Miami Tannehill showed last year he can't throw the deep ball, Missed Wallace wide open down the field all season, plus he would have to contend with Hartline,Wallace,Clay etc

I don't envision OBJ as the major deep threat for his team. I can see him as a welker type working the middle of the field and the open zones. I think with Bowe working the number#1 db with the LB watching charles out of the backfield will open things up for OBJ. As for miami I envision Wallace taking the top off the def and OBJ eating up the middle of the field. Thats how I see him. Welker or a better eddie royal...if lucky he could emerge as a steve smith(balt) clone.

[KingsKing]

"OBJ- I want to find reasons to move him down my list. I like the bigger, stronger, faster mold of a WR but when I research the rest of the field and I come back to OBJ I think hes the better prospect. To me he clearly is an open field play maker. He finds the highest pt of the ball and goes and gets it. He appears to be a great route runner. I wish he was taller but if he lands in a good spot he most likely stays here for me.
My ideal landing spot: KC or Miami"

I have similar feelings. I want to like Matthews or Allen Robinson more, but I just haven't been able to yet.

I lik OBJ too but I think KC and Miami are terrible landing spots for him, in KC noodle arm Smith doesn't take chances with the ball and wont throw more than 5 yards down the field unless they are behind late in a game, in Miami Tannehill showed last year he can't throw the deep ball, Missed Wallace wide open down the field all season, plus he would have to contend with Hartline,Wallace,Clay etc

I don't envision OBJ as the major deep threat for his team. I can see him as a welker type working the middle of the field and the open zones. I think with Bowe working the number#1 db with the LB watching charles out of the backfield will open things up for OBJ. As for miami I envision Wallace taking the top off the def and OBJ eating up the middle of the field. Thats how I see him. Welker or a better eddie royal...if lucky he could emerge as a steve smith(balt) clone.

I see what your saying but guys that run 4.30 40 yard dashes don't play underneath, they blow the top off and hit home runs.

[ABWchance]

Anyone have any thoughts on Michael Campanaro out of Wake Forest. I think he could be very valuable in say a 16 team deep dynasty league. He has very solid statistical output and reminds me of a Welker/Edelman/Cobb type. I think he could be a great grab in the 3rd or 4th round of your dyansty draft.

[Butt Liqueur]

Anyone have any thoughts on Michael Campanaro out of Wake Forest. I think he could be very valuable in say a 16 team deep dynasty league. He has very solid statistical output and reminds me of a Welker/Edelman/Cobb type. I think he could be a great grab in the 3rd or 4th round of your dyansty draft.

I don't know anything about the guy, but he has the same number of syllables in his first and last names as Danny Amendola...so, there's that!

[blindsquirrel]

Fascinating Draft Class.

Watkins and Evans are the clear top Tier.
However, after those two its a jumbled mess.
Everyone is going to have the receivers they like.
Many different styles.
My personal rankins for #3 on are:

Moncrief- amazing blend of size and speed (6'2" 221- great 2012 film, somewhat inconsistent but has great potential)
Robinson- nice size, has some trouble with press and physical play. Elusive for his size after the catch.
Latimer- Solid, productive, very underrated IMO. (6'3" 215, 4.44 40)
Matthews- as above for Latimer
Martavis Bryant- raw but great size speed combo- Justin Hunter like
Lee- solid, unspectacular, undersized
OBJ
Cooks
Adams

I personally like the bigger WRs who have the potential to be WR1's on a NFL team and who have the skill to run the entire route tree.

[dlf_jules]

When I scouted AJ Green he only went over 100 yds like 5 times in 3 yrs against mostly nobodies like arizona st. idaho state colorado vandy arkansas ... not very impressive for a guy who has cemented himself as top 5 in the NFL.

In his final season, AJG averaged

5.6 catches, 90.4 yards, 1.0 TDs against SEC competition
7.3 catches, 99.0 yards, 1.0 TDs against non-SEC competition

Beckham's averages:

4.5 catches, 72.9 yards, 0.25 TDs against SEC competition
5.25 catches, 133.5 yards, 1.5 TDs against non-SEC competition

Now, these are small sample sizes, so maybe you can write off Beckham's splits as noise. But it sure looks like his production benefited significantly from a few big plays against small schools.

[BwK]

When I scouted AJ Green he only went over 100 yds like 5 times in 3 yrs against mostly nobodies like arizona st. idaho state colorado vandy arkansas ... not very impressive for a guy who has cemented himself as top 5 in the NFL.

In his final season, AJG averaged

5.6 catches, 90.4 yards, 1.0 TDs against SEC competition
7.3 catches, 99.0 yards, 1.0 TDs against non-SEC competition

Beckham's averages:

4.5 catches, 72.9 yards, 0.25 TDs against SEC competition
5.25 catches, 133.5 yards, 1.5 TDs against non-SEC competition

Now, these are small sample sizes, so maybe you can write off Beckham's splits as noise. But it sure looks like his production benefited significantly from a few big plays against small schools.

Do you take into consideration that landry did better in opposite situations? It just looks to me like LSU took what the defenses gave them. If they game planned against OBJ then Landry went off and vice versa. Nothing new here. I was saying that AJ disnt light the sec on fire either so why are you expecting a second tier WR to do it? I never said OBJ was going to be a NFL #1 and perhaps only a few from this class ever get there. But to say because he didnt have his best games vs SEC is reason to avoid him I have to disagree. Those stats arent that far off to me, so if OBJ can ave those numbers and go off against lower competition in the NFL sign me up.I am not expecting the next AJ at pick 1.6 or later in dynasty drafts.

[dlf_jules]

There is no "lower competition" in the NFL. Virtually everyone he faces will be significantly better than the guys he saw in college.

That said, college production isn't everything, and OBJ is a 2nd tier prospect regardless of his production. Just something to keep in mind.

[BwK]

What are the current thoughts? Has lattimer jumped into the top 5 yet? Someone else out there catch your eye?

Who are you targeng after Watkins and Evans based on talent?